in 20mins I have seen,
17 instances of rudeness
10 instances of un tagged ooc
5 murders
1 res killing
4 instances of training/powergaming
19 instances of casting in town
this is rdiculous, read my suggestions in propsal board please.
Bror, other gms - ILLARION IS OUT OF CONTROL!
Moderator: Gamemasters
Bror, other gms
casting in town is not our rule and thus not our concern (this fact was stated several times already).
as for training: it itself is not forbidden, as long as its not overdone and done with unacceptable methods. but two warriors are well allowed to do some sparring.
as for the rest...
as for training: it itself is not forbidden, as long as its not overdone and done with unacceptable methods. but two warriors are well allowed to do some sparring.
as for the rest...
Bror, other gms
I must agree with you Lloyd. I have not been in the town much these days, but when I am there it is chaotic. If there is not 5 murders when I am there, I usually hear about them after I leave. This is out of control.
Bror, other gms
Well Galdriel it is our concern... Lloyd is right in all ways... And powergaming is always powergaming and in sparing one always loose and do not use health potion nor heal spell...
Bror, other gms
Surely, without any rule breakers in Illarion...it would soon become boring and repetetive because you couldn't fight with people anymore. I for one love when people cast in town and try and war against the town, it gives people something to do.
Bror, other gms
When I first started the entire town was on fire...
Bror, other gms
the only programer inforced rule breaking/problem is with the res killing. There are murders every day in rl, you just need to find a way to deal with them. This can go for the rest of the offences you stated, deal with them yourself, or gather a group of law obiding citizens to stop the unlawful people. Its the only way to stop these town rule breakers.
Bror, other gms
People are dieing by accident yesterday I took another survey:
8 deaths while training
4 accidental deaths becuase of careless casters
17 instances of spell casting
3 instances of double team dueling
17 res killings
19 deaths altogether
oh and a potionizer selling for unheard of prices....
8 deaths while training
4 accidental deaths becuase of careless casters
17 instances of spell casting
3 instances of double team dueling
17 res killings
19 deaths altogether
oh and a potionizer selling for unheard of prices....
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Emhyr van Emreis
- Posts: 209
- Joined: Fri Mar 22, 2002 10:26 pm
- Contact:
Bror, other gms
I must say that I too fully agree with Lloyd... it is a well-known fact that the rules that normally define how people live together are going down the drain in Illarion. OK, the town-casters are a minor matter I think. But I also notice something that annoys me very much, and that should really be fought: I keep hearing people who shout untagged ooc messages like "whr u from?" "us & u?" "kewl me 2". This really badly hurts the rp. I tend to go to these people and tell them to stop, but well, it doesn't help much to be honest.
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Silentslayer
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2002 12:37 am
- Location: Missouri
Bror, other gms
Death without cause is wrong, but if they have a cause then let them be. Some people are good and some are evil, you can't force people to change just how you want them to. Thats how it is in RL.
Bror, other gms
i will say this. yo cant stop ppl from PKing or casting in town. there will always be rule breakers(i know casting isnt a rle). What i thonk should happen about casting is jsut dont block doorways with a flame. as for training, i train acasionaly with other ppl. but we always ehal ourselves as we go. if we die, its jsut anaccedent. i know i have died that way. i have also been PKed. i think it was by lected his freinds. and i have PKed 3 times. 2 of them was to someone i know in rl. the other, i thought was a PKer. it wasnt. Ops. a few ppl heard me cursing myself for the mistake.
drag, the freindly dwarf
drag, the freindly dwarf
Bror, other gms
Heh, you should be talking out of character with tags or without. The boards are out of the game so talk out of character here. You can't just go in and out of character at your pleasure, that would just mean people have another acronym to type, like we need more of those.
The town was on fire when I first got on, I was scared out of my mind. Darklighter was the name of one of the best sorcerers in this game if I remember right. He caused mass destruction a time or two. Heck I have even killed people and surrounded the cross with firefields and icefields that was pretty fun. That was a while back. When Demons were an easy kill, good times. Like with any game, when more people come there are too less of people to control them, thus they get out of hand and pking begins.
Besides, you wouldn't have anything to complain about if there were no problems.
The town was on fire when I first got on, I was scared out of my mind. Darklighter was the name of one of the best sorcerers in this game if I remember right. He caused mass destruction a time or two. Heck I have even killed people and surrounded the cross with firefields and icefields that was pretty fun. That was a while back. When Demons were an easy kill, good times. Like with any game, when more people come there are too less of people to control them, thus they get out of hand and pking begins.
Besides, you wouldn't have anything to complain about if there were no problems.
Bror, other gms
:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
Hehehe! "Illarion- a better world" You should delete that, because its simply not true. You cannot create a perfect world. Because this is a FREE RPG, that means that every person can play it at least for a while until you might delete his char. But if its a free RPG, its available for everyone, that means you can't control who comes to illarion and what this person has in mind.
But there's something i dont understand: There are at least 10 Guilds who have sworn to fight for peace and friendlieness in Illarion, WHERE ARE THEY? What are they doing while people cast,pk,talk ooc, totally uncontrolled in town? Why don't stand to their word and actually DO something that makes them worth being called "knight" or "hero"?
No, let me guess....:Because they don't want to care for all these Rulebreakers, which are in their eyes not worth all the trouble?
Hehehe! "Illarion- a better world" You should delete that, because its simply not true. You cannot create a perfect world. Because this is a FREE RPG, that means that every person can play it at least for a while until you might delete his char. But if its a free RPG, its available for everyone, that means you can't control who comes to illarion and what this person has in mind.
But there's something i dont understand: There are at least 10 Guilds who have sworn to fight for peace and friendlieness in Illarion, WHERE ARE THEY? What are they doing while people cast,pk,talk ooc, totally uncontrolled in town? Why don't stand to their word and actually DO something that makes them worth being called "knight" or "hero"?
No, let me guess....:Because they don't want to care for all these Rulebreakers, which are in their eyes not worth all the trouble?
Bror, other gms
A lot of these people DO take action and explain that it is wrong in Illarion to cast for no reason, pk, talk ooc aloud, etc. but there isn't much else they can do right now and dealing with these ooc matters doesn't have anything to do with being a knight or a hero. Anyways like someone once said, to tell someone they went ooc, you'd have to go ooc yourself. This is very true although I do agree that sometimes we do need to go a little ooc in order to stop more ooc.
The problem is that they cannot be around in every place and every minute to stop such things when they happen. Most new guilds aren't working out very well right now and many of those old people or guilds just aren't around very often anymore. I think that a lot of older players, some part of important guilds, just lost heart and lost some interest in the game and aren't around very often anymore which, and although this is a bit of a biased opinion, I think is because of a little something that happened some months ago which I'm going to talk about in another thread that I will soon start...
The problem is that they cannot be around in every place and every minute to stop such things when they happen. Most new guilds aren't working out very well right now and many of those old people or guilds just aren't around very often anymore. I think that a lot of older players, some part of important guilds, just lost heart and lost some interest in the game and aren't around very often anymore which, and although this is a bit of a biased opinion, I think is because of a little something that happened some months ago which I'm going to talk about in another thread that I will soon start...
Bror, other gms
If it was me deciding, we wouldn't have had this text somewhere on the website. Anyway, I asked Alatar to change it a lot of times and the last time I thought he really did it.Quote: from Arnesca on 7:54 am on Aug. 8, 2002
"Illarion- a better world" You should delete that, because its simply not true.
Where does this text appear?
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Chyan Guo Messenger
- Posts: 306
- Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2002 8:03 pm
- Location: United States
Bror, other gms
...... i know where it is.
re-enter the web site, and to the screen where you must choose the american flag or german for the language.
there is a banner in the middle, take you arrow there and put it over the banner and let it sit there for a while..... and it will show.
it use to say "free online role playing" and when i first came here it just said "www.illarion.de" i think.
<i noticed all 3 Mods are on.... they must be cracking down on someone.... uh oh. hehehe!!!>
(Edited by Chyan Guo Messenger at 5:13 am on Aug. 9, 2002)
re-enter the web site, and to the screen where you must choose the american flag or german for the language.
there is a banner in the middle, take you arrow there and put it over the banner and let it sit there for a while..... and it will show.
it use to say "free online role playing" and when i first came here it just said "www.illarion.de" i think.
<i noticed all 3 Mods are on.... they must be cracking down on someone.... uh oh. hehehe!!!>
(Edited by Chyan Guo Messenger at 5:13 am on Aug. 9, 2002)
Bror, other gms
Ahhh, true RP games. How hard to have.
I've noticed that almost all true RPG games are MUDs, not graphical. Started wondering about it. Only hardcore gamers play MUDs. The massed just don't, too much thought required to actually read.
There are a few, but they are usually graphical interfaces to MUDs.
So, why can't we have a graphical mud? I think the reason is, they are just too easy to play. Muds are not easy to play. So you don't only get the die hard roll players who will role play, but every Tom, Dick and Harry.
When you have 100 people playing a game, such as dartmud.com, non role players may pop in now and then and see that everyone else is role playing, get bored very quickly and leave.
When you get a graphical game, especially one in open alpha or beta, you get 1000's of people, and you still have those 100 role players, but now you got 900 non role players and people see they don't have to role play.
So, what's the solution?
Good question, when you find out, let the rest of us know
As far as casting in town, that is a player rule (even though I am real new to this game, less than a week, I found that out early). Player rules are enforced by the players, not the GMs. There are no guards. There is no town hall. It is an anarchy (even thought it does have game rules). If poeple should not be casting in town, then enforce it.
I saw one, seemed to be, long time player talk to some lizard casting in town for 20 minutes, telling him not to cast. Over and over. If he continued to cast he would kill him, over and over. Never did kill him. Finally the lizard got bored, cast poison on the long time player and logged. Sorry, it should of been, we do not allow casting in town. Don't do it. He casts again, do that again and I will enforce it. He casts again, kill him. That happens enough, people will get the message. These aren't RPers you're dealing with, sad to say, but people who just want to play a game and get an uber character.
If you want to maintain RPing in the game, then the players as a whole are going to have to enforce it. We should be thankful that PKing is allowed in the game. In non-PKing games there is no way to enforce any kind of civil behavior at all.
But, there is a flip side, once you start PKing, non RPers will start PKing just for the heck of it, then you get chaos again.
I've given up trying to RP in most graphical games, such as EQ, AC, etc.. because it is just so hard. With 99% of the people not RPing it is next to impossible. I would like to see a good graphical RP game. And the interface to Illarion is very well done. It reminds me so much of dartmud, it's almost like a graphical Dartmud, and dartmud is the only mud I've played for a year, (off and on like 5 years now).
And, more.. if you want to get people to start RPing, you gotta lighten up a little. When someone tries, give them an A for effort. "Here's a dagger to use" "Cool". "((Hey, Cool isn't an RP term, it wasn't used in the middle ages and...))" sorry, you lost them right there. "Here's a sword for you" "Cool" "You're welcome, sir Lizard, safe journies." Next time s/he may pick up the flavor a little bit.
I used to RP in more old english terms, "Hail to thee, lizard, wouldst thou want a dagger?" and is what I prefer, but I find that most RPers don't like doing this. Dang, wish more of you would read the old Kings James Version <grin> So I try to tone my RP into what the game uses. And the more flavour you give your RP the more non RPers will pick up on it.
"Here's a sword, Lizard" <== RP or not? RPers know it is acceptable RP. Non RPers only know it as English.
"Have a sword, sir Lizard, to aid your way." <== Heck, that doesn't sound like english, must be RP.
All in all, it's a loosing battle, unless you just don't allow non RPers in, then you can't leave it open and....
*sigh*
What's a dwarf to do?
Serpardum
I've noticed that almost all true RPG games are MUDs, not graphical. Started wondering about it. Only hardcore gamers play MUDs. The massed just don't, too much thought required to actually read.
There are a few, but they are usually graphical interfaces to MUDs.
So, why can't we have a graphical mud? I think the reason is, they are just too easy to play. Muds are not easy to play. So you don't only get the die hard roll players who will role play, but every Tom, Dick and Harry.
When you have 100 people playing a game, such as dartmud.com, non role players may pop in now and then and see that everyone else is role playing, get bored very quickly and leave.
When you get a graphical game, especially one in open alpha or beta, you get 1000's of people, and you still have those 100 role players, but now you got 900 non role players and people see they don't have to role play.
So, what's the solution?
Good question, when you find out, let the rest of us know
As far as casting in town, that is a player rule (even though I am real new to this game, less than a week, I found that out early). Player rules are enforced by the players, not the GMs. There are no guards. There is no town hall. It is an anarchy (even thought it does have game rules). If poeple should not be casting in town, then enforce it.
I saw one, seemed to be, long time player talk to some lizard casting in town for 20 minutes, telling him not to cast. Over and over. If he continued to cast he would kill him, over and over. Never did kill him. Finally the lizard got bored, cast poison on the long time player and logged. Sorry, it should of been, we do not allow casting in town. Don't do it. He casts again, do that again and I will enforce it. He casts again, kill him. That happens enough, people will get the message. These aren't RPers you're dealing with, sad to say, but people who just want to play a game and get an uber character.
If you want to maintain RPing in the game, then the players as a whole are going to have to enforce it. We should be thankful that PKing is allowed in the game. In non-PKing games there is no way to enforce any kind of civil behavior at all.
But, there is a flip side, once you start PKing, non RPers will start PKing just for the heck of it, then you get chaos again.
I've given up trying to RP in most graphical games, such as EQ, AC, etc.. because it is just so hard. With 99% of the people not RPing it is next to impossible. I would like to see a good graphical RP game. And the interface to Illarion is very well done. It reminds me so much of dartmud, it's almost like a graphical Dartmud, and dartmud is the only mud I've played for a year, (off and on like 5 years now).
And, more.. if you want to get people to start RPing, you gotta lighten up a little. When someone tries, give them an A for effort. "Here's a dagger to use" "Cool". "((Hey, Cool isn't an RP term, it wasn't used in the middle ages and...))" sorry, you lost them right there. "Here's a sword for you" "Cool" "You're welcome, sir Lizard, safe journies." Next time s/he may pick up the flavor a little bit.
I used to RP in more old english terms, "Hail to thee, lizard, wouldst thou want a dagger?" and is what I prefer, but I find that most RPers don't like doing this. Dang, wish more of you would read the old Kings James Version <grin> So I try to tone my RP into what the game uses. And the more flavour you give your RP the more non RPers will pick up on it.
"Here's a sword, Lizard" <== RP or not? RPers know it is acceptable RP. Non RPers only know it as English.
"Have a sword, sir Lizard, to aid your way." <== Heck, that doesn't sound like english, must be RP.
All in all, it's a loosing battle, unless you just don't allow non RPers in, then you can't leave it open and....
*sigh*
What's a dwarf to do?
Serpardum
Bror, other gms
Mr. Serpardum,
I agree on most things you have said, but I would like to add a thought... you said that you used to play speaking on old-english, and I admire that.. on the other hand, Illarion seems to have people from all over the world and you have to admit that a person that´s not english native will probably have no idea of how english was spoken years ago. I should confess that I´m rather new to all this roleplaying thing and graphical mud seemed to me as the easiest way to learn, once you can see and feel what´s happening... it´s like a second world and almost like reading a book when you are one of those readers that gets involved to the story... the only difference is that here you interact with other people, and interacting is not always an easy thing. I myself am not an english native and for me sometimes it´s really hard to act like the game requires...
Roleplaying is not an easy thing to learn, I can assure you that... and learning alone is even harder. You can´t just blame people for the way they talk or for not understanding how to roleplay, there has to be some kind of orientation and the best way to do that is by roleplaying. On the other hand, people can´t learn how to roleplay if they don´t pay attention to older roleplayers... so I guess it´s up to everyone to fix this problem.
I agree on most things you have said, but I would like to add a thought... you said that you used to play speaking on old-english, and I admire that.. on the other hand, Illarion seems to have people from all over the world and you have to admit that a person that´s not english native will probably have no idea of how english was spoken years ago. I should confess that I´m rather new to all this roleplaying thing and graphical mud seemed to me as the easiest way to learn, once you can see and feel what´s happening... it´s like a second world and almost like reading a book when you are one of those readers that gets involved to the story... the only difference is that here you interact with other people, and interacting is not always an easy thing. I myself am not an english native and for me sometimes it´s really hard to act like the game requires...
Roleplaying is not an easy thing to learn, I can assure you that... and learning alone is even harder. You can´t just blame people for the way they talk or for not understanding how to roleplay, there has to be some kind of orientation and the best way to do that is by roleplaying. On the other hand, people can´t learn how to roleplay if they don´t pay attention to older roleplayers... so I guess it´s up to everyone to fix this problem.
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Chyan Guo Messenger
- Posts: 306
- Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2002 8:03 pm
- Location: United States
Bror, other gms
Serpardum, if Kalypse haven't all ready pointed out these points in her similar way, that you may be able to "speak old english" and consider it role playing, but this game isnt restricted just to Europe or Germany, nor it just Old-English people only. No matter how much you "try" to hide your slangs to your ways of speach, the effects of different cultures will show outloud and there isnt anything you can do about it. Let them speak the way they want to, though you pretend your in the time back long ago, the present is quite there and strongly catches a grip. Sure, slangs should be best left out, but for many things like "cool" and "O.K.", even if it causes the "pollution" of illarion is burned into our heads. You may speak in anyway you choose, im sure in the middle ages there were communication differences, slangs, and other ways then the OLD ENGLISH. Also, this is Roleplaying, pretending to be someone else during a different time or area. To escape the present so called even, but CERTAINLY this isnt DRAMA CLASS, and ones shouldn't learn Old-English just to impress RolePlaying, for it isnt needed! You have your style, they have theirs, so it be.
Casting in town to prevented for spells of attacks distract and sometimes is a sign of a fight, same with training in town. Thoses who were warned and continue to act that agressive will be punished or if you are unable to do so, you may ask for someone else or simply leave if you just cant do anything. Trouble makers will pay, but if their goal isnt to PK or "Chaos", then they will stop if you ask them to, and give them the reason why.
PKs, CASTERs, RULEBREAKERs will always exist, people wants to cause trouble, its very human to do so. A perfect RPG, even if inforced the OLD ENGLISH trash to another ridiculous point will never work. Deal With It. Sometimes adapt to the closest thing you can find that fits you, or MOVE ON. RolePlaying is the name, and of course its only a GAME.
Casting in town to prevented for spells of attacks distract and sometimes is a sign of a fight, same with training in town. Thoses who were warned and continue to act that agressive will be punished or if you are unable to do so, you may ask for someone else or simply leave if you just cant do anything. Trouble makers will pay, but if their goal isnt to PK or "Chaos", then they will stop if you ask them to, and give them the reason why.
PKs, CASTERs, RULEBREAKERs will always exist, people wants to cause trouble, its very human to do so. A perfect RPG, even if inforced the OLD ENGLISH trash to another ridiculous point will never work. Deal With It. Sometimes adapt to the closest thing you can find that fits you, or MOVE ON. RolePlaying is the name, and of course its only a GAME.
Bror, other gms
Yes, I understand that old english is hard to understand. Yes, I understand that most people don't like, that's why I don't do it anymore. I thought I had said that in my post :me shrugs
Seems that is the main topic of your post, which seems to be agreeing with that point.
Seems you're agreeing with what I was sayign about casting in town also.
And how not to harp on people saying Cool and Okay and such.
So I have no idea why you're coming up with this "Deal with it". :me shrugs.
Well, I"m glad you agree anyway.
Seems that is the main topic of your post, which seems to be agreeing with that point.
Seems you're agreeing with what I was sayign about casting in town also.
And how not to harp on people saying Cool and Okay and such.
So I have no idea why you're coming up with this "Deal with it". :me shrugs.
Well, I"m glad you agree anyway.