what is powergaming...
Moderator: Gamemasters
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Lotho Green
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Adano Eles
- Posts: 2436
- Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 2:48 pm
- Location: Eiris sazun idisi, sazun hera duoder...
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Grant Herion
- Posts: 1813
- Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2003 1:26 am
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Bloodhearte
- Posts: 1169
- Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2003 1:03 am
- Location: Yes please.
The player of Bloodhearte thinks...
Yes, I suppose that's true. He has come off as too rowdy, when he just wanted to be sophisticated. He'll try to keep a lower key when I want to act out his role.
I worship Moshran with my character, Adano, because it fits better with my preferences of plans. But thank you, because now I have more ideas regarding the library, and research of fallen gods.
I've actually never *intended* to kill. Everytime somebody attacks Bloodhearte or attempts to fight, he just runs away or hides in the shadows. But I hate doing this, because people call him weak and don't take his plans seriously. (Maybe that is because of my rowdiness too.)
But yeah, this chaos against him can stop. When he left for that trip, he was gone for about a whole month. When he came back, nobody attacked him, and they forgot about all that he's done a month ago.
I suppose I have to nominate a certain elven friend of his for the evil roleplaying, though he probably wants to remain anonymous. The #me hides behind a dark cloak thing only works for a select few players...others just say 'Ah Bloodhearte, you're not fooling anyone, it's you.'
Regarding the original subject of this post.
Darlok is correct when it comes to that idea...I suppose you 'can' be a master blacksmith from another land, but you can only roleplay it.
Let's say you're a dwarven blacksmith, but you're only ability is to make items that fit a certain kind of dwarves, though for nobody else on the island. It would take about a year to get used to. This is a good idea in my eyes. (The year that you can use to actually make ingame armor.)
Thanks for reminding me, Viola, I have to check my PMs now...sheesh, almost full.
Yes, I suppose that's true. He has come off as too rowdy, when he just wanted to be sophisticated. He'll try to keep a lower key when I want to act out his role.
I worship Moshran with my character, Adano, because it fits better with my preferences of plans. But thank you, because now I have more ideas regarding the library, and research of fallen gods.
I've actually never *intended* to kill. Everytime somebody attacks Bloodhearte or attempts to fight, he just runs away or hides in the shadows. But I hate doing this, because people call him weak and don't take his plans seriously. (Maybe that is because of my rowdiness too.)
But yeah, this chaos against him can stop. When he left for that trip, he was gone for about a whole month. When he came back, nobody attacked him, and they forgot about all that he's done a month ago.
I suppose I have to nominate a certain elven friend of his for the evil roleplaying, though he probably wants to remain anonymous. The #me hides behind a dark cloak thing only works for a select few players...others just say 'Ah Bloodhearte, you're not fooling anyone, it's you.'
Regarding the original subject of this post.
Darlok is correct when it comes to that idea...I suppose you 'can' be a master blacksmith from another land, but you can only roleplay it.
Let's say you're a dwarven blacksmith, but you're only ability is to make items that fit a certain kind of dwarves, though for nobody else on the island. It would take about a year to get used to. This is a good idea in my eyes. (The year that you can use to actually make ingame armor.)
Thanks for reminding me, Viola, I have to check my PMs now...sheesh, almost full.
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Mashan Da'hok
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Mon May 20, 2002 5:27 am
One of the things I find most un-appealing about attempting to play an 'evil' character is the lack of variety. There are very few 'evil' entities, or options. Another difficulty with being an 'evil' character is to not simply be annoying. Sure, you could just be a jerk to everyone you met, but then would people want to interact with you? I don't think so. Then there is the case of 'possesion'. I personally despise possesions, because it basicaly just has someone running about spouting insane things. Someone should make a list of evil, yet entertaining acts.
A lack of variety? More a lack of imagination.
First of all, "the evil" is always a subjective point of view. What seems evil to you may be normal and reasonable for another one. To cut a thief´s hand off is still usual in some countries and isn´t seen there as something bad. In our culture it is.
There are so many varietys to play an evil person in Illarion as there are in the real world. You may play a spy that earns it´s money by selling information about a guild to another guild. Or be a corrupt politician, smart but corrupt. Be a merchant that cheats it´s customers... Pretend to be a priest of the holy cucumber and rip off money of your followers... Find friends and tell them lies, not just stupid plain lies but well thought so others get involved... Raise "way taxes" if you are a strong group...
But just beeing plain evil doesn´t bring any fun. Which necromancer would tell the world that he wants to destroy it? Be silently evil as long as there are not many that think the same way as you do. Try out how people react before you show your true goals... and if you fail, blame it on one of your inferiors.
My 2 cents
First of all, "the evil" is always a subjective point of view. What seems evil to you may be normal and reasonable for another one. To cut a thief´s hand off is still usual in some countries and isn´t seen there as something bad. In our culture it is.
There are so many varietys to play an evil person in Illarion as there are in the real world. You may play a spy that earns it´s money by selling information about a guild to another guild. Or be a corrupt politician, smart but corrupt. Be a merchant that cheats it´s customers... Pretend to be a priest of the holy cucumber and rip off money of your followers... Find friends and tell them lies, not just stupid plain lies but well thought so others get involved... Raise "way taxes" if you are a strong group...
But just beeing plain evil doesn´t bring any fun. Which necromancer would tell the world that he wants to destroy it? Be silently evil as long as there are not many that think the same way as you do. Try out how people react before you show your true goals... and if you fail, blame it on one of your inferiors.
My 2 cents
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Grant Herion
- Posts: 1813
- Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2003 1:26 am
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Konstantin K
- Posts: 933
- Joined: Sat May 31, 2003 9:18 pm
- Location: Permanently Banned by Uber Powerful Mega-GMs, because he was BAD.
- Contact:
Evil, just like good, must be cool-headed, calm, modest, serious, and maybe even noble. Evil must be patient and be able to wait.
Anyway, where does a border lie betweem powergaming and normal, healthy regular training routines a warrior performs?
Anyway, where does a border lie betweem powergaming and normal, healthy regular training routines a warrior performs?
Last edited by Konstantin K on Tue Jul 22, 2003 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Davion Fuxa
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:26 am
Hi, I recently decided to join this game and have begun the process of getting an account.
I play other games too, but not as much anymore, last game is tibia, game before, runescape.
I consider training to be using your skills.
I consider powergaming to be using your skills in an excessive amount.
An excessive amount would be doing something all day with no breaks, if Illarion days take 3 rl hours to be complete, then working for more then training for more then an hour would be powergaming.
Think, in rl, a full time worker works 8 hours, that is 1 third of the day, same here, then the worker can either entertain himself, or sleep, and eat.
I belive the average person sleeps 8-10 hours, but lets say 8 hours, 1 hour that person would do nothing, maybe log out during this time, or roleplay that he was sleeping, wheter it be in a bed, on a grassy field or in a street gutter. The rest of the time, he might go to a bar, or if there is some other form of entertainment in this game, do that for 45 minuters, the other 15 minutes could be when the character eats meals and snacks.
Grant, if they train for 3 full hours no stop, (that's like me, 24/7, sorry, I'm a bad example of someone who REALLY has the willpower to look at a computer screen that long) Then it is truely powergaming.
That is if illarion days equal 3 RL hours.
I play other games too, but not as much anymore, last game is tibia, game before, runescape.
I consider training to be using your skills.
I consider powergaming to be using your skills in an excessive amount.
An excessive amount would be doing something all day with no breaks, if Illarion days take 3 rl hours to be complete, then working for more then training for more then an hour would be powergaming.
Think, in rl, a full time worker works 8 hours, that is 1 third of the day, same here, then the worker can either entertain himself, or sleep, and eat.
I belive the average person sleeps 8-10 hours, but lets say 8 hours, 1 hour that person would do nothing, maybe log out during this time, or roleplay that he was sleeping, wheter it be in a bed, on a grassy field or in a street gutter. The rest of the time, he might go to a bar, or if there is some other form of entertainment in this game, do that for 45 minuters, the other 15 minutes could be when the character eats meals and snacks.
Grant, if they train for 3 full hours no stop, (that's like me, 24/7, sorry, I'm a bad example of someone who REALLY has the willpower to look at a computer screen that long) Then it is truely powergaming.
That is if illarion days equal 3 RL hours.
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Pronon Palmsuger
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Wed May 28, 2003 4:42 am
Evil as with good comes with Role play, and role play of the others around you. And there is no one point in determineing Roleplay. your Job detrimnes some of it, your Race is another big factor, People youve met. Take Pronon for example, Hes an Halfing fisherman whos pretty ignorant to the world around him. If some "catpures" him like say Kincent maybe. (no offence Kincent) although Pronon Could fight and have a standing chance, that doesnt mean he should. I should roleplay it out, yell for help, Struggle but not immeaditly attack.
Or if someone stole from From Pronon I would yell theif, maybe try and chase him a little, but Pronon, being an ignorant, Halfling fisherman Mainly rellys on others due to his "weakness" . and maybe for a real day or two if I see his number Ill say I recegnize him and call him a thief. But after that, altough I still know who he is. Pronon Has forgotten. and the theif is just another face in the crowd.
Or if someone stole from From Pronon I would yell theif, maybe try and chase him a little, but Pronon, being an ignorant, Halfling fisherman Mainly rellys on others due to his "weakness" . and maybe for a real day or two if I see his number Ill say I recegnize him and call him a thief. But after that, altough I still know who he is. Pronon Has forgotten. and the theif is just another face in the crowd.
Powergaming
Greetings from a humble dwarf !
I come here hoping optimistically that this will be the role playing game I have looked for and not just another slash and bash. I have only been reading this forum for a week or so, so my apologies if someone has already covered what I say here.
Powergamers / mining, smithing and fighting for hours just to raise
your level is boring, not realistic, not roleplaying.
A possible solution would be to put a limit on the amount of experience you can gain in a time period. make it possible to max out in 30 mins or so leaving the rest of the day for earning a living and general roleplaying. If players want to train magic and defence then give them a training area. it's not a problem as long as everyone gets an equal chance.
It will also persuade players to play every day so they don't let their
skills slide. I am sure someone must have suggested this before.
meanwhile I shall continue to wait patiently,but eagerly for an account.
I come here hoping optimistically that this will be the role playing game I have looked for and not just another slash and bash. I have only been reading this forum for a week or so, so my apologies if someone has already covered what I say here.
Powergamers / mining, smithing and fighting for hours just to raise
your level is boring, not realistic, not roleplaying.
A possible solution would be to put a limit on the amount of experience you can gain in a time period. make it possible to max out in 30 mins or so leaving the rest of the day for earning a living and general roleplaying. If players want to train magic and defence then give them a training area. it's not a problem as long as everyone gets an equal chance.
It will also persuade players to play every day so they don't let their
skills slide. I am sure someone must have suggested this before.
meanwhile I shall continue to wait patiently,but eagerly for an account.
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Grant Herion
- Posts: 1813
- Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2003 1:26 am
All it would take to clear up powergaming once and for all would be a rest requirement. If you're out working in the fields all day as a farmer, you start to get tired, your character moves more slowly, etc... If you don't stop, he passes out for a few minutes and gets sick.
If you're out training on the edge of civilization by going and killing hordes of undead, you better notice when you start to get tired, because if you pass out for a few minutes in the middle of a fight, you're dead.
If you keep pushing yourself like this every time you sign on, just doing one thing over and over, your muscle gets hurt because you overextended it.
That sort of thing-.^
If you're having a spell cast on you over and over again, but you aren't casting back your body weakens because you're gathering too much magic in your system or something. The more magic you gather, the sicker your character gets.
If someone keeps attacking you, even if it's only doing minor, minor damage, the more attacks they do consecutively do more damage because you haven't recovered at all from the prior attack. Basically, if you're standing still and not moving around while you're taking an attack, you get hurt worse because your muscles tighten, etc..
If you keep crafting some small peice of furniture, eventually your tools break, and if you don't give yourself a rest you get sloppy and stop improving.
Same thing for smithing, etc..
The only things I can think of that wouldn't have anything like that would be fishing and other relaxing things like that, which would be used to raise your rested level-.^
Also, food being required would help. If you are out training night and day, without eating, you starve yourself to death, and die. End of story. You resurect somewhere else, then you eat something so you aren't starving to death anymore.
If you're too hungry your character's stats drop.
If you're too tired your character's stats drop.
You do one thing too much you might hurt yourself in addition to getting tired.
You don't respond to something someone does and you let them keep doing it, you get hurt.
I'm pretty sure these changes would drasically reduce powergaming, as well as promote RP that follows a more realistic trend. Your talking to a nice person and your character's getting hungry, you ask them if they'd care to join you in the pub for some food. That sort of thing-.^
If you're out training on the edge of civilization by going and killing hordes of undead, you better notice when you start to get tired, because if you pass out for a few minutes in the middle of a fight, you're dead.
If you keep pushing yourself like this every time you sign on, just doing one thing over and over, your muscle gets hurt because you overextended it.
That sort of thing-.^
If you're having a spell cast on you over and over again, but you aren't casting back your body weakens because you're gathering too much magic in your system or something. The more magic you gather, the sicker your character gets.
If someone keeps attacking you, even if it's only doing minor, minor damage, the more attacks they do consecutively do more damage because you haven't recovered at all from the prior attack. Basically, if you're standing still and not moving around while you're taking an attack, you get hurt worse because your muscles tighten, etc..
If you keep crafting some small peice of furniture, eventually your tools break, and if you don't give yourself a rest you get sloppy and stop improving.
Same thing for smithing, etc..
The only things I can think of that wouldn't have anything like that would be fishing and other relaxing things like that, which would be used to raise your rested level-.^
Also, food being required would help. If you are out training night and day, without eating, you starve yourself to death, and die. End of story. You resurect somewhere else, then you eat something so you aren't starving to death anymore.
If you're too hungry your character's stats drop.
If you're too tired your character's stats drop.
You do one thing too much you might hurt yourself in addition to getting tired.
You don't respond to something someone does and you let them keep doing it, you get hurt.
I'm pretty sure these changes would drasically reduce powergaming, as well as promote RP that follows a more realistic trend. Your talking to a nice person and your character's getting hungry, you ask them if they'd care to join you in the pub for some food. That sort of thing-.^