Just wondering after a year's departure

Everything about Illarion that fits nowhere else. / Alles über Illarion was inhaltlich in kein anderes Board passt.

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Lennier
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Post by Lennier »

The char was not attacked for his acting. My char told him that he has not to use the tools inside the castle without his permission and wanted, that he had to leave the place for the moment - so he is warned for the future how he has to act. (Thats my view. I hope he understood my english ingame.)

The same situation i have 3-5 times per week. Sometimes the owner becomes more harsh by this and uses some more hard words.

Only the fewest, who can not hear has to life with the last consequences (for what the castle has 2 prision cells, which also are not lockable at the moment, so that all could left if they really want?) :wink:


To the NPC`s - I did not set up Sam. He was gives us by the staff (a great gift :D). And of course i like him because he is one reason for lots of guests and costumers around the castle.

Personnally i also would prefer, that all settlements get their NPC`s (traders or whatever) and depots - the monastery, the house of the druids, the farm (has a depot), orc cave (has a depot too) etc. It is neccesary to have them, to can survive there, to have a hotspot at the map.

I do not see where is the difference between them, the castle and the towns. All of them are made and ruled by the player-chars, by closed communities. Silverbrand has the only lockable door currently. All other places has to protected by the players directly.


At Tetra Xas: You have a PM
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Dónal Mason
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Post by Dónal Mason »

This topic is really quite worthless. The player in question decided to complain about an IC matter OOC. If your character had say, sent a very angry letter to the character Lennier, all would be fine.
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Tetra Xas
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Post by Tetra Xas »

.....

85% of the replies here are flaming calling me 'whining' and useless post ? instead of answering the question in my first post?
Say something more constructive if you do not understand my post or didnt even bother to understand my intention, instead of playing the role of 'I got to backup my friend' on the forum.

I already got my answer in the first few post,
and after reading thru 3 pages,
had to say I understood why Illarion community hasnt grown much since my long departure.

@Lennier, read your mail, all is fine.

@This IG community just wants to build a wall around themselves, lock the door and face themselves all day and night.

@It pays to play evil, now I can see. but not my style.

@Mods please close or delete this thread. since I get nothing more than flamings cause people urgently needs to raise 'Post Amount',
or banned my account permanently to please the 'Community'.
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Faladron
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Post by Faladron »

:roll: So I didn't get your point and you didn't get mine...

Sounds fair, I'm glad that everything's settled.
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Galim
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Post by Galim »

boy, calm down. You are a bit paranoid now :shock:
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Dónal Mason
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Post by Dónal Mason »

So wait, what you're saying is that I post to get my post count up? I don't give a damn about my post count.
This IG community just wants to build a wall around themselves, lock the door and face themselves all day and night.
Um, no. You see, it was their castle your character wandered into. Imagine it like this. You come home, and there's a stranger cooking in your kitchen! You'd be ever so slightly pissed, wouldn't you? I'm sure that is how the character Lennier feels.
It pays to play evil, now I can see. but not my style.
How does it pay to play evil? You made no sense here.
Markous
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Post by Markous »

Tetra Xas: It was RP.
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Moirear Sian
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Post by Moirear Sian »

Tetra Xas wrote:@This IG community just wants to build a wall around themselves, lock the door and face themselves all day and night.
I'm wondering now if you're talking about the Grey Rose community IG or the Illarion player community OOC. Either way it would be appropriate, but it's no news, that's old stuff. That's the typical behaviour anyway of any tightly-knit small-sized group of people like a cult, sect, fanclub, or similar formations. No need to state the obvious. ;)
Tetra Xas wrote:@It pays to play evil, now I can see. but not my style.
Actually, that's not true. It can be a real major pain in the arse to play "consequently evil" in this game, but I find it entertaining nevertheless. For example, it's wayyy easier to join a guild like Farmer's Union and just play a good ol' farmer, pure and simple.

I also hope I'm not counted in the abovementioned 85%, I meant no harm whatsoever.
Anyway, presto lockage of this thread doesn't sound like a bad idea to me.
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Jori
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Post by Jori »

Faladron said:
I didn't know about it, so I am innocent" doesn't work infront of court neither, so that's no excuse.

However in RL there actually is a list of rules and laws that you can check. I'm sure somewhere you can find a law that says: Civilians are not allowed to go on military property. (or something like that) The point is that in Illa there is NO way to find that out without about an hour of searching the forums. What we need is a way to easily access a list of forbidden places and other IG laws.

@Lennier
Your RP sounds like it was perfectly good and you did just what you should have IG. This was just a case of "this is a game so you can go where you want because people cant really own a PLACE IG can they?"
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Faladron
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Post by Faladron »

I assure you Jori, trying to inform yourself about every written law of every country on this planet will most likely take you a lot more time than browsing around in this forum. Though you have the same fair chance to find them,both here and in RL if you want to apply RL law standarts anyway.
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Nop
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Post by Nop »

Lennier wrote: The same situation i have 3-5 times per week. Sometimes the owner becomes more harsh by this and uses some more hard words.
If it happens so often - ever thought about doing something about it? Like posting a sign?
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Nop
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Post by Nop »

Dónal Mason wrote: Um, no. You see, it was their castle your character wandered into. Imagine it like this. You come home, and there's a stranger cooking in your kitchen! You'd be ever so slightly pissed, wouldn't you?
I am pretty sure your home has a locked door, a sign saying who lives here and does not look at all like the public workshop in the next town. right? :-)
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Galim
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Post by Galim »

I have no sign at my dorr with a "Go away" n it.

And the castle had once locked doors. but they have non yet. Give them locked doors again and ready <_<.

And that "no sign" don't change the fact that his char wasn't allowed there and wasn't allowed to use their workshop. It was RP!
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Faladron
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Post by Faladron »

The fact, as Nop tries to point out, that if I leave the front door of my house open, everyone is allowed to walk right in and cook on my oven, sleep in my bed, eat my food etc. discomforts me... :roll:
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Cain Freemont
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Post by Cain Freemont »

Tetra Xas wrote: or was I wrong to return...
Incredibly possible. The community has, without a doubt, gotten worse. The level of irate behavior from characters (not to mention arrogance from many players) is equally proportional to the ridiculous skill difficulty and restraint.
Hadrian_Abela wrote: Example : Illegal to cut town trees, in TB
Illegal to cut trees anywhere near Vanima

ect...

Those... are the dumbest laws I have ever heard of anyone thinking up. Dumber than not being able to buy a TV on a Sunday, so-to-speak.


Oh, and: Without posted notice that certain areas are forbidden, there is little to tell a character (AND player) that they should not enter an area. GMs, put up signs if they are needed. Players, get to asking the GMs to help out, so you can actually roleplay a no-entry zone. -_-" I'm sick of hearing about people getting in trouble for going into places and getting the shit kicked out of them because they entered, even when there is NOTHING to tell them otherwise. You guys really have no excuse and the behavior of your characters is really based on a poorly executed RP of your own.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

Cain Freemont wrote:
Hadrian_Abela wrote: Example : Illegal to cut town trees, in TB
Illegal to cut trees anywhere near Vanima

ect...

Those... are the dumbest laws I have ever heard of anyone thinking up. Dumber than not being able to buy a TV on a Sunday, so-to-speak.

Try cutting down trees on government or public property in your neighborhood. You *will* be arrested.
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Irania
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Post by Irania »

Yes, but keep in mind that the more realistic the game gets, the less fun it can become.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

That's just roleplaying, though. We let you go where you want to go, and someone wanted to go that way.

It's not like we scripted your laws into place. =)
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Cain Freemont
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Post by Cain Freemont »

Aegohl wrote:
Cain Freemont wrote:
Hadrian_Abela wrote: Example : Illegal to cut town trees, in TB
Illegal to cut trees anywhere near Vanima

ect...

Those... are the dumbest laws I have ever heard of anyone thinking up. Dumber than not being able to buy a TV on a Sunday, so-to-speak.

Try cutting down trees on government or public property in your neighborhood. You *will* be arrested.

Illarion = GAME GAME GAME GAME GAME! I sometimes wonder if I'm speaking a language that no german or american can understand.

We also aren't playing in the year 2005. Also, see Irania's comment. It is exactly how many of us players feel, but everytime we speak our minds, we get a big "WELL ITS NOT SCRIPTED SO RP IT OR DIE" slap in the face. It is my strong belief that a fantasy game such as Illarion should NOT have laws that reflect those of modern society (even within the past 1000 years, considering the game isn't even CLOSE to being in a realistic setting). It is far too much of an immersion-slaughter.

Edit:

Realism = BS BS BS BS BS BS BS BS!
Last edited by Cain Freemont on Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

Thanks for the outburst, Cain. Could you please delete it and put something more sensible there and also consider what I posted above that it's not like we fucking scripted it in there.

We allow you to play. We don't pick what way you play it. Now use your edit button, prat.
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Cain Freemont
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Post by Cain Freemont »

No, I'm really tired of this. I really don't feel like editing my post, mainly because it makes a very valid point. If I had used any other size, it wouldn't have made any difference. Its the e-Outburst that's pissing you off. Well trust me, the meaning is the same. I am very tired of opinions going seen, but unnoticed. That is the reason for my outburst. I am very aware that you didn't script it. That no one scripted it. The original comment was mainly just a joke. I am just so damn tired of all the realism that's being thrown into this game. Its pushing me further and further from the community that I've loved for three fucking years. I'm entitled to this opinion, just as everyone else is apparently entitled to their elitism and their own outbursts.

I really don't care if its scripted in there or not. Less work for you if it isn't. But what I don't get is the GM's responsibility in all this. All I've really seen is technical discussion about things from the staff, never any ingame support of one thing or another. I know that it isn't about being unbiased.
Last edited by Cain Freemont on Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

No. Cain. Seriously. This is not the day. Not the forum. Not the time.

The only point you have is apparently that we, the staff, should do the roleplaying for the players, and I don't have the fucking time. Sorry.
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Cain Freemont
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Post by Cain Freemont »

Nope. Not my point at all. Cheers. And goodbye. You won't have to hear from me for the rest of the day, at least.

And since they were apparently a bother, I removed the size tags. Auf Wiedersehen.
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Tetra Xas
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Post by Tetra Xas »

Just a question from my first post could drag to a Six Page Debate, those who call it 'useless','worthless','pointless' post just reflect on their words.

Cain.
Sadly the game has
1. Evolved into too much of Hard-Headed Roleplay,
2. New people who 'intend'/'wanted' to join Illarion are not able to roleplay themselves, they ARE forced to roleplay under the RULES/LAWS of those who are in POWER, molding people to go under their Juristism or LEAVE.
3. The game is not a game for everyone, its a game where People who wants to join HAS to accept the Domination of the OLD players or LEAVE.
4. Definately a game that has changed so much that it has become a family game for those who has started from start, all they do now was ask friends to join or await those who Blindly joins the game, and mold themselve under their rule.
5. The Hard-Headed Roleplay has become such an abused word that whenever anything that the OLD players dont like or not in favor, They use the word, " it is Roleplay, dont like it, LEAVE ''.
Ever wondered how many people has been turned alway because of Hard-Head Roleplay, just like those Hard-Headed Salesman, trying to promote a product by cold-canvas and get slammed at the door. Just like customers who actually are players wanting to give Illarion a chance, but because they stood at the door and wanted to ask a question or try something, the Salesman never gave them a chance kept Blabbering " Its ROLEPLAY, BUY BUY BUY ''. the door slams.
~ Precisely why I see that Illarion hasnt grown much cause it isnt inviting to new player, People has forgotten that even in Roleplay, its a human behind it and they have feelings, Just because you have the power, doesnt mean that you can suppress people.
6. Not many has understood the intention of my post, and yet they simpily said ' LIVE with IT '. am I playing for my own Roleplay or am I going to ' Live with Your Dominations ? ' You said NO, means NO.

I just have to thank the few who sent me PMs consoling that the community is now ' LIVE WITH IT '.

@if that particular short dwarf has something to flame, not interest in listen, I know, " ITS ROLEPLAY, Live with IT or leave "

The Post has nothing to do with the issue with the Halfling now, it has become too off-topic after 6 pages flames. Is it worthless.?
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Cain Freemont
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Post by Cain Freemont »

The only real points I disagree with there are the ones about the old players. I'm an old player, but I couldn't be less oppressive about ingame issues. I'm very strongly-minded about how the game has devolved, but I'm not going to let that affect my roleplay, regardless of how crappy the atmosphere might get at times. Player age doesn't mean shit anymore. There are too few truly old players now. The new players of our time have become the old players, and those who have joined this year are the new/almost seasoned players. Our time is passed.. its time for us to move on, like the elves (or the leaving of Bror, if you prefer to truly look back on the better times).

Promise, Aegohl. That was my last post... probably for a while. Keep up the mapping.




Good day.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

I agreed with you that they should be nicer to newbies, however, to say that there shouldn't be ruling parties and laws and such, I just don't understand.

As for this age-old aristocracy that you're talking about... I don't think you've been around long enough to really comment. Pendar is the lone dictator of Trollsbane. He's been around for under a year. That is to say that we, the ancients, are bowing to a newbie. :wink:

Also, we've gone through three major government changes or more in the last couple of years. Younger players have asserted power over the older ones. It happens. It just takes time and patience.

However, if the in-character environment is assaulting you out-of-character, perhaps all I can say is that this is not the game for you.

Cain,

Never asked you to stop posting. More along the lines of showing respect.
Keikan Hiru
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Post by Keikan Hiru »

"You do as the king says, or you lose your head."
Its as simple as this.

Keep it in mind when you don't understand why established, older character may rule over your character.

Notice the terms "established", "old" are very vague, since you could be already established after playing for some weeks.

Otherwise I agree to Ageohl:
"[...] if the in-character environment is assaulting you out-of-character, perhaps all I can say is that this is not the game for you. [...]"
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Moirear Sian
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Post by Moirear Sian »

Aegohl wrote:Try cutting down trees on government or public property in your neighborhood. You *will* be arrested.
Maybe I gotta try that, yes.

Or no, now I remember why I never tried in the first place.

The signs. "Don't walk on the grass", "Don't cut the trees", "Don't harm the animals", whatever.

Seriously, it needs sign-posts. That's it.

Sure, in medieval type of times nobody would give a hoot about public relations, they might just dispatch the person breaking their unwritten rules. But y'know, at one point, dealing with the breakers of unwritten rules is more time-intensive and problematic than just setting up a sign like "TRESPASSERS ARE SLAIN ON SIGHT" and scaring unwanted commoners or peasants off the estate right off the bat and only having to deal with the serious threats - the intentional trespassers.

In other words, I understand what Cain is getting at; there's a degree of realism that not everybody seeks from an RPG. Because - and let's face it - you take players from any MUD or MORPG over the 'net, and nobody will be able to tell you of any game where people take the RP as seriously as Illarion. In fact if someone would join quickly unbeknowing of how it is, I'm sure it's like a kick in the face.

Maybe you people don't remember what it was like when you started out newly in Illarion, or maybe you don't remember what it's like to start out newly ever since this game has enforced RP, strict naming rules, and that ancient, asseninely difficult account acceptance system the game used to have (the one with the confusing emails, etc.)

I remember it was pretty cold when I got started. Darlok and some others were the people who answered my questions (which were purely RP-related and not technical) in the Newbie forum section when I was new, that was fine. Still - in-game was a cold and boring place for the longest time...

Fat chance anybody will tell you whatever is what on the map. You had to either have a buddy show you the ropes, and find out the rest by raping the forums and websites that orbit around the game world and listed what the buildings were; God bless Kasume who didn't take that task like as if he had a broomstick shoved up his ass - which is sometimes the impression I get of some other people around here.

Not at last, what made identification of things on the world map insanely difficult, were the temporarily inactive buildings - graphically an enigma, technically useless, roleplay-wise - an empty sheet of paper, because nobody gave any input on it, and there's not even a sign saying what kind of building you're looking at or if it's illegal to enter.

I hope some people understand me when I say that I NEVER took anybody seriously who tried to tell me that there were always invisible NPC guards patrolling the walls of Troll's Bane back then, so criminals couldn't enter town after roleplayed bans... seriously, WTF?

I hope we're not, like, speaking a different language here.
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Aegohl
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Post by Aegohl »

"Realism sucks" and "this game was better back when I played it" doesn't count for much, yes.

"It takes too long to farm" might count for something, but I can't be sure. I don't know the technical aspects of it. For example, for all I know it could take a change in protocol and that might mean a whole lot of work and we're already pretty tight-handed.

"I liked it better when herb lore counted for something and you used a sickle with the ground and if the tile was right, so was the price" might count for something, but I'd personally disagree. I like picking herbs off the floor, specifically because I'm lazy.

Believe me, I've read years worth of your posts, three years to be specific, and I'm still not sure what you want. We have something like four scripters. Half of them weren't around pre-drought. One of them is a relative newbie. Could you define how we've made things realistic and unfun?

I would say that farming has become a little more complicated since I started playing. However, I have to say that I didn't enjoy farming in Illarion back when I started playing and I enjoy it now. I don't know what your opinion on it is. Have you tried farming recently?

We don't have a reset button. Everything that existed on that old server, she's gone, friend. Martin is like a human database and even he doesn't remember every bit of code that's been changed. In all reality, the code hasn't changed since the last wipe. It was entirely rewritten.

The problem, at the end of the day, is that you're writing in a different language than we're reading. You aren't posting things in a way in which we can understand it. We need a definate "x should be y" and you're instead saying "a was better than b." We don't have "a" to reference anymore. There is no script museum, and besides, we switched scripting languages.
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Thomas Jin'takar
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Post by Thomas Jin'takar »

Illarion is alpha.
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