Mr. Cromwell wrote:
I don't see how the fact that the game is run by Germans (and an odd evil Austrian lurking around here and there) should change anything regarding the treatment of german-speaking in relation to the non-german speaking players.
The German players, contrary to what you are insiunating, are just as much guests here as you and me (with the exception of those germans who belong in the verein/staff).
Have you ever been to an internet forum where english is the main language and if you so much as said was ist los they would IP ban you and then mock you for pages and pages? What would illarion be like if the german creators and current operators of this organization would be like that? It is well within their rights to cut half of the playerbase, most of which is almost entirely non-german speaking arrogant jerks who enjoy to spam and complain to the staff. We are certainly guests to this game, and we are lucky that eight or nine years ago the game was open to both languages.
The main difference between "us" and "ze germans" is simply the larger presence of "knowing eachother"-factor.
And the differance between "You" and "Other People" is simply the larger presence of "platitudinaly used quotes"
What I mean by this is that the people who post in that particular thread, for instance, are more likely to have met and made friends with the staff face to face. Because we are humans and such, this might often translate into somewhat different treatment in cases of misbehaviour. Which is understandable.
If its understandable, then why have you complained about it in your first paragraph if you agree with the base point that I have made?
They can spam, because the moderators are natively german. This means they understand their kind of humour, and can appreciate it more. They see it less as spam, and more as a humorous note in a serious discussion
This "cultural" difference rather then "language" difference is what I mean by calling something spam versus something humerous, but even without the language barrier different people call something spam. In my definition spam would be totally unrelated to the title of the topic. However others would say something different.
This is true. Remember that non-native germans are basicly guests to this german made game. Most of the staff is german and germans in effect run the show.
'Cause there's a place for spam (the Off-Topic) there's no need to spam anywhere else.
Every spam in the wrong place will be deleted and the account will get an admonishment and an information about it.
The third admonishment means a ban from the board with all associated boardaccounts aswell.
All existing admonishments will count of course.
Arien Edhel wrote:You want me to act – so here's my decision:
'Cause there's a place for spam (the Off-Topic) there's no need to spam anywhere else.
Every spam in the wrong place will be deleted and the account will get an admonishment and an information about it.
The third admonishment means a ban from the board with all associated boardaccounts aswell.
All existing admonishments will count of course.
@Returner
Yes, I have and am in fact a member in several such communities. But what on earth is the relevance of this regarding Illarion?
From beginning on, it was a conscious decision to design and make the game bilingual (actually, initially it was planned to make the game trilingual). As it was done by the (German) staff willingly and without any coercion, I am not sure if it warrants any further gratitude than we ought to feel for them providing and developing the game in general. So, what they ‘allow’ us English-speakers to do is to enjoy the game just as they ‘allow’ the Germans-speakers to do. Why should I bend over backwards to be grateful for that? Or somehow be more grateful than Hans-Jürgen ze German, who is precisely as much of a guest here as I am?
So, while it might be within their ‘rights’ to ban English, or German, or only accept Swahili.. well, that would firstly be contrary to the original game design, secondly be catastrophic for the game and thirdly be extremely retarded. Do you feel grateful Nitram in particular as well, for not banning you.. even though it would be within his rights to do so..? I would only feel grateful if I deserved to be banned from here, and wouldn’t be. So if you think that you (personally) are somehow defected as a player don’t deserve to be allowed to use English here for whatever reason, knock yourself out when it comes to expressing gratitude for ‘allowing’ you this 'right'.
Understandable =/= Acceptable. We are humans and this is how we psychologically function, however it doesn't mean that this would be right. I merely offered an explanation, not statement in that paragraph. Personally I just can't be arsed to moderate German posts at all, because due to my rudimentary understanding of the language the precise meanings (not to mention finer nuances or subtle insinuations) escape from me. As there is no objective qualification of spam (and it’s up to the moderators to judge each case individually) then if the feelings and opinions of the moderator are present especially in borderline cases. However, according to my observation (which is rather accurate) Germans who strand in the typical-English “omglulz poo” spamming receive the exactly same treatment as non-German speakers.
By the way, congratulations for completely ignoring the contribution of many wonderful English-speaking staff members who have been maintaining and improving the game, as well as for branding half of the game community as ‘mostly jerks’. Well, maybe you have reflected a bit too much of your own qualities while making the generalization.
There are many reasons from a developers standpoint why a single language game would be much easier, and definately not catastrophic.
First and foremost, it takes resources to translate a game to another language, this can produce delays in development. Secondly a single language audience means everyone playing can understand everyone else. This prevents mis-understanding, mis-translation and any argument regarding whether spam is humour or not to any given linqual audience is completely squashed.
Would the playerbase take a significant hit? Maybe. You can't actually say for sure. There are dozens of region specific video games which generate larger playerbases in one area without having to cater to several areas.
As for gratitude, I am very grateful to the many english speaking staff members that never seemed to stay around long enough, I'm also grateful that I have the ability to still post here, whether I'm a jerk or not.
As for rights, you have no rights on this forum that are in any way stable. The moderators can delete your posts, stab you in the eye through your monitor, ban you without any prior warning if they chose to do so, and this is true also for the game, for both german and english players.
A legitimate player is not a guest, and I probably could have worded my words a little better. Players aren't guests, they are more like adopted children or pets, these are player forums, for players.
These spammers who are not players, or who are ex-players and have absolutely nothing to contribute should be banned. Spammers who are players and have absolutely nothing to contribute should be exposed to a warning/banning system or a loss of priviledges.
In short, if you don't play the game presently, or ever, and you have nothing nice to say, the staff ought feed you to the mummies.
