Ideas for poisoning

[Ufedhin]

Technical details ?..i cant add those but whatever else you feel needing to be added to the mantis request go right ahead
But i do think it should be kept simple and to the point.

[GolfLima]

so we have a mantis request befor we have discussed some ideas here?

not sure if this is what all like

[Evie]

The idea is for after discussed here a summary is posted in a mantis ticket. Most developers aka coders focus on mantis tickets.

[GolfLima]

* the ticket does not show all parts / sides of the discussion ....
* some points are not discussed

i would find it better ..first discuss at the forum and than if we have collect our ideas, and have found a solution ( or something near to that ) we give the request to the developer
may be now comes something that is only for some grat and a lot will find it " not so good "
may be only my opinion // all others are happy

[Ufedhin]

Unfortunately it is not possible to please everyone all the time thats life, but better something to start with than nothing yes?,of course i would like a really in depth poison system yet who will do this work?
Jupiter has already done a great job but he has enough on his plate to choke a dragon , as do the other dev's ,all i propose is a simplistic system so that we at least have something.
In the fullness of time we shall idealy have many developers to make illarion as complex and exciting as we all wish.

[Estralis Seborian]

Please include at least the details I was asking for to the Mantis task.

[Ufedhin]

Please include at least the details I was asking for to the Mantis task.

Have you seen the extra details added to mantis yesterday? hopefully this gives you answers .Things like damage amounts are a dev's business,i dont see how i can give those kind of answers.

Ps made another mantis update hopefully this is even more helpful.

[maryday]

Don`t hurry. It`s all gonna be shoved into the throath of the Mantis as soon as...let`s see...

I DO NOT WANT TO PROPOSE A REDO OF THE CURRENT WEAPON CREATION SYSTEM IN THIS POST.

Here some more possible, MORE complicated examples for a(n almost) dynamic smithing/poison system also including curses/blessings/ item treatments.
This post is taking mainly care of weapon production/effects or treatment/effects, not poison creation.
You will notice that the poisons HERE are designed to partially depend upon gems socketet to the weapon.
Just some little ideas...also to underline the difference between "temorary" and "permanently".
Another point for me to write this was to somehow conceal any effect descriptions (of a finished poison) with words. For example the poison in the vial could still receive description by the one who brews it, while the poison applied to the weapon could show the "full effect name" in the item description window, as described below. The ability to "read" the effect from a poisoned weapon might be based upon the skill "Poisoning" or "Poison Lore"=>for Priests/Druids!
Though they might have spells of the school of "Insight" for such cases? (Detect Poison, Identify Poison?)

And yes, i got some headache just from writing this. So be carefull ;P (("Unbreakable" may either mean: The object may not be repaired. OR: The object repair costs are increased => the higher the "unbreakable" stat, the higher the additional costs.))

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-"almost unbreakable decaying club", (almost=quality indicator for the following; other indicators might be: sturdy looking/sturdy/almost u./probably u./completely u.),
(unbreakable=god/altar granted enchantment; does not degrade durability on attack success or any parry throw. ((DO attack failures cause weapon degredation?)); The same bonus may be granted upon weapon production by using rare ingredients, not only as treatment thereafter)
(decaying=poisoning success will degrade weapon durability by the same % as total poison damage compared to total weapon damage=the higher the poison damage compared to dealt weapon damage, the higher the additional weapon degredation);

prepared with "black mud of forgetting", (black=the most powerful gem socketet is obsidian=>choose a matching basic effect, probably a basic min.damage bonus maybe of elemental kind?),
(mud=derived from the way of production; other indicators might be water/honey/goo/powder...to express the durability of the poison ((here also divine influence might be adressed, for example using "blessed spring water" =>see below)) )
(forgetting=ESS penalty for victim upon poisoning sucess+stunted mana regen.; Other indicators could be: stumbling (DEX) / heartache (END) / headache (WIL)...);



-"decaying great sword of novice mutilation",(decaying=as above),(novice=low mod to the following; higher mods could be: apprentice/journeyman/master/grandmaster...),
(mutilation=low risen crit Dam chance, low rised chance of bleeding; other indicators might be: butchering (bleeding chance bonus highly increased), beheading (medium risen crit dam chance), rending (partial negation of light armours), maiming (partial negation of heavy armours...);
((You may also turn the name scheme roundabout if it sounds foolish: "Grandmaster great sword of decaying mutilation" or.... "Mutilating novice great sword of decay"....whatever, its only a design descision and should be done after a full list of possibilities is collected.))

poisoned with "hunter weapon eater yellow tongue", (hunter=stunted food-to-health conversion); other indicators might be: warrior (stunted health regen), blood drinker (DoT health loss), flesh eater (stunted max. health) , bone breaker (SPD / DEX decay), mage (stunted mana regen),...
(weapon eater=poisoning success will additionally degrade weapon durability by the same % as total  dealt poison damage compared to max.poison damage. Depending on the lvl. (0.0-1.0) of the "weapon eater" feature of this poison an additional poison damage is dealt which = (% additional weapon durablility decay X lvl. of "weapon eater").
(yellow=the most powerful gem socketet is topaz=>choose a matching basic effect; see above),
(tongue=main penalty indicator for PER; other indicators could be: eye (PER-visually) / fist (STR) / hand (DEX) / head (WIL)...,



-"completely unbreakable burdening spirit hammer",(completely=as above), (unbreakable=as above),
(burdening=END penalty for the user to counter the bonus of "probably" to "completely"; other indicators might be: etiolating (CON), enervating (WIL), numbing (ESS)...)
(spirit=the most powerful gem socketet is diamond; as the indicator is a part of the weapon (effect), it may have to be "activated" either by divine or magical power...);

prepared with "four altars cleansed spring water",(durability=4; effect=slay undead; "=pure spring water blessed on a number of altars); ((Probably any liquid / altar could be involved the same way, from blood, poison to potions. Blessings or curses. Maybe any kind of item could be enchanted. Maybe even ingredients AND finished items seperately, cummulating))

To receive certain effects or weapon features this way, a medium to high number of special ingredients (Demon dog teeth, Black Unicorn Hoof, Kiss of a Nymph...Tears of a loving stone, Tears of a lonely stone...Nargun blessed wood, Nargun blessed clay... Irmorom touched gold ingot, Irmorom granted Gold Ingot, Irmorom given Gold Ingot, Irmoroms beloved Gold Ingot... basic enchanted Merinium Ingot, enchanted Merinium ingot, strongly enchanted Merinium Ingot, powerfully enchanted Merinium Ingot...) might either have to be derived from the existing sys or be created. Most parts might probably be achieved without new graphics.
The more i think about it, the more i tend to like the idea of using differently coloured item overlay "clouds", one for every kind of magical gem, either socketet to weapon or as part of the poison creation process.
That much for now.

The easiest way might be to beef up the Alchemy sys to also contain the poisons. Yet i see no direct way to avoid the invention of "healing arrows"...

I would be very happy if you (player) named one or two features you might like in THIS post. So i may break this headache down to reasonable pieces.
You may also name the idea which you found the most disturbing, if you did not like any at all.

[Ufedhin]

The cost of "black unicorn hoof" is prohibitive and out of reach to most backstreet alchemists,however i did hear its possible to substitute that with a net made from the sound of a stalking cat. the recipe of how to do this is in the tome of a thousand reeds.
Trouble is the time..the time..the time...too few hands to do so much work.

[maryday]

Good. Substitution.
Well emerized is half way polished.
More feedback, please.

[Jupiter]

More feedback, please.

Hardly readable. Way too complicated approach.

[maryday]

Yes. It is meant this way.
((The question is not whether you or i like THIS painting. The question is which colours might look nice beside / added to / subtracted from each other, on an empty canvas.))

What i have found inside the Mantis until now. Hopefully i have not included any fixed ones, or ones near to beeing resolved.
0009952: Poison weapons ((What we talk about here.))

Other issues might be related:

0006820: Balance out number of skills druidism vs arcane magic
0008207: Fighting: Poisoning
0009415: Edittable Alchemy recipe
0009876: Project - Artifacts
0009940: Mana & Hunger bombs does not affect Monsters
0009961: Magical weapon effects
and finally:
0008204: Request for socketing gems into armour

More feedback please.

[Alessaina]

I am locking this topic as we have a mantis task for it now.

http://illarion.org/mantis/view.php?id=9952