Music while in town?

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:06 am

I recently got a hold of a program called Fruity Loops (thank you Cliu

) and started fiddling about with it and began writing down all the songs I had in my head that.. I basically conceived but that stayed in my head forever due to no currently available instruments..

I listened to a bunch, and realised they would be nice to listen to while being in Trolls Bane for instance.. I've read somewhere about short musical sounds that bards do when playing an instrument, that could be from ugly to very nice depending on the skill.. I could do that easily, but the problem is that I don't have access to digital sounds of lutes and harps and whatnot.. I looked for some but couldn't find any..

Either way, if I bothered to make a few short melodies that can be heard when entering a town and/or when outside in the wilderness.. and of course an option to turn them off when you get bored of them.. would they be considered, or would I be wasting my time?

Julius · Post by **Julius** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:35 am

Noradur was doing some mixes a while back. I think everyone would appreciate it, considering the client can actually implant this without scripting a new music system.

Noradur · Post by **Noradur** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:41 am

yeah, but i figured that i am too much of a noob to work with midi, and the technical staff is against MP3 soo...

Julius · Post by **Julius** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 2:42 am

I liked it, Nora. *pats his back*

Tanistian_Kanea · Post by **Tanistian_Kanea** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:00 am

you could use finale notepad. just type "finale notepad" in google and it should come up with the finale homepage. notepad is a free version of the program with few limitations like the number of instruments. it has a very wide array of digital instrument and is easy to use. only difficult thing to find is the view tab for the rests. other then that it is as easy as selecting note value and clicking where on the staff you want the note to go. hope this helps.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:06 am

Well, I'm trying to save as midi what I've already done of the first track.. each time it makes the sounds weird and stuff so I keep fiddling with the settings. I'll upload it when it's done to see what you folks think.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 3:18 am

// removed file

It was an .mp3 but for some reason when I sent it to my brother his antiviruses popped up. o_O I'll scan my PC before uploading a new one.

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 12:01 pm

Julius wrote:Noradur was doing some mixes a while back. I think everyone would appreciate it, considering the client can actually implant this without scripting a new music system.

Was doing that myself as well, but nobody was really interested in it.

Actually bards playing 'tunes' is quite easy to script.

Juliana D'cheyne · Post by **Juliana D'cheyne** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 12:45 pm

Hadrian_Abela wrote:
Julius wrote:Noradur was doing some mixes a while back. I think everyone would appreciate it, considering the client can actually implant this without scripting a new music system.
Was doing that myself as well, but nobody was really interested in it.

Actually bards playing 'tunes' is quite easy to script.

Bards playing tunes would be VERY nice, especially if different tunes could be played for different skills.

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 12:50 pm

If they're treated as 'sounds' similar to the sound you make while mining or smithing, its amazingly simple scripting.

Was once designing songs for a system like this.

If the Devs give me a go-ahead I could try to start it again.

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 1:11 pm

There's currently a discussion about how to implement tunes / custom sounds editor in the upcoming bard system. Status: nothing's for sure

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:09 pm

Well when I figure out how to make different sounds in .midi, I'm willing to make them.. they're really easy if they're single-instrumented, single melodies.

The thing is, whenever I use ANY sound and save it in .midi, it sounds as the same piano-ish sound.. not sure why. :s

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:44 pm

That's because of your playing device. You probably use the MS one (default). That's crap.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 4:58 pm

I actually use a very complex software named Fruity Loops Studio 8. :s

Oh well, I'll figure it out eventually..

Until then, here's a quick example (saved as .mp3 for now) of an idea of "a different melody" depending on the level.. for the lute this time.. As level rises, the melody gets more and more perfect.

You might recognise the tune. ^^

Level 0-20 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/172wos526_j/lute-level-0-20
Level 20-40 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/byt2w3rkh_r/lute-level-20-40
Level 40-60 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/byt2wev7z_v/lute-level-40-60
Level 60-70 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/byt2wu3ci_t/lute-level-60-70
Level 70-80 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/byt2x3quk_o/lute-level-80-90
Level 90-100 lute: http://boomp3.com/listen/byt2z52hk_c/lute-level-90-100

Tanistian_Kanea · Post by **Tanistian_Kanea** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:53 pm

like the idea, but don't recognize the tune

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:54 pm

Lol I must be bad then.

It's one of the combat tunes.

Tanistian_Kanea · Post by **Tanistian_Kanea** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:56 pm

oh... i don't listen to the music IG. i get tired of it's repetitiveness.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:56 pm

Maybe this proposal will make it less repetitive eventually then =p

Tanistian_Kanea · Post by **Tanistian_Kanea** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 5:57 pm

hopefully... a nice 2 or 3 + hours track just for battles would be nice... keep going wonder boy.

Nop · Post by **Nop** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 9:10 pm

Just a few comments on this:

1. MP3s for background music are out of the question. We are not running from a DVD and have always tried to keep the download size down. Those things are huge. Limit for sounds is 4 seconds play time.

2. Midi music is just as easy to script as sounds are.

3. If the combat music is repepetive, just hand me some midi files, the client will select a tune at random from a list (of currently 2 entries). Just remember everything needs to be free of copyright.

4. I like the examples of different musical skill. I'd be happy to include such tunes in the client if someone hacks together the scripts

5. You can use a java midi player like this one here
http://www.myselfasiam.com/midi_player/index.html
to preview how your work will sound in Java.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:14 pm

Good to hear Nop. As soon as I figure out how to make good sounding midi, I'll start working on ~4 seconds long melodies for each instrument with different out of tune ones for different levels. Can these be mp3 since they're not background music?

Nop · Post by **Nop** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:52 pm

LifeWonder wrote:Can these be mp3 since they're not background music?

No way.

I'll try to explain again:
- you cannot play mp3 in Java without additional software
- therefore the client cannot play mp3
- therefore all recorded sounds must be uncompressed WAV-Files

To keep the download size reasonable, there will be no
- long sounds
- unused sounds
- multiple sounds for the same purpose

For your tunes, you would need a large number of them, 5 variations of the song x number of instruments x number of songs. Do the math.

If you figure out how to do nice MIDIs, please do nice MIDIs.

I have just checked sizes. In the same space, we can either add one single sound or we can add 100 midi tunes.

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 11:53 pm

I see.. I'll try to do that then..

What software was used to make the Illarion combat theme music?

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 12:57 am

Aye, sounds okay in Java. I can help making some songs.

In Estralis' bard concept there are 41 songs, 16 of them are just extended ones. So at least 25 different songs. But those songs for "casting" shouldn't be too long, rather a short version, the principal theme or the beginning of the full song.

Just to give an idea of what's needed.

/ oh and:

5 variations of the song x number of instruments x number of songs.

This appears more than it is. The instruments can be quickly exchanged in the original file. About the variations, well, it is easier to make a song sounding worse than composing a good one in the first place

Faladron · Post by **Faladron** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 1:01 am

One intelectual property infringement coming up.

But I'll love to play the first bard songs on ocarinas... WAIT! flutes.. flutes I mean. Flutes. ok?

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 1:10 am

pharse wrote:it is easier to make a song sounding worse than composing a good one in the first place

Actually, in my lute example up there, I created the level 90-100 one first, then began moving/mis placing notes on purpose and saving, then moving/misplacing more and saving, etc.. for each level. :3

Nop · Post by **Nop** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:59 am

Haven't listened to all of them - but have you also worked with note durations?
A beginner's song will tend to have notes of the same durations, usually long notes and no quick variations. (true for about any children's tunes). An advanced player will add much more interesting rythm. Also, the tunes could become longer for advanced players if they are intended for entertainment rather than effect.

Tinya · Post by **Tinya** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 8:31 am

*hopes not too much spamming on the level one, sort of sounds like chalk on a blackboard*

LifeWonder · Post by **LifeWonder** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 9:16 am

Nop wrote:Haven't listened to all of them - but have you also worked with note durations?
A beginner's song will tend to have notes of the same durations, usually long notes and no quick variations. (true for about any children's tunes). An advanced player will add much more interesting rythm. Also, the tunes could become longer for advanced players if they are intended for entertainment rather than effect.

Alright, I'll take that in consideration.

I didn't realise you wanted it to get this complex.

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 10:29 am

LifeWonder wrote:Actually, in my lute example up there, I created the level 90-100 one first, then began moving/mis placing notes on purpose and saving, then moving/misplacing more and saving, etc.. for each level. :3

Yep, that's what I meant.

# I also think that beginner's music shouldn't sound terrible but easier. Of course some mistakes should be there, but not too many.