Illarion.org

Kasume, a few words for the not so wise... I think he was lieing

@Kasume

Talk to Randelf too. It took him a year just to become a master blacksmith. And that was 6 hours every other day. From what he told me at least.

If, in fact this is what he truly did, I would consider that power gaming. If you do anything six hours straight, it is powergaming in my opinion.

As far as mining to sell ores and gems, it's called , a job. Have you ever had one? If you want to survive around here you have to be armed. To be armed you have to get money. To get money, you get, a job.

Everyone must eat. Not everyone wants to farm. I want potions, but I don't want to make them myself. It's called roleplaying.

Did I make it simple enough for you?

So in order to not get in trouble we have to take breaks every 2 hours? Sounds pretty annoying.

supposedly illarion days are 3 hours long. kasume, annoying. HOLY CRAP, i can barely stand to sit infront of my computer for two hours strait doing nothing but work, how do you live? i guess i just dont have what it takes to be a powergamer. 20 minutes is considered a long time of doing the same thing over and over and over and over and over in my book. besides, six hours a day would be two days strait in illarion. all i can say is you got way too much time on your hands.

Let me guess...You played Tibia? If not, play it...nice game.... There u MUST train to be powerful....I trained many hours with my friends, because i wanted kill more powerful monsters...Why can`t I do this here?

i cant stand anymore 2d games, hurts my eyes. if you think its so great you probobly shouldnt be here.

Because how you describe it, it is powergaming and not realy a training.
That game have the title "Roleplay", if you let you explain what roleplay is then i think you have your answer.

If not, a few questions to you.

Is it realistic when i train/raise my ability to dodge hits via a friend who beat me?

Or is it realistic to kill over and over pigs in a row to raise the accuracy from my sword-hits?

You can train in this game, but the question is do you know what is the difference between training and powergaming?

If you want to play good in a Roleplay, ask you always again "Is this behaviour realistic? Could i do this in reallife? Could i do this so often at one day?"

Warrior of Freedom wrote: There u MUST train to be powerful

And that´s the problem, exspecial in Tibia.
Every person which you meet there is powerful etc., but fit that in a roleplay?
I thought always it give a lot of different characters, and not only warriors, or not?
And for example, why should be a Barde a powerfull brave? How many people are in reallife stronge persons?

@Fieps
But think...That game is fantasy...Warriors in medieval trained to be better in sword fighting, better in shielding, better in everything, right? Sometimes they trained lot of hours to be powerful...So why I can`t be powerful in that game? If I`m a warrior why I can`t train? Fantasy = medieval + magic, so if they train in a medieval, I can train in fantasy game...

BTW:Bard must be powerful in sing, or write`ing poems, not fighting...

PS:Hello to everybody, I`m new here

also think, did people go on for hours fighting for their lives against mummies or demons? people didnt fight for days on end. you think you might get a little tired...

@Grob`Ul
Nope, but they train for about month, to go for one day hunting...Or they train all life to win in one tournament...I guess

training for a reasonable amount each day is no prob. just doing it all day everday is a problem.

@Warrior of Freedom.

You didn´t understand me right ( i know it´s a little bit hard, because of my english ) Of course you can be a strong warrior, i have nothing against it. The problem is how will you become one, the manner is deciding. When you need many month, then it sounds legitim.
But if you need only a few days, then i am sure it was powergaming.
Because that´s only possible, if you beat many hours every day monsters and fighters.... and that´s the problem, here is the lack of realistic.

I didn´t say you can´t train, of course you can, but how i said, you have to be sure where the difference between powergaming and training is.

For example if you fight at one day 15 - 30 minutes against mummies / skellis and so one, isn´t it a problem, but if you do it much longer you can´t call it no longer training, then it is powergaming.
Why? Well one of the causes is the calculation of times from the reality to Illarion, it is so one real hour, are eight illarion hours... and so if you would fight one play hour i a row, it would be eight in Illarion. And here we are again at the point, realistic? How Grobul said, a person will be tired, with the time, exspecial after 8 hours fighting.

If you want read more about the calculation of times in Illarion here ---> calendar of Illarion

This game must be realistic, or that game must give fun?? In Tibia I liked few hours of training for skill adv (hour in rl is about 2-3h there)...After training I wasn`t going to hunt, I was chatting with friend, trade`ing, and many other things.... If that game must be so realistic why Gods give ban for everyone who train longer then, hmm, 1 hour? Why that is allowed in game? Why I can train longer then few hours and my char isn`t tired?

BTW: How my Avatar looks? Made it few minutes ago ^^

In my opinion the game is both, fun and realistic, and only because a game is realistic doesn´t mean that it make no fun, or?
If it isn´t so, then i can´t understand why so many people play The Sims, it´s only a Simulation of Reallife.

Yes perhaps you liked that in Tibia to train so long, but in Illarion it is forbidden, because that´s no training. Share the training in many weeks and we have no problem.

Why it is allowed? Easy the game is in a Alpha Phase, many things aren´t implemented. But a "function" like exhaustion were often discussed and will be add sooner or later. And only why things are possible ingame, doesn´t mean that is allowed.

p.s.: i had a mistake in my thought, 1 real hour = 8 illarion hour, not three, sorry.

Ok, U win ^^

And what about my avatar ?:P

I think you can train for a few hours like in the real life, but not the hole day. Sure, you can get better skills in a long time. Tibia is really "un" realistic, so everybody is training hole "real" days (2hours=tibian day).

The problem with skills and powergaming...

The difficulty on raising skills is probably improved, more realistic, and tougher than the past, that's no hidden fact. However, you must powergame at certain points to be good.

For example, how about a dwarven smith that used to have a job as a fine maker of swords? If you want to play that role anytime soon, you better make an endless amount of daggers and shields before you can play it. I know what many are going to say...you roleplay by who you are, not what you do. Well, what you do is a pretty large account for what people consider you to be...

Take Bloodhearte for instance. People would see him more of a threat, he would be a better villian, he's an aspiring priest for Moshran. Unfortunately, he's been killed many times, to the point where he can barely cast a blue flame anymore. Therefore, people don't take him seriously at all, always calling him 'weakling' and 'evil wanna be.' Namely, because he can't really harm anybody due to his weak skills. Sure, he could ROLEPLAY it, but it's sort of hard to get away unscathed, or, in his case, alive, even after he roleplays. Bloodhearte roleplayed an act where he harmed Felkin (although, he didn't hit him in game, because he probably can't anyway). To stop him, Crosis casted on him, in game, although I was just roleplaying. Now Crosis did a good job, because it would make sense to try to stop him with a spell if he was harming a friend of his. Unfortunately, it almost killed Bloodhearte, if he didn't run in time.

Which brings me back to the problem with the paralysis spell. I suppose almost every good mage on Illarion would be considered a powergamer then, because everytime a criminal or such tries to run away, he can't because there are about...20 paralysis spells casted on him at once. That doesn't make much RP sense, to somehow hold somebody for over a minute while he stands there like an idiot, getting blown up, but it's not his fault...the guy can't even talk let alone move an inch. I propose that there's some sort of delay on the paralysis spell, so people can't just take some mana potions, and hit pigs with it to get good, and stop whoever he or she wants any old time. Yet another example of powergaming.

These days, a newcomer MUST powergame to get good. If he or she didn't powergame to become, say, a blacksmith, then it would take well over one or two real-life years just to get good. You can't get by just making 3 daggers a day, if you bother to make any daily. And not everybody can come on eight hours, seven days a week daily. There are jobs people have to go to. Some have to go to school. The skills or realism should be suited to the average gamer, not just the hardcore freaks about it.

OR MAYBE, there should be a condition called 'fatigue.' It's not realistic for somebody to make an ungodly amount of items, kill a huge amount of beasts without getting tired. At least getting physically tired will wear you out and stop you from gaining skill too quickly. Meh...or it could be called 'stamina,' I don't know.

But then again, it's just a game .

Bloodhearte is a bad example, because when i cast spell-fires in doors to hurt people it is normal that they will kill me for doing so.
And when i come then one minute later back to do it again, like Bloodhearte did now and then, they will kill me again.

And when people think, thats a good way to play a evil role they have no right to complain, if they were killed many times. And above all is that no argument to explain how i must powergame, if i play my role in such manner i have to bear the consequences!

You can play other evil roles without being killed.


And nobody say that the current skill situation is perfect, but at the moment it is the only way to avoid that newcomers will be in a few days so strong as people who played already a year.
When it give system functions like exhaustion, it will be no longer necessary to have so a hard skill system.

Viola rarely does anything for any length of time...And I'm having a blast. I can defend myself sometimes, run other times from trouble.

It's the "process" of becoming a great "insert profession here" that is fun...

Viola

Most Players do a horrible Mistake, either in Thinking or Roleplaying.

Never define a new Character through a Profession.
Your Character is NOT used to be a great Dwarven-Smith when he cant even make Daggers.
Your Character is NOT a great Bowman, when he cant devide a Staff from a Bow.

Your Character arrives in Illarion literaly blank, he must learn first.

Also listen to Violas Words, she hits the Nail on the Head.

If you decide the play the (bad) Role of a Mastersmith, you have to play first the Years of Learning to be a Mastersmith.

I disagree Darlok. What were you before you washed up on Illarions shore? When some of us arrived in illarion were not in our youth. Did we not have a life before we got there? Or are you claiming that we all suffer amnesia when we land? If so it makes for short conversations.
"Hello who are you?"
"I forget"
"and what do you do?"
"Erm.... Nope sorry." (joke)
Or perhaps we did nothing with our lives in the decades before our travels. A person needs a trade to afford food, Breatharianism was only an option for people with no choice.
I do agree though that you don't have to be a master smith, carpenter, whatever only an everyday one.
What you do does affect who you are. A smith and a tailor are unlikely to be the same strength or temperament. Some occupations pay much better than others and so lead to different classes of people, and so different forms of behaviour.

Ellaron,
i always said, roleplay as much as you can.
But, according do your "joky" Conversation imagine that:

"Hello, i am just arrived here, i am a mighy Mastersmith from the Dwarfen Empire"
"Oh great" says the Random-Passer-By "I need a new Chain Mail, the last one got ripped appart by a Skeleton! I'll pay you good!"
"Erm ... ChainMail you said? ... i dont know how to make one"

Either you can, or you cannot.
And nobody can, if he just arrived.

If you are playing an alread grown up Character, than modify his background according to the Lack of Knowledge he has in the specific part.

or you could train in secret then get to know people

I, too, think, that Darlok and Viola hit the point.

It is no good roleplay to step in an unknown world, having no skills and no knowledge about it and proclaiming to be a master or some other sort of hero ...

The really good thing here is, that you can play the growing of a character, becoming stronger, wiser, well known, more important, becoming with time a good position in the town, becoming a priest, becoming a great knight, becoming a good politican ....

You take yourself away the fun of developing your char by stepping in the world of Illarion and proclaiming yourself to be allready a hero ...
it would be only a joke, but not a hero.

For example, my char has needed 6 rl-months, until he became a priest of malachin. It was a long story played here and having much fun in playing it, developing the char.
Also Darlok played long time to become the evil one, he is now. I rememberold days, when Ara and Darlok were friends ... and it changed over months.

Another point on this, it is thought, that normally the people were born on the iland and by creating a char, they get known to the public. So there is no need to come to the town with a great background of what hero you are. Develop your normal person to the hero by time.

Fieps wrote:Bloodhearte is a bad example, because when i cast spell-fires in doors to hurt people it is normal that they will kill me for doing so.
And when i come then one minute later back to do it again, like Bloodhearte did now and then, they will kill me again.

And when people think, thats a good way to play a evil role they have no right to complain, if they were killed many times. And above all is that no argument to explain how i must powergame, if i play my role in such manner i have to bear the consequences!

You can play other evil roles without being killed.


And nobody say that the current skill situation is perfect, but at the moment it is the only way to avoid that ne

wcomers will be in a few days so strong as people who played already a year.
When it give system functions like exhaustion, it will be no longer necessary to have so a hard skill system.

I understand there are consequences, and when I cast flame on the entries of doorways, it's only understandable that I get killed. However, people have been using me as quite the scapegoat. Somebody casts in town, somebody who isn't me or isn't even in my group, and they love to assume it's me.

So I'm in town, hiding behind bushes, wearing huge loads of armor, wearing a cloak...yet, somehow, they still manage to see me, even though I haven't ever introduced myself to my enemies. It's unrealistic that they see me, and just attack me. Then when I DO try to run away, even a low level mage can stop me and cast continuous paralysis spells so they can do what they like. There have been MANY instances where I was just killed simply for being present.

Being evil isn't fun anymore these days. There's nothing really 'evil' you can do, because the mods can't play Drahken and Ashkatuul any old time.

*pats Bloodhearte on the back*

The trick may be finding the right people to play with...

In a good storyline there can only be so many of one kind of charater. ((Which kind of segways with GMcFly's post))If there are too many "good guys" it ruins the story.

Its a bit harder in this environment, but in previous free form rpgs I've been in, it was proper etiquette to ask to join a storyline. That way the ratio of diffent types of characters could be evened out.

In the really good storylines, some private ooc conversations between ALL the players is done...deciding before hand which side will win a particular battle. This helps the stories last longer and feel more developed for the players and spectators alike.

As for people coming up and attacking a robed figure that is trying to hide in the shadows? It pretty hard to fix this I guess because many people have a one track mind I guess. Perhaps using the #me is unrecognizable in his dark robe...many many times.

The last thing I can offer is for all the players who come up on a situation, look, listen and learn before attacking. The original players may have a pre-planned agenda and you don't want to mess up their storyline by "killing"/injuring them unnecessarily. If you are in a pre-planned scene...be sure to ((ooc)) that to the spectators ((don't join - watch)).

Good luck! I think we need well played evil characters for many stories...well - well played characters of all alignments really.

Bloodhearte wrote: yet, somehow, they still manage to see me, even though I haven't ever introduced myself to my enemies. It's unrealistic that they see me

I know this problem very well, that´s the mistake from our pseudo heroes they slay all from what they heard it would be evil.

To play a bad boy when you know that most of the people will react so isn´t fun, here you´re right.

But your char provoke this behaviour, too. Because he is known as a rowdier, evil man, and people attack mostly such characters first, because they fear to lost their life through your hand. And so they avoid it via killing you. I know that´s not the best way to prevent the own death, and often the methods bad, too, like situations which you had describe.

The only way to escape all that is , discuss your plans with your roleplay-partner (s), i know it´s frustrating, i wish it would be different. Perhaps later, if we have ways to hide our "number" or similar things.

But generally it is possible to play a evil role good and funny, without that all people arrange a massacre on you, but you must stage situations.

Darlok, buried in my post was the phrase :

I do agree though that you don't have to be a master smith, carpenter, whatever only an everyday one.

But if someone comes up to you and asks for something you cant make you can either make an excuse,
" Ah! I fear I sold the last this morning and will not be making more today".
Or RP pretend
"Would this suit do you think?" #me hands the man a finely crafted chainmail;
the reply hopefully would be along the lines of "Hmm good quality but too small for me."
Or any other number of scenarios. We all complain about the lack of RP yet we don't seem to be able to handle simple situations. I recently handled a robbery very badly recently and missed a good oportunity to RP.

Bloodhearte I know how you feel. My character was wearing and cloak and some bad roleplaying halflings roleplayed assuming I was grant took my cloak off. I mean, I had never met them before and it is unfair to roleplay like that.

@Bloodhearte
I also would like to try playing an evil character. I have always played a good character and would like to try role playing something different. My current character is good though and I do not want to ruin his role by turning him to evil.

I have been trying to find out if we can add new characters to our accounts because I want to add an evil orc to my account.

If I can ever manage to get another character added maybe we could fight together to bring glory to Moshran.