Eastern Defenses

[Dyluck]

As you may know, most attacks have come from the eastern side of town which is also usually the most densely populated area during the day, so that side needs to be protected.

Trying to station defenses between Troll's Vein and the smithing area will obviously causes too much unnecessary traffic and obstruction, especially for miners, so it isn't particulary a good place to build more walls.

Instead, if we close the gap between the mouth of Troll's Vein and Fairy's Tears, it will leave us with plenty of room inside and a less conjested area for defenders to work with.

There are a few possible different wall fomations that can be used to close this gap.
A few crude lines have been drawn on this old map.
Obviously this map is a bit outdated, but doesn't affect the area of focus.

The problem with the red line, is that it will encompass the swamp area, right inside where defenders will be standing when defending, which of course isn't very comfortable or uplifting for morale. Not to mention it ruins the swamp ecosystem.

The yellow line on the other hand, leaves the swamp area right outside our walls, leaving unfavorable geography for attackers. It isn't drawn on this map, but the yellow line can actually first run about 10 to 20 paces eastwards from the end of Troll's Vein to encompass more rocky area within, before running into swamp territory. Also, the section running west from the end of Fairy's Tears might need to be further north to border out some of the swamp.

[Viola Thistle]

Do you also propose building a bridge over the combined water way for those venturing past the natural barrier?

[Grant Herion]

I actually like this idea Headmaster. You see, I like when you actually try and make it convenient for us instead of putting it right infront of us, good work.

[paul laffing]

Do you also propose building a bridge over the combined water way for those venturing past the natural barrier?

...wouldn't that defeat the whole purpose?

[Bingem Durthrotgar]

i wouldnt think so

[Viola Thistle]

The question was for further information. I need sand for bottles Paul. I would like to know if changing the layout of the water would cause me to have to pass by the castle to the north, possibly making my trip more dangerous if the zombies ever return (pray to Oldra they do not) and definately making my trip longer.

What is the differences/similarities in having a gate next to the smithy or a bridge near the swamp, Paul?

I'll tell you:
1. there is more room for the citizens to move about and still feel protected.
2. there is still only a small entrance area for unlikables to enter thru that can be easily guarded.
3. there is still easy access to the eastern and northeastern part of the island

The one drawback I see thus far would be, since it *is* less populated by the swamp, would anyone actually be there to guard it.

And don't roll your eyes at me Paul!

Viola

[Hades]

Hi

Even though a bridge would weaken our defenses, it would not defeat the purpose. The bridge will allow enemies to cross one or two at a time, there for melee fighters would be able to help too!!

Deats

[paul laffing]

But thats like intentionally cutting a piece of paper and then taping it back together. It defeats the whole purpose! We'd put a wall there, and then put a bridge right next to it? And who would want to defend the bring?

[Hades]

Hi

I will!!

Deats

[Dyluck]

The eastern wall wasn't meant to completely cut off travel by the east. There would've still be a gate at the walls. I assumed most people would've figured that, but I guess not.
So bridge or gate, there would still be movement in and out of town from the east like it has always been. They would just be more useful to us defensively when trying to restrict enemy traffic.

[Hades]

Hi

That is what I have been saying!!!

Deats

[Drogla]

i like the wall system(yellow line) you created Dyluck.

[Elaralith]

Why not have a straight across where both the rivers start? I don't like square corners much...not too aesthetic, harder to defend, and easier for potential enemies to breach.

[Dyluck]

To build one single wall from the mouth of both rivers would mean to build in a southwest to northeast direction. Geographic formations and current available construction technology make it unfeasable to build walls in any direction other than adjacent to the 4 main compass directions.

About defending, the walls are just expected to stand. We have not yet the time or available resources to create ramparts or such to stand on the walls, so we wouldn't be literally defending the whole wall. Come war time, it would be the just the gate that gets mainly defended.

And personally I find this formation more aesthetic than a single plain dull stretch of wall.

[Aragon]

Dear Citizens,

I see a small problem with both of the suggested lines.
Please take in your considerations, that with both lines, the red and the yellow one, that the swamps with the flies are within the town than.
And for people which aren't common to flies, they might be deadly.

I think, as the wall is for secure, the swamp with the flies should be outside the wall.
So the only possibility would be, to draw a northsouth line between the two rivers, so that the swamps with the flies are outside the town. But to be as far in the east as possible, to have enough room at the mining field.


Aragon ben Galwan
Earl and Templar of the Grey Rose
Priest of Malachin
Councilor of Lyrenzia

[Dyluck]

Yes, I said that the swamp would be outside the yellow lines, but the crude drawings doesn't accurately mark where the exact borders of the wall and swamp. So I said:

. Also, the section running west from the end of Fairy's Tears might need to be further north to border out some of the swamp.

If that section were moved just a little bit north on the map to where the rocky ground is, there should be no flies there, to the best of my recollection.
It's difficult to know the exact location of where the flies at this time, since they aren't here right now, but to my knowledge they aren't too far north, so I think we can still keep some of that land inside the town.

[Tal Rash]

Why not solve it the easy way and make the moat bigger? And then make a bridge on that, low expenses, good defenses.

[Viola Thistle]

So bridge or gate, there would still be movement in and out of town from the east like it has always been.

Thank you for answering my question, Dyluck.

@ Aragon: With the disappearance of the swamp flies, among others, I completely forgot about them. Good point.

[Darlok]

I just throw a quick look on this horrible Map of a Daydreamer.

I say, you can forget both of your "Lines."
It is impossible to build a stable Wall on a Mountain!

Come back down to Earth, seal the Town with close Walls and dig your own Grave.

Darlok

[Faramier]

How about having the wall run from the top of the shop along and down the the edge of trolls vein, this creates a nice shape, keeps the flies out, is easy to defend and lets the miners mine easily.

((I had to improvinse and use my avatar its a bit small but you can see the walls, the yellow lines are the current walls, and the red ones are the proposed, forget the blue things, there are also some other walls on there that were just an idea))

[Brendan Mason]

I love the newly proposed wall, Dyluck.

Now Darlok...I wonder why you are so opposed right now, hmmm?

[Darlok]

Brendan,
you might know how long cabbages need to grow, but you sure have no idea about Architecture and Statics.
Buliding a long Townwall on a unstable and uneaven underground like the Mountains east of our town is absolutly impossible.

I dont oppose the Townwall, altough i think it is useless, i am just telling you what is possible and what not.

Keep the Walls close to the Shop, but dont try to build in Mountains.
Even the Proposal from Gunigalan is useless.

Darlok

[Tal Rash]

Brendan,
you might know how long cabbages need to grow, but you sure have no idea about Architecture and Statics.
Buliding a long Townwall on a unstable and uneaven underground like the Mountains east of our town is absolutly impossible.

Yes, building a wall on a mountain is REALLY unstabile.. No, wait a minute, it isn't!

[Faramier]

Building the wall along a mountain INCREASES its defence potential as we can then see the enemy's coming and they will have to climb the mountain to get to the wall.

((e.g. the great wall of china))

[Hades]

Hi

The further out the wall is, the more room we have to well grow cabbage. It will not be too unstable, and if it is we make it wider therefore increasing stability.

Deats

[Drathe]

If building a wall over mountain terrain is stupid..I have one thing to say to that...building it on a marsh is better?

Next day you come back to it..and its 4 ft shorter..if it does not fall down.

[Darlok]

Oh Deats, you are truly a Fool.

Have you ever heard about something like "Tactic"? I guess not.

So, you want a wall which is wide and large? if you do so, every little Bandit with a 3 Man-Team can rush into the City and cause Havoc.

The wider a wall is:
- the more Man it requires to scout the peremiter
- the more Man you need to actualy hold/defend it
- the more Material you need to build and mainly maintain it
- the unstabler is your overall Defence

By the way, i wish you luck by planting your Cabbabes in the Montains, Deats. Not even a Halfing would do so.

Darlok

[Hades]

Hi

First of all I said wider not longer you fool. Secondly I was giving an example is mining better??

Deats