The Lyrenzia Foundation / Die Lyrenzia Vereinigung

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:40 am

Yes, and if someone asked you if a fly was big you would say simply say Yes and when I ask you if an elephant was small, you would simply say No.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

Thereadore · Post by **Thereadore** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:52 am

If ssssomeone asssked me if a fly was sssmall I would say, "It isss thisss big" and ssshow with my clawssss.

If sssomeone assked me if an elephant was big, I would say it isss about twice my height.

Sssimple truthful anssswersss to sssimple quessstionsss.

If sssomeone asssks you a quesstion that is "yesss" or "no", do not ssstart talking about their assumptionsss of yesss and no. Thisss generally meansss that either you don't know, or you don't want to anssswer.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:57 am

Wow, listen to yourself. You didn't even answer my yes or no question with Yes or No. Abandoning your own idea already?

You answered by comparing the fly with your claws and compared the elephant to your height.

I answered by comparing Lyreniza to everyone else, and you complain and bitch?

Nice try, but you just contradicted yourself badly.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

Lyrenzia Foundation · Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:11 am

The Lyrenzia Foundation has accepted the application of the
Druids of the Forest
to join the Lyrenzia Foundation.

The Druids of the Forest are now member of the Lyrenzia Foundation.

---

Die Lyrenzia Vereinigung hat den Antrag der
Druiden des Waldes
auf Beitritt stattgegeben.

Die Druiden des Waldes sind nun Mitglied in der Lyrenzia Vereinigung.

Thereadore · Post by **Thereadore** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:17 am

Are you really that sstupid? If a yess or no quessstion can not be ansswered yesss or no, you ansswer it asss ssshort assss you can asss accuratly ass you can.

Big and sssmall are sssubjective.

"Will the foundation make new lawsss and make the people not in the foundation" issss not sssubjective. It isss a sssimple yesss or no. The ansswer isss, yesss, we will make new lawss but no, only poeple in the foundation mussst obey them.

What issss sssso hard for you to figure out?

Oh. I forgot. You're a human.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:25 am

Big and small is subjective but Old and new isn't subjective? Which rock did you crawl out from?

Don't you get tired of contradicting yourself?

What's that you say? Everybody knows which ones are old and new and everybody agrees on the exact wordings? You're a mind-reading lizard or you just like to make assumptions? If this is true then the answer to the question is "Yes we won't make new laws", if not then the answer is "No I can't guarantee that".

Wow, and this was the answer that I said before. What a nice waste of time to come back to the same answer.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

Lyrenzia Foundation · Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:27 am

The Lyrenzia Foundation has added the following existing contracts of ownership to their agreements, so that they can be overseen from the public:

The building known as the Library was founded by the Knights of the Grey Rose and the Order of the Grey Light and is now owned and mantained by the Knights of the Grey Rose and the Order of the Grey Light

The building known as the Silverstar Shop founded by Erdrick and Quain and is now owned and maintained by the Silverstar Merchants.

The building known as the Fluffy Sheep Tavern was founded by the Order of Grey Light and is now owned and mantained by Tialdin.

The building known as the Seahorse was founded by Serpardum and is now owned and maintained by Fieps and Zasmia.

The area known as Dwarftown was founded by Silverbrand and is now owned and maintained by Silverbrand.

The building known as the Workshop was founded by the first settlers and is owned and maintained by the public.

The building in the garden and pigfarm was founded by the first settlers and is now owned by the public and maintained by its occupants during the time of it's occupancy.

The building that is the main shop founded by Eliza and the first settlers and is now owned and maintained by Eliza.

---

Die Lyrenzia Vereinigung hat folgende existierende Besitzverhältnisse in ihren Verträgen mit aufgenommen, so dass sie von den Bürgern nachgeschaut werden können:

Das Gebäude, welches als die Bibliothek bekannt ist, wurde von dem Orden des Grauen Lichts und dem Zirkel der Grauen Rose erbaut, wird von ihnen unterhalten und ist in deren Besitz.

Das Gebäude, welches als der Silver Star Laden beaknnt ist, wurde von Erdrick und Quain erbaut, ist im Besitz der Silver Star Merchants und wird von ihnen unterhalten.

Das Gebäude, welches als die Fluffy Sheep Bar (Taverne) bekannt ist, wurde vom Orden des Grauen Lichts erbaut, ist im Besitz von Tialdin und wird von ihm unterhalten.

Das Gebäude, welches als das Seahorse Inn bekannt ist, wurde von Serpardum gebaut, ist nun im Besitz von Fieps und Zasmia und wird von ihnen unterhalten.

Das Gebiet, bekannt als die Zwergenstadt, wurde von den Zwergen von Silberbrand erbaut, ist in deren Besitz und wird von ihnen unterhalten.

Das Gebäude, welches als die Werkstatt bekannt ist, wurde von den ersten Siedlern erbaut, ist in öffentlichen Besitz und wird von den Bürgern unterhalten.

Das Gebäude, welches als der Magierturm (beim Schweinegarten) bekannt ist, wurde von den ersten Siedlern als Wach- und Schutzturm erbaut, ist in öffentlichem Besitz und wird von den jeweiligen Bewohnern unterhalten.

Das Gebäude, welches als der Laden bekannt ist, wurde von den ersten Siedlern und Eliza erbaut, ist in Elizas Besitz und wird von ihr unterhalten.

Thereadore · Post by **Thereadore** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 12:02 pm

You are an idiot. A new law would be one that doessss not exissst now.

I would sssuggessst you ssspend sssome time in a library and look up wordsss in the common langauge, assss obvoiusssly it issss your 3rd or 4th langauge if you do not even know what new meansss.

Why do I feel like I"m having a battle of witsss with an unarmed opponent, when I would jussst like sssome quessstionssss anssswered.

Roke · Post by **Roke** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 5:52 pm

\Thereadore, you have said nothing of great value in the last 10 pages or so of parchment. The only reason you do not like this is the fact that instead of people obeying these laws individually, with some variations in the laws a large group of people have gotten together and agreed on a wording of these laws to enforce, and are enforcing them together. It is just like before except instead of 10 or so smaller groups it is one large group. There is nothing to be afraid of.

Drathe · Post by **Drathe** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 8:53 pm

I find it worrying that a certain high and key member of the Foundation can not answer questions throw at him, by more than one person in qestion, with out loosing his composure and sounding uncouth, even throwing in a few insults to boot. Altho..us humans are only human. In a Foundation which is multi racial and holds so much power of 'us' common people. I find this behaviour to be of very poor show, intemprent and almost child like, not at all becomming of a man of his statue.

paul laffing · Post by **paul laffing** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 9:13 pm

Dyluck, if you have any brains at all, then use them, I was saying comparing what Laranzia could become if they only have members that agree with them and show no constructive criticisms to a king that makes his advisors his best friends who don't tell me if something he does is wrong. Then, you said, "Oh no, thats not what you meant," and went onto some meaningless garbage that was not even close to what I was trying to say. Do not put words in my mouth, because they usually leave a sour taste.

Lennier · Post by **Lennier** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:30 pm

I didn`t read everything of this thread, but when i readed the post of Paul, I have to think there is a misunderstanding.

Constructive cristicisms are very important.
And if i understand it right, Lyrenzia has nothing against them.

All guilds and people who say, that they can follow the laws of Lyrenzia can be a part of the Lyrenzia Foundation.

Lyrenzia doesn`t need people inside of the council, who are against everything, who boycott all elections and can not follow resolutions, which are elected by the majority of other members of Lyrenzia. Everyone who want to join Lyrenzia has to accept, that not everything can happen how he would like to see, he has to live with the laws.

If anyone wants to change something (laws, resolutions etc.) he can trie to get the majority for his opinion. If he failed he can`t say: "You are against my proposal/opinion, therefore I m against you and leave the foundation". He has to follow...

Lyrenzia doesn`t need and want destructive critics.

All others are welcome and Lyrenzia works to get a good system to assimilate all who wants to be a part of it.

Those are my opinions to the topic.

Lennier,
noble knight and trademaster of the Grey Rose

paul laffing · Post by **paul laffing** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:36 pm

Thank you. You made more sense in that post than Dyluck in every single post he made. And he's a leader of this thing, too...

Fieps · Post by **Fieps** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:43 pm

To Paul Laffing, all what i read from you is to provoke Dyluck.
I do not see that as constructive criticism.

And Lyrenzia have no leaders, only members.

Caranthir the great · Sat Apr 19, 2003 10:49 pm

Aye.
As I stated to Ellaron, in my opinion Lyrenzia needs critizism to develope itself. However the critizism should be constructive, not critizism just because you can critizise.

'Any fool can critizise, complain or condemn -and most fools do'.
-Old dwarven saying.

Viola Thistle · Post by **Viola Thistle** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:26 pm

Well, I for one, ask that we move on to whatever maybe the first order of business. This post has become severly sidetracked and it seems to me that nothing is being accomplished, at least not in an orderly fashion.

Do we have a working draft of the Laws of Trollsbane yet?

Does Lyrenzia have an outline of topics that need to be discussed by members, such as committees, by-laws, procedures?

There needs to be a structure, contacts and written documents.

Is there a head count of the members?

Has research been conducted to find what the current member population holds as Laws of Trollsbane?

As a member wanting to contribute positively, I need to know where we are in achieving our goal.

Signed with large flowing script,

Viola Thistle, Hobbiteer

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:45 pm

Thereadore wrote:You are an idiot. A new law would be one that doessss not exissst now.

So everybody knows which ones are old and new and everybody agrees on the exact wordings? Everybody agrees that the Lyrenzia laws are all the exact wording of the old laws? Oh wait, didn't you disagree about that before? So you're a mind-reading lizard or you just like to make assumptions? If this is true then the answer to the question is "Yes we won't make new laws", if not then the answer is "No I can't guarantee that".

Wow, is it just me or have I said that before already?

paul laffing wrote: Thank you. You made more sense in that post than Dyluck in every single post he made.

Dyluck wrote: To answer your question, I first ask you a question:
Do I get represented if you do something I don't agree with?

If I don't agree with you I can tell you it, but if you continue, there's nothing I can do except maybe use force on you. If I'm well respected and a lot of other well respected people tell you the same, then there's a better chance you'll listen to my disagreement, right?

All the same with Lyrenzia.

I answered your question long ago already. Don't blame others just because you stop reading when someone disagrees with you.

paul laffing wrote: Then, you said, "Oh no, thats not what you meant," and went onto some meaningless garbage that was not even close to what I was trying to say. Do not put words in my mouth

Once again, do you know what Irony is?

paul laffing wrote: I mean, its like a king making all his counselors his best friends so that they never tell him anything bad about what he does

paul laffing wrote: comparing what Laranzia could become if they only have members that agree with them and show no constructive criticisms

Hey, if you want to go on talking about what Lyrenzia COULD become, then feel free as long as you look at your grammar and check the tense so that you don't make an incorrect analogy about what it IS right now.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Apr 19, 2003 11:50 pm

Dear Viola Thistle,

Some of your questions can be answered if you visithere

As I said, we are currently working on a Judicial System and a Public Voting system, as well as a SMACC council to manage prices on the SMACC list.

With the Public Voting system, Non-guild people will soon be able to vote representitives amongst themselves into the Lyrenzia Foundation, after we have completed our system that determines who they are, verifies their existance, approves adequate time of residency in Troll's Bane, and work out the details of their terms in office.

With the Judicial System, there are some things to think about.
What will happen to those found guilty of a crime might depend on what "the people" value more.

Is it Freedom or Peace?
Is it due process or crime control?

If we chose peace, then we would throw every person in jail for a certain time whenever we found guilty of a crime, then it would take those criminals off the streets and eliminate most needs of using violence to deal with them.

If we choose freedom, then prison time would be only one option if those found guilty wanted to co-operate for the greater good of society. If they do not choose prison, then the only other option is to label them as an exile for a certain time in which justification is given to anyone for attacking them if they are in town ((Res-kill rules still apply. Must give reasonable time and chance to leave if they are revived)). In this case, peace may only come if exile is enough of a deterrent or those found guilty choose to co-operate.

Freedom is the default right now.

Feel free to give your opinion.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

paul laffing · Post by **paul laffing** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 1:30 am

Dyluck wrote: Hey, if you want to go on talking about what Lyrenzia COULD become, then feel free as long as you look at your grammar and check the tense so that you don't make an incorrect analogy about what it IS right now.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

I was saying that what it would become, and then I said that what it can become is like my analogy. "Its" is a contraction of "it" and "is". It happens to be a pronoun, so its a substitution for a noun, not something particular to tense. "Is" is subject to tense, and it happens to be present tense. But in the way I was using it, I was comparing something NOW. I didn't compare it then, and I'm not comparing it in the future. Now, to move on, because I have wasted enough of my time with this grammar lesson.

Albernon · Post by **Albernon** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 2:37 am

Errr...IS is particular to present tense like you said, and so is IT'S
You might want to check your grammar lesson

And the fact that you are comparing it to Lyrenzia NOW is the whole problem, because it is an incorrect comparison to what Lyrenzia is NOW

paul laffing · Post by **paul laffing** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 3:07 am

no, I was comparing it to what Lyrenzia might become in the future, but I'm comparing it now, and don't rip apart my message, you know what I meant. And by the way, "it's" is possessive of it.

Kasume · Post by **Kasume** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 3:57 am

This has nothing to do with the situation....but what does grammer mean exactly?

((from what I know in the middle ages not many could actually write correctly.))

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 4:06 am

paul laffing wrote: I mean, its like a king making all his counselors his best friends so that they never tell him anything bad about what he does.

People don't KNOW what you mean if you don't use the right tense. It was your own fault for using the wrong tense if you wanted to compare what Lyrenzia COULD become. Comparing something to what you think Lyrenzia COULD become and what it IS now is VERY different.

You might want check your own writing more often for the source of the problem in your disagreements instead of insulting other people.
You've got it's and its reversed.
It's is the contraction. Its is the possesive.
Contractions are the ones with apostrophes.

Thereadore · Post by **Thereadore** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 5:21 am

I have all the ansswersss I need now.

The foundation issss made up of people who do not know what the foundation issss.

The foundation may or may not make new lawsss as they have no idea what they are doing.

Thissss isss the reassson we can't get a ssstraight anssswer, they don't know.

I"m finissshed with thisss until sssuch time asss sssomeone triesss to enforce a law on me that doesss not exissst now, then I will fight.

Thereadore

Grant Herion · Post by **Grant Herion** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 5:22 am

There are five leaders of this whole thing, but I do not see any of them doing anything, except Headmaster Dyluck. How many votes are needed to get a single guild in? Do all need to agree? And who will enforce the laws to protect the towns people? Because I am sure I will need lots of protection from strong people when I reach Trollsbane.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 5:38 am

To Grant Herion,

There are currently 7 guilds, each with a councillor (representitive) in the Lyrenzia Foundation. When a Registered Guild applies to join the Lyrenzia Foundation, a voting period commences between the existing coucillors of the Lyrenzia Foundation. The guild becomes accepted if there are more votes to accept it than there are votes to not accept it by the end of the voting period.

Enforcement of the law will mainly depend on the people who follow the law and decide to uphold it, as it has always been. There is not enough manpower and availability of it to distribute across time and place as official guards or law enforcers. The Lyrenzia Foundation can only act as a unified and bigger voice to label those we find to be criminal. As for what we can do in terms of punishment and deterrence, I have described a few posts above.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

paul laffing · Post by **paul laffing** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 4:26 pm

paul laffing wrote:Wait, but are the people who don't agree with some of things Lyrenzia does going to be represented? I mean, its like a king making all his counselors his best friends so that they never tell him anything bad about what he does.

If you actually read my message instead of trying to pull it apart to find mistakes to make yourself feel smarter

, you'd have seen that I was saying a Lereanzea without critisicm is like a king with only friends as counselors. And don't tell me what the people don't know, because what if they aren't idiots, and understand what I am saying? Anyway, thanks to Dyluck's bitter hostility, I am against this. Thanks Dyluck!

((hey, if you can find a library for common people in the middle ages, I'll pay you.

))

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Apr 20, 2003 5:10 pm

Be sure that there are discussions within Lyrenzia, as well as critics. But since we have learned from the last few trials to build up a guild council. town council, smacc council and the one or other town council again, these things will be discussed by the Lyrenzia representative members themselves. All he last times, there were several people talking everything bad or annoying the organisators until there was nothing done any more.
But in these times, we need actions to be done.
For now, everyone can donate to Lyrenzia, for the project of building town walls.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:06 am

paul laffing wrote: Wait, but are the people who don't agree with some of things Lyrenzia does going to be represented? I mean, its like a king making all his counselors his best friends so that they never tell him anything bad about what he does.

If you had wrote IT WOULD instead of IT IS, then it would have been alright.
Writing what Lyrenzia IS like and what it WOULD be like is two VERY different expressions. If you want to express something then write it accurately and not something that expresses something else completely different. Don't blame other people when you start disagreements because you don't use the language properly.

I didn't show you any bitter hostility. You're the one who made all the the insults and childish remarks.

I just kept telling you that what you wrote is incorrect. You just have an overreaction problem when other people tell you that you're wrong.

Dyluck
Headmaster of the Magic Academy

Lyrenzia Foundation · Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:50 am

The Lyrenzia Foundation has accepted the application of the
Hobbiteers
to join the Lyrenzia Foundation.

The Hobbiteers are now members of the Lyrenzia Foundation.

---

Die Lyrenzia Vereinigung hat den Antrag der
Hobbiteers
auf Beitritt stattgegeben.

Die Hobbiteers sind nun Mitglied in der Lyrenzia Vereinigung.