Felder & Wälder

[GolfLima]

Felder

In letzter Zeit ist auf einigen Feldern zu beobachten, daß permanent Weizen auf dem gesamten Feld stehen bleibt und so vor sich hin wächst & vergeht.
Das mag für die, die Weizen benötigen recht nett sein.
Für mich, der ab und zu auch einmal etwas Anderes anbauen will ist es eher hinderlich. Immer muß ich einerseits eine Sense mitschleppen und dann das Feld erst einmal abmähen, andererseits habe ich dann einen Haufen Getreide mit dem ich nichts anzufangen weis & den ich auch nicht wirklich gebrauchen kann. Natürlich kann ich das gesamte Zeug nach dem ernten einfach "verrotten" lassen, das ist aber auch nicht unbedingt sinnvoll.
(für die, die keinen Samen mitschleppen wollen: -> laßt am Rand einfach 2 Felder mit Getreide stehen - das dürfte genug Samen ergeben um nach einmaligen Anbau ein Feld mit Getreide bestellen zu können)

Wälder

Weiterhin werden in letzter Zeit "undurchdringliche" Obstwälder angelegt. Das mag für Schreiner und Bäcker recht nett sein, aber
normalerweise könnten Bäume so gar nicht wachsen und Früchte tragen (jedenfalls in der Realität) &
Kräuter, die dort zufällig wachsen können n icht gesehen werden (manches Andere sicher auch nicht)
vielleicht kann man ja diese "Obsthaine" ein wenig sonniger & offener gestalten. Würde mir jedenfalls besser gefallen.

[Achae Eanstray]

My translation is not the best so apologize ahead of time , however I think the VBU will solve hopefully some of the crafting problems and if not... changes can easily be corrected after that unlike now. Perhaps suggestions can wait until we see what those changes will eventually be?

[Adronfront]

Wälder

Weiterhin werden in letzter Zeit "undurchdringliche" Obstwälder angelegt. Das mag für Schreiner und Bäcker recht nett sein, aber
normalerweise könnten Bäume so gar nicht wachsen und Früchte tragen (jedenfalls in der Realität) &
Kräuter, die dort zufällig wachsen können n icht gesehen werden (manches Andere sicher auch nicht)
vielleicht kann man ja diese "Obsthaine" ein wenig sonniger & offener gestalten. Würde mir jedenfalls besser gefallen.

http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... 46#p659646

[Achae Eanstray]

http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... 46#p659646

Thanks, translation was REALLY off on that one

[Estralis Seborian]

Please report "unnatural" forests like this:

-Say "show position"
-Note the coordinates
-!gm Unnatural forest at: <x> <y> <z> Please thin out this forest (or something similar).

GMs can help with the situation!

[Estralis Seborian]

See latest news.

[Golwenor]

I do not really want to complain, but is this the best way of action, if someone feels annoyed by the forests of trees he might just get an ax and a shovel and dig out the roots of the trees or find the person who does this.
Is it really such an good idea to punish everyone for the misdoings of a few or maybe only one person?

[Caldarion]

Regarding the news post: "massive abuse....freedom also means responsibility. Since some players cannot handle this responsibility..."
This seems overly harsh to me.

Do you think players plant trees to harm anyone, or to destroy anyone's gaming experience?

Unnatural forests...aren't all forests in Illa unnatural?
I cannot see the problem here.

vielleicht kann man ja diese "Obsthaine" ein wenig sonniger & offener gestalten. Würde mir jedenfalls besser gefallen.
((Probably one could arrange the orchards a bit more sunny and not so close-packed. I would like that more.))

It's a shame that a simple and valid request has to be pushed to that extent.

Regardning the other topic in the thread...How will the grain planting be handled?

Regards,
a player

[GolfLima]

es war nie meine Absicht Irgendjemand zu beleidigen oder zu ärgern

never was my intention to harm someone ... (was only for the atmosphere of the game)

[Zot]

Regarding the news post: "massive abuse....freedom also means responsibility. Since some players cannot handle this responsibility..."
This seems overly harsh to me.

It isn't.

Do you think players plant trees to harm anyone, or to destroy anyone's gaming experience?

Yes, there were/are players who block areas with trees so other players can't reach them or are stuck in this areas. Or like mentioned in this thread, you can't see herbs, or maybe even monsters which are there.
As a sidenote, this post wasn't the only reason we removed this feature.

Unnatural forests...aren't all forests in Illa unnatural?

No, at least most of them. However an 'unnatural forest' is a place full of trees where you can't see a thing anymore.

As for the grain planting, you can report them as well and we will try to remove them as soon as possible.

Zot

[Caynwyn]

It is disconcerting that other players have to suffer and ALSO be punished for the one or two that use the game mechanics to irritate others. It is not just the planting skill... but there are places now missing trees that were there before i.e. the harbor (which this char has usually made sure had plenty of apple trees and occasionally added to her planting skill in the process ), quite a few trees are now missing at the Union also and not sure where else. I am assuming no planting means a lumberjack can no longer replace trees either.

[Estralis Seborian]

One should note that nobody gets punished for the abuse of the feature. It was a feature that was offered to the players, abused and deactivated because the harm to the game oustands the benefit for the game beyond a reasonable extend. It is the same with wildfires: They were a feature, did no good for the game, were abused frequently by players and consequently deactivated. Both features have one thing in common: They ultimately change the map for everyone. And as long as we have too many players that cannot handle such a responsibility, we cannot continue such features.

I'd like to add that planting of trees would have been removed with the VBU anyway. The decision for this had nothing to do with the recent events. The massive abuse we faced recently just made us conduct the change before the VBU.

[rakust dorenstkzul]

I actually know who planted all the trees, i could rat them out.


for a price

[Golwenor]

Now whats with all the lumberjacks, unlike every other craft we do not have unlimited regenerating ressources, a tree dies and that tree is gone forever.

[Zot]

New trees will be added by GM's if necessary.

P.S. Lumberjacks have survived the past years pretty good without this unatural forests.

[TiaSarah]

Agreed, I can remember actually NEEDING to replant trees because the forest was nearly bare. It was nice that someone took an interest in keeping up the replanting, but a shame it was taken to such extremes. Try and look at the bright side, no more monstrous lag from trees that are nearly on top of each other.

[Athian]

Its a real shame to see the group of players who have been doing this have been worked around by removing an entire feature. I know it was going to be removed either way but I do hope this won't become some sort of trend, where we'd rather get rid of a feature then reprimand the ones doing the abuse.

Personally i liked the tree planting, for the very reason Estralis mentioned, it allowed players to actively change their environment if just a tiny bit. Features like that, even though rather minor can help players feel like their a little more connected to the game. That's a good aspect in an role-playing game like Illarion where the immersion is what counts. I'll just have to hope we get some cooler things in the future . Honestly I'll certainly miss such nice features more then I would miss the ones who ruin them for others.

[Evie]

It is a shame. Did anyone ever address it ingame?

[Athian]

It is a shame. Did anyone ever address it ingame?

Its fairly rare when a abuse of a feature be addressed in an RP manner(as opposed to removing it). Though it's also just as rare for players to be completely unaware when they are involved in nuisance behaviors. To pretend to be unaware or ignore the opinions of others because "they haven't found me IG" should not be an excuse to continue to do the same actions.

A bit to often the idea that something that isn't handled IG or isn't technically a rule violation so can be ignored only show's that their is a lack of consideration from some player's to others. It tends to result in more work for DEV's/GM's which can in some situations result in the removal of one thing or another. I mean who really wants to spend time repairing the map day in and out? Wild fires were also a pretty cool feature that got vapidly abused in the same manner, though those were much less missed .

[Alexander Knight]

I actually know who planted all the trees, i could rat them out.


for a price

I think everyone knows who done it. They also done i outside of Bane too and something tells me the farmrs union will also look like it.



Also I missed wildfires

[Jeisa]

One of my characters did actually go and chop down many of the trees, just trying to make space between the remaining ones to make it look more natural and have it be more manageable to walk through. She did manage to dig up some of the roots too, but most were beyond her capabilities. I wish there was something like... I don't know, a certain distance that has to be between a tree and a seed for a new tree to be able to plant it? In the real world, you should take into account how far the tree roots will spread underground before planting a tree anyway. But I know that would just make extra work for developers who really shouldn't have to bother with that when the players should have just been more thoughtful to begin with. That said, I'm going to miss the ability to plant trees - even if I only ever planted two trees.

[rakust dorenstkzul]

I think everyone knows who done it.

You're cutting down on my bargaining position!

[GolfLima]

1) it was never my idea to initiate such a discussion (only want to remark that some "woods" are "unnatural")
2) the decissions are made
3) lets have a look how it works without planting trees

[PurpleMonkeys]

I don't see how this is any better. Before if someone killed a ton of trees players could replant them, and as shown many players try to fix the unnatural forests themselves. Now only GMs can replant trees. a player could cut down forests now and only a GM can fix it, making more work for the GMs.

[Uhuru]

Yes, and for those of us in need of the roots? We decimate whole forests/orchards. Much more work for GM's.

[Alexander Knight]

Yes, and for those of us in need of the roots? We decimate whole forests/orchards. Much more work for GM's.

You wanna take that shovel and dig yourself a deeper hole?

[Jeisa]

Why didn't you help clear the forest, then? It was obviously just a display of abuse. I spent what felt like hours trying to clear at least SOME of them so that people could walk through.

[Estralis Seborian]

I should add that killing trees and digging out roots will also be deactivated with the VBU. Until then, us GMs will gladly assist in replanting trees where necessary.

I also want to add that we blame no one in particular. We just observed that a feature is used in a way that the benefit for the game is not comparable to the damage, caused by it. Thus, we deactivated it. No one gets banned, no one is blamed.

[Alexander Knight]

Why didn't you help clear the forest, then? It was obviously just a display of abuse. I spent what felt like hours trying to clear at least SOME of them so that people could walk through.

Translation: Sort your own mess out, Uhuru!

[GolfLima]

Yes, and for those of us in need of the roots? We decimate whole forests/orchards. Much more work for GM's.

i know nothing where you need a lot of life roots

and as i said before

why cant we try to handle the new situation and look how it works?