On smithing

[Estralis Seborian]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

[Saril]

Übersetzung sinngemäß

Liebe Illarioner,
ich sehe das Schmieden zurzeit als Vertreter für alle fertigenden Prozesse an. Ich habe hierfür eigene Konzepte zur Verbesserung des Systems aber ich möchte andere Meinungen kennen. In diesem Zusammenhang habe ich drei fragen an euch:

• Was gefällt dir momentan am Schmieden?
• Wie würdet ihr in einigen Worten ein perfektes Schmiedesystem beschreiben?
• Um an eure Visionen für das Schmieden zu verwirklichen, was würdet ihr ändern?

Schon einmal danke im Voraus - schreibt bitte keine langen Aufsätze, umso mehr (verschiedene) Gedanken umso besser. Ihr könnt auch kleine Vorschläge geben um das System zu ändern (z.B. Artikel xyz soll nicht Ressource ab brauchen) aber ein allgemeiner Vorschlag hilft mehr. Und bitte pickt nicht andere Post auseinander ohne alternative Gedanken dazu zu äußern.

[Saril]

1. Mir gefällt am Schmieden das man viele verschiedene Dinge braucht um einen Gegenstand herzustellen und das so auch Schreinern, und Färben neben den normalen Schmiedebergauhandwerken gebraucht werden.

2. Ein perfektes System sollte gut verknüpft sein mit den anderen Handwerkssystemen. Es sollte so viele logische Einbindungen haben wie technisch möglich sind. Es sollte eine gewisse Schwierigkeit haben Schmied zu werden und hohe Stücke herzustellen. Es sollte aber auch von Nichtschmieden die harte Arbeit anerkannt werden.

3. a) Durch das Schmelzen sollte man nicht so weit kommen wie jetzt. Wenn überhaupt dann höchstens 1/3 des jetzigen
b) für Rüstungen sollte man nicht nur Leder brauchen sondern auch gefärbte Stoffe (z.B. leichte Elfenrüstung = Eisenbarren, weißer Stoff, Leder)
c) hohe Werkprodukte sollten nur sehr schwer gefunden werden (keine Hochendprodukte bei Schätzen mehr (wurde ja schon mal besprochen)

Sind nur meine ersten Gedanken ^^

[Olive]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

There are only a couple things i would like to see 'adjusted' for smithing.

1) make smithing strength based, not dex based. this is more logical in my opinion.

2) allow item repair to IMPROVE weapon or armor wear without damaging quality if additional resources are used in the repair. For example. I want to repair a serinjah. I would shift clickthe sword, and a iron ingot, and a 'better repair' is activated, where there is a good chance that the weapons wear is improved without harming the quality. not 100%, but perhpas a ratio of skill obtained / skill needed, to a maximum of maybe 60%

3) somethign has to be done to encourage mining. maybe this means improving the gem rates. or working on ways to not discourage miners from playing. This IS related somwhat to the no mule in mines change that occured over summer, and soem compromise should be looked at since it seems that ALL mining for profit was squelched at that point. (yes i know there are 2 peopel who still do but 2 peopel cannot support 5 million smiths)

4) i would like to see merchants buy more of the product so smiths who have no export market dont have to keep makingthe same item over and over just so they have something to sell. No, they cannot just find people to sell to as 98% of the people will only buy form a specific person so new smiths cannot even start to sell anythign until they are well skilled or get lucky.

5) some of the smithign steps just take too long, 31 hammer hitsfor one step is enough t put even a meth addictto sleep

[Weilanderus]

zu 1.
das wenn es auch frustrierend sein kann der meisterschmiedlevel sehr
hoch ist und lange dauert.
2.)
Wenn ein Schmied wirklich gebraucht werden würde,das heißt am
anfang weniger lernen, als es mom. möglich ist(zB. die allgemein
beliebten Serinjahschwerter).Wenn ein Schmied aufträge hat, aber
auch demenstprechend einkaufen muss(Holzwaren,Stoff,farbe,leder)
(da fällt mir ad hoc ein das es im mittelalter durchaus den beruf des
gerbers gegeben hat).Das heißt er muss eingebunden sein in Aufträge
und Handel)
3.)
die Waffenwirkungen sind nicht praktikabel, die meisten Krieger
bevorzugen 2 Serinjahschwerter , die sie da sie ziemlich weit oben
stehen selber schmieden und reparieren.die wirkung von einem
Schild erhöhen, aber auch das kaputgehen dabei(zb wirkung eines
streitkolbens auf ein schild ist nach einem kampf schon fatal).
maulesel die eisenhufe tragen.
Und ganz wichtig versuchen den handel zum laufen zu bringen...
(um sich zu steigern zwergenpanzer zu machen und nach trolls zu
bringen ist zwar lukrativ , aber nicht spannend)
Und zwergenpanzer sind nur für zwerge tragbar, elfenpanzer nur für
elfen, und der rest für menschen(evt ork panzer einfügen?)

[Q-wert]

[Genorögel]
Ich habe letztens in das Schmieden hineingeschnuppert, dabei sind mir hauptsächlich zwei Sachen aufgefallen die meine Figur gleich wieder zum Vollberufkämpfer gemacht haben:

-Rohstoffmangel
Als unerfahrener Schmiedehandwerksspieler kann man neue Rohstoffe zum Schmieden nur äußerst mühselig selber besorgen, kaufen ist hoffnungslos, die Preise für einen Barren übersteigen bei weitem die Erlöse für einen Barren umgewandelten Lowlevelzeug (zb. Nägel werden von den Meisten die sie für ein anderes Handwerk brauchen selbst hergestellt).

-Fehlende Items für die es Absatz gibt
Mit einem standartmäßigen Kämpferchar ist das Einzige, was von Schmieden gebraucht wird, gute Rüstungen.
Ich schätze einmal, dass diese aber ziemlich weit oben im Powergamebedarf platziert sind, alles andere für den Kämpfer (etwa Waffen), der im aktuellen Wirschaftssysthem das Geld in die Welt bringt, gibt es kostenlos bei den Roten, Gnollen und Banditen.
[/Genörgel]
Aber zu den Fragen:

1: Mir gefällt an dem Schmieden die einfache, wenn auch unrealistische Handhabung, die aber schön viel Platz für Rollenspiel lässt.
(man nehme einen Kaltbarren, tu ihn auf den Amboss, haut zweimal drauf und hat fünf Nägel. Esse und pipapo kann man wunderschön beschreiben ohne dass das Systhem nervt)

2: Ein Perfektes Schmiedesysthem sollte funktionieren ohne dass der Schmied zur eierlegenden Wollmilchsau wird und sich die Rohstoffe selber ausbuddelt, die Griffe schnitzt und sich rundum einfach selber versorgt.

3: Konkrete Vorschläge:

-Jungschmiede sollten ihr Billigzeug zu etwas erhöhten Konditionen an NPC`s verkaufen können. (etwa ein Händler in Bane, der für 10% mehr als den allgemeinen Barrenpreis die entsprechende Anzahl Nägel ankauft oder ein kleines Questchen das man auch finden kann)

-Die Möglichkeit die Qualität von Gegenständen durch Reparieren ,wenn natürlich auch nur geringfügig, zu steigern.

-Mehr, auch hochwertige, Erzeugnisse aus anderen Handwerken mit einbeziehen. So könnte man den Schneidern zum Beispiel die Möglichkeit geben die Lederkomponenten der Rüstung seperat anfzufertigen, die dann zum Schluss vom Schmied eingefügt werden.

[Saril]

....
Und zwergenpanzer sind nur für zwerge tragbar, elfenpanzer nur für
elfen, und der rest für menschen(evt ork panzer einfügen?)

Dem Stimme ich zu aber ich würde nach der Größe gehen. Zwerge, Halblinge, Gobblins und Gnome sind ja etwa gleichgroß bzw Elfen, Menschen Ork. Vielleicht sollte es auch soetwas wie ein Malussystem dabei geben (viel Arbeit ich weiß, lohnt also den Aufwand nicht) oder eine Generrelle Sperre für einige Rassen z.B Ein Ork/Zwerge zieht niemals eine magische Elfensilberstahl, eine Silberstahl oder leichte Elfenrüstung

[Vern Kron]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

There are only a couple things i would like to see 'adjusted' for smithing.

1) make smithing strength based, not dex based. this is more logical in my opinion.

2) allow item repair to IMPROVE weapon or armor wear without damaging quality if additional resources are used in the repair. For example. I want to repair a serinjah. I would shift clickthe sword, and a iron ingot, and a 'better repair' is activated, where there is a good chance that the weapons wear is improved without harming the quality. not 100%, but perhpas a ratio of skill obtained / skill needed, to a maximum of maybe 60%

3) somethign has to be done to encourage mining. maybe this means improving the gem rates. or working on ways to not discourage miners from playing. This IS related somwhat to the no mule in mines change that occured over summer, and soem compromise should be looked at since it seems that ALL mining for profit was squelched at that point. (yes i know there are 2 peopel who still do but 2 peopel cannot support 5 million smiths)

4) i would like to see merchants buy more of the product so smiths who have no export market dont have to keep makingthe same item over and over just so they have something to sell. No, they cannot just find people to sell to as 98% of the people will only buy form a specific person so new smiths cannot even start to sell anythign until they are well skilled or get lucky.

5) some of the smithign steps just take too long, 31 hammer hitsfor one step is enough t put even a meth addictto sleep

1) Lets not mess with the attributes -please-. For all that is good, leave the friggen attributes alone. They are a pain to try and mess with to start with.

2) Two seems ok, but that would just result in everyone taking up repairing their stuff all the time, with no smith.

3) I like the idea of 'encouraging' mining. But maybe we should have some more 'public' mines. Right now, there are three mines that I know of that give coal. One is closed off due to IG things, one is very distant from the rest of the island and technically you should pay to use it, and one is through a forest and way out in the middle of no where.

4) I disagree with the reasoning behind this, but I do agree with some changes to the npcs. Npc's by smithed stuff for very little, such as a serinjah sword for like 10 copper, and then sold back for a silver, or more.

5) Some of the steps do take a while, but I think it is important to do that. If not, then we will have so much 'rare' stuff floating around. One of those is the Shield of the Sky. At one time it was extremely rare, now you can find one for a few thread.
---My ideas----

1) More uses for copper. Copper right now, is the laughing stock of the smithing world. Its good for details, and its abundant. It is very rarely used.
2) Balancing the products made. Serinjah's still are quite powerful, to a point where anything else is almost silly to be bought if you want a slashing weapon.
3) The armors themselves are very good, but it seems more and more all warriors will -only- by one type. Maybe after a certain 'level' of smithing, make them all equal, or give one an advantage over anouther, such as "Salkamar can take slashing weapons excellently." "Lor Angur can deflect magic much easier!" "Silversteel can do both, but not as well as either." The same would be for helmets.
4) Give a use or bonus to some of the lesser used objects. Such as the Elven rainbow sword, or the Elven sword. Maybe give them boosts with elves? Maybe some of the axes, yes I know some do have some range to them, should have a bonus when used by orcs or dwarves.
5) Magical elven armor, should be only worn by elves. Otherwise, it isn't 'magical elven armor' its 'Magical one race fits all armor.'
6) Make 'sizes' to the armors. A smaller person would wear a 'smaller' armor. This could be determined if the human has 'short man' he has a 'small armor.' A regular man could wear regular, and a tall man would need 'large' armor. For simplicity, it could be that the small plate armor would fit a small halfling as well, or a small orc, lizard, ect.

[Vern Kron]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

There are only a couple things i would like to see 'adjusted' for smithing.

1) make smithing strength based, not dex based. this is more logical in my opinion.

2) allow item repair to IMPROVE weapon or armor wear without damaging quality if additional resources are used in the repair. For example. I want to repair a serinjah. I would shift clickthe sword, and a iron ingot, and a 'better repair' is activated, where there is a good chance that the weapons wear is improved without harming the quality. not 100%, but perhpas a ratio of skill obtained / skill needed, to a maximum of maybe 60%

3) somethign has to be done to encourage mining. maybe this means improving the gem rates. or working on ways to not discourage miners from playing. This IS related somwhat to the no mule in mines change that occured over summer, and soem compromise should be looked at since it seems that ALL mining for profit was squelched at that point. (yes i know there are 2 peopel who still do but 2 peopel cannot support 5 million smiths)

4) i would like to see merchants buy more of the product so smiths who have no export market dont have to keep makingthe same item over and over just so they have something to sell. No, they cannot just find people to sell to as 98% of the people will only buy form a specific person so new smiths cannot even start to sell anythign until they are well skilled or get lucky.

5) some of the smithign steps just take too long, 31 hammer hitsfor one step is enough t put even a meth addictto sleep

1) Lets not mess with the attributes -please-. For all that is good, leave the friggen attributes alone. They are a pain to try and mess with to start with.

2) Two seems ok, but that would just result in everyone taking up repairing their stuff all the time, with no smith.

3) I like the idea of 'encouraging' mining. But maybe we should have some more 'public' mines. Right now, there are three mines that I know of that give coal. One is closed off due to IG things, one is very distant from the rest of the island and technically you should pay to use it, and one is through a forest and way out in the middle of no where.

4) I disagree with the reasoning behind this, but I do agree with some changes to the npcs. Npc's by smithed stuff for very little, such as a serinjah sword for like 10 copper, and then sold back for a silver, or more.

5) Some of the steps do take a while, but I think it is important to do that. If not, then we will have so much 'rare' stuff floating around. One of those is the Shield of the Sky. At one time it was extremely rare, now you can find one for a few thread.
---My ideas----

1) More uses for copper. Copper right now, is the laughing stock of the smithing world. Its good for details, and its abundant. It is very rarely used.
2) Balancing the products made. Serinjah's still are quite powerful, to a point where anything else is almost silly to be bought if you want a slashing weapon.
3) The armors themselves are very good, but it seems more and more all warriors will -only- by one type. Maybe after a certain 'level' of smithing, make them all equal, or give one an advantage over anouther, such as "Salkamar can take slashing weapons excellently." "Lor Angur can deflect magic much easier!" "Silversteel can do both, but not as well as either." The same would be for helmets.
4) Give a use or bonus to some of the lesser used objects. Such as the Elven rainbow sword, or the Elven sword. Maybe give them boosts with elves? Maybe some of the axes, yes I know some do have some range to them, should have a bonus when used by orcs or dwarves.
5) Magical elven armor, should be only worn by elves. Otherwise, it isn't 'magical elven armor' its 'Magical one race fits all armor.'
6) Make 'sizes' to the armors. A smaller person would wear a 'smaller' armor. This could be determined if the human has 'short man' he has a 'small armor.' A regular man could wear regular, and a tall man would need 'large' armor. For simplicity, it could be that the small plate armor would fit a small halfling as well, or a small orc, lizard, ect.

[Lrmy]

I have been smithing in illarion off and on for some years now and I must say I like the current system quite a bit. It seems like a nearly perfect balance because it makes smiths need to depend on other characters as well as themselves. The complexity required to smith ensures that some newb won't make a pged smith and give out tons of free armor. It also ensures we do not have 10,000 awesome smiths. Remember when people made everything just west of Troll's Bane and you could sometimes find fire/flame items just laying on the ground?

The only thing I would change is the amount of gold and gems in rocks. They are to hard to currently find and make it so that you waist time breaking up rocks in game, which is only fun for so long.

2) Balancing the products made. Serinjah's still are quite powerful, to a point where anything else is almost silly to be bought if you want a slashing weapon.

This is due to a mistake and will be fixed int he future.

3) The armors themselves are very good, but it seems more and more all warriors will -only- by one type. Maybe after a certain 'level' of smithing, make them all equal, or give one an advantage over anouther, such as "Salkamar can take slashing weapons excellently." "Lor Angur can deflect magic much easier!" "Silversteel can do both, but not as well as either." The same would be for helmets.

Armors are also going to be reword(or, I'm pretty sure) there are currently 4 armors, one nearly impossible to get that are all worth while and work better in different cases. The rest do suck...

4) Give a use or bonus to some of the lesser used objects. Such as the Elven rainbow sword, or the Elven sword. Maybe give them boosts with elves? Maybe some of the axes, yes I know some do have some range to them, should have a bonus when used by orcs or dwarves.

Such racial bonuses would just be annoying in game and make little sense. Why would an axe be better for a orc than a human realistically?

5) Magical elven armor, should be only worn by elves. Otherwise, it isn't 'magical elven armor' its 'Magical one race fits all armor.'
6) Make 'sizes' to the armors. A smaller person would wear a 'smaller' armor. This could be determined if the human has 'short man' he has a 'small armor.' A regular man could wear regular, and a tall man would need 'large' armor. For simplicity, it could be that the small plate armor would fit a small halfling as well, or a small orc, lizard, ect.

Role play making the armor different sizes instead of adding in unneeded work. The armor is of elven origin, why couldn't you make it fit other races?

[Juniper Onyx]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

1) I like the items getting harder to make, but they are also worthwhile to make. A new item for each level is very motivating. I also like the need for dyes, gems, copper ingots, handles, poison and leathers, it creates a need to trade and RP with other crafts.

2) A Perfect System-

• Uses a combination of abilities and Racial 'bonuses' to determine quality.
• Availability of resources or 'Providers' such as NPC Miner
• Item for each 'swirlie', to show progress.
• Plenty of items NPC's will buy.
• Items with advantages and disadvantages, but negate each other (No Armor or weapon is "Best"-Balanced).
• Higher level items give higher ability - Better armors/weapons as skill advances.
• Ability to "Enchant" items by mages (More RP with Mages needed).
• Special items only given by a 'Smithing' Guild (NPC or Player).
• High level in this craft, should give 'bonus' to other 'similar' crafts like Goldsmithing.

3) I think the smithing system is pretty good right now. All we need IMO, is more 'external' effects such as allowing 'Enchantments' by mages, more items bought by NPC's, maybe an NPC that sells Ores/gems in 'quantity', some 'special' advantages to belonging to a 'smithing' guild and some balancing of the attributes of weapons and armors.

The crafting system in general is pretty good, but lacks the need for craft "Guilds" since anyone can make anything by themselves. Just as Mages give runes, I believe it would be nice if 'Master' smiths could 'give' blueprints of new designs to other Guild 'Smiths' that the public cannot make.

Also, balancing the armors and weapons is key. Everyone knows that the best armor IG is a 'mid-level' smithing skill to make. Armor's beyond that aren't as good. This is backwards. In the "Dwarves" background, it says something about "Dwarven State Armor" being the best so they can show it to Irmorom. It isn't the best. The 'Best' should be the last to make. Cooking has the same problem. An easy to make food is the 'most filling' while everything beyond isn't.

This may be why many crafters choose "Multicrafting, instead of specializing. If at 50% you can make the "Best", why continue developing that skill? If this was reworked, I think we'd see more masters.

[Llama]

Personally I'd like to see the 15 or so helmets removed and we just have a few 'matching' with the armor, with the same stats as the rest of the armor.

So "platehelm" goes with "platemail"
"Chain Coif" goes with "Chainshirt"

ect...

Currently most people just use flame-helmets.

[Juliana D'cheyne]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

I was not going to suggest anything not knowing of the smithing system but it appears the discussion is on armor and changing it so will put in my two cents from a fighter/other crafter perception.



1. Everytime you have an NPC buy and sell including ore, you are knocking out the player (RP)...i.e. now no one needs to seek a tailor for a bag which is about the only thing the profession could sell. If you want no miners then that is the way to go. If however, you want to encourage players, particularly new ones to mine, make it a little easier for them as Vern suggested.

2. Some weapons attributes need changing... others mentioned are fine as is (having used all swords but no axes, I have found specific uses for all but the short sword and sabre).

There is armor used for "training" and the high end armor. Some of the armor depends on the char/stats how well it works for them. The "word" ig is so and so armor is the best, yet those that actually test a couple of others are pleasantly surprised... the same with helmets, there are a couple very good ones.. but I like the idea of the helmet "matching" the armor (I also think the one most popular is not always the best )

As a side, why are we trying to change a system ig that actually makes copper when so many others don't? Perhaps concentrating on others will eventually tie the systems together or at least give us a better idea what is needed?

Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

From a "buyer" standpoint, the system is fine as is, the prices are reasonable, smiths "appear" to be able to earn copper, I can usually always find one ig.

[Weilanderus]

From a "buyer" standpoint, the system is fine as is, the prices are reasonable, smiths "appear" to be able to earn copper, I can usually always find one ig.

das ist das einzige was ich verstanden habe und demenstprechend wiederspruch einlege.
In Silberbrand herrscht geradezu Hunger nach Aufträgen.Uns ist ein schöner Auftrag in verbindung mit RolePlay allemal lieber, als rüstungen kloppen und zu einem NPC zu verkaufen.und mal ne kurze nachricht an die betreffende stadt schreiben ich bin morgen um die uhrzeit da und es sind mindestens 2 schmiede da!

Wir in SB überlegen uns eh schon ob wir nicht nen Markttag machen, das problem liegt eher darin, Wenn kommen die Besucher auch... Was können wir anbieten was Besucher nicht im normalen Play kriegen das sie denn kommen.Seien wir ehrlich wenn am Markttag kein gewimmel herrscht kommt keine Marktatmosphäre auf!?

Warum ich das jetzt zu diesemThema packe ist eigentlich auf grund dessen, das ja die mine silberbrands wieder kostenpflichtig wird.Dementsprechend es für Newbies schwer wird an Rohstoffe zu kommen fürs Schmieden.Ich und meine Brüder und schwestern gedenken dann an Markttagen durchaus Rohstoffe zu einem günstigen Preis anzubieten, ob eisenbarren oder erz und kohle.
Wie man sieht bleibe ich immer wieder an der wirtschaft hängen die sagen wir im moment noch sehr schleppend ist.

Wen es da nicht ein paar spieler gäbe die Aufträge(viel zu wenige) verteilen, gabe es nur noch NPC handel.

bei ca. 60 Leuten die am tag minimum aktiv sind müsste das handel & tradingboard ja mindestens 20 neueinträge haben??
und sagt mir nicht ein Krieger produziert nix.
wie wärs zb mit hasen und schweinefleisch das wunderbar verkauft werden kann, genauso wie leder(nein nicht mit viel kupferlingen aber es kostet den krieger ja auch nüscht)
und damit das ganze wieder hier reinpasst
erinnere ich daran ohne Handel kein handwerk, ohne Handwerk kein Schmied(in)

[Friedwulfa]

Ich finde das Schmieden wirklich prima, nur sollten ein paar Beschränkungen beim Beruf her. Ein Schmied sollte nicht schreinern können und vielleicht auch gewisse Abzüge beim Miningskill hinnehmen. Dafür sollte ein Miner dann effektiver minen können als alle anderen.

Ansonsten ist das Schmiedesystem toll.

Achja.. vielleicht noch ein paar Spezialwaffen zum selbermachen nur halt mit Mordsaufwand, dafür nimmer im loot von manch einem Monster. magische Serinjahs etc.

[Juliana D'cheyne]

From a "buyer" standpoint, the system is fine as is, the prices are reasonable, smiths "appear" to be able to earn copper, I can usually always find one ig.

das ist das einzige was ich verstanden habe und demenstprechend wiederspruch einlege.
In Silberbrand......................

I would appreciate a translation if I am quoted, the online translator not helpful this time..

[Ivar Kraftimarm]

• What do you like about smithing?

- die verzahnung mit schreinern (griffe)
- die vielzahl der produkte

• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?

- "verzahnt" mit anderen handwerken
- magische gegenstände für meisterschmiede herstellbar

• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

- ein eigenes magiesystem für schmiede wäre traumhaft. sprich der schmied hat seinen eigen magiezwei mit dem er magische gegenstände erstellen kann. damit wäre ausgeschlossen das ein magier, druide etc meisterschmied werden kann. die runen könnte man dann noch rassentyisch varieren, so dass zum beispiel zwerge eine grössere runenauswahl als zum beispiel halblinge haben
mögliche runen wären:
rune der stärke -> steigert die stärke des trägers um 1
rune des schmerzes -> steigert den schaden der waffe
rune der leichtigkeit -> macht den gegnstand leichter
rune des geschicks -> erhöht das geschick
rune der wahrnehmung -> erhöht wahrnehmung
etc.

[Estralis Seborian]

I read every post and appreciate any further input! Way to go, guys and gals !

One tiny request: Do not focus too much on general aspects of the game (slow skillgain, class systems,...) that are the same for every craft.

[Weilanderus]

[/quote]
- "verzahnt" mit anderen handwerken
- magische gegenstände für meisterschmiede herstellbar

• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

- ein eigenes magiesystem für schmiede wäre traumhaft. sprich der schmied hat seinen eigen magiezwei mit dem er magische gegenstände erstellen kann. damit wäre ausgeschlossen das ein magier, druide etc meisterschmied werden kann. die runen könnte man dann noch rassentyisch varieren, so dass zum beispiel zwerge eine grössere runenauswahl als zum beispiel halblinge haben
mögliche runen wären:
rune der stärke -> steigert die stärke des trägers um 1
rune des schmerzes -> steigert den schaden der waffe
rune der leichtigkeit -> macht den gegnstand leichter
rune des geschicks -> erhöht das geschick
rune der wahrnehmung -> erhöht wahrnehmung
etc.[/quote]

Absolut dafür das wäre mein traum und würde auch zu den Zwergen laut illa beschreibung herrvoragend passen

[Saril]

Mh, ganz dagegen bin ich nicht. Kein Schmied sollte magisches Langschwert, Feueraxt, Feuerlangschwert und so weiter herstellen können. Dazu braucht man 100% einen Magier. Aber, jetzt kommt das aber ^^ ein "Magiesystem" mitdem jeder Handwerker Waffen, Schilde, Rüstungen und Werkzeuge verbessen kann wäre zu überdenken.

Vorteile:
1. Diese Handwerker können dan niemalsdie Magie des Magier, Duride, Priester, Barde, Dieb oder Krieger (ist ja mal vorgeschlagen worden) erlernen.
2. Es macht das Handweken begehrter. wer will denn nicht einen Bogen haben der einen Bonus von 1 oder 2 auf Schnelligkeit hat oder eine Rüstung die einen +1 auf Stärke. oder so ^^
3. Man braucht keine neuen Grafiken. gutes neues Langschwert wird zu gutes neues Langschwert mit Rune

[Lrmy]

Uses a combination of abilities and Racial 'bonuses' to determine quality.

Dwarves have the only racial bonus. I hope you do not propose only a dwarf could make a perfect quality item. That would be quite annoying for all other smiths.

Item for each 'swirlie', to show progress.

We do not have enough items to do that. I think there is already enough variety in the weapon/armor category.

Plenty of items NPC's will buy.

Smiths already can get quite rich from the ease of over-pricing. Not to mention we want more player to player interaction, not player to NPC, right?

Items with advantages and disadvantages, but negate each other (No Armor or weapon is "Best"-Balanced).

This is already realized in game and I believe will be even better soon. There is no best armor in game. Drow may be the best right now(except against concussion weapons I think), but that is understandable.

Higher level items give higher ability - Better armors/weapons as skill advances.

Doesn't this contradict your other point? I mean the fact that you said you wanted balanced items then said you wanted better items to be made in later levels. For the most part, the higher skill you have the more useful items you can make right now. There are a few exceptions. We need better items in higher levels, but there needs to be some good lower level armors and weapons.

High level in this craft, should give 'bonus' to other 'similar' crafts like Goldsmithing.

Goldsmithing and smithing are two different skills for a reason I would guess. Maybe if instead of that when you use a copper or gold ingot or gem, you get some goldsmithing skill as well as smithing. I'm not sure how easy that could be done...

[Jupiter]

Zu der Handwerksmagiesache:

Nein, bitte nicht.
Handwerk heißt Handwerk. Das hat nichts mit Magie zutun, nur mit Fleiß und ordentlicher Handarbeit.
Magische Dinge können verarbeitet werden, aber man kann ncihts magisches von sich aus tun. Sonst können wir auch gleich magische Minenarbeiter und heilige Köche IG bringen.

[Christopher..Rigden]

Dear fellow Illarionites,
I am currently taking a look at smithing as a representative of crafting processes. I have concepts of my own to improve the current state but I also want to hear other's opinions. I have three questions:

• What do you like about smithing?
• How would you describe a perfect smithing "system" in a few words?
• To reach a state that comes close to your vision, what would you change about the smithing "system"?

Thanks in advance - you don't need to write long essays, the more (different) opinions, the better. You may also give minor suggestions about what to change (e.g. item xyz should not require ressource abc), but a more general vision helps more. Also, as always, do not pick other's posts to pieces without providing alternative thoughts.

There are only a couple things i would like to see 'adjusted' for smithing.

1) make smithing strength based, not dex based. this is more logical in my opinion.

2) allow item repair to IMPROVE weapon or armor wear without damaging quality if additional resources are used in the repair. For example. I want to repair a serinjah. I would shift clickthe sword, and a iron ingot, and a 'better repair' is activated, where there is a good chance that the weapons wear is improved without harming the quality. not 100%, but perhpas a ratio of skill obtained / skill needed, to a maximum of maybe 60%

3) somethign has to be done to encourage mining. maybe this means improving the gem rates. or working on ways to not discourage miners from playing. This IS related somwhat to the no mule in mines change that occured over summer, and soem compromise should be looked at since it seems that ALL mining for profit was squelched at that point. (yes i know there are 2 peopel who still do but 2 peopel cannot support 5 million smiths)

4) i would like to see merchants buy more of the product so smiths who have no export market dont have to keep makingthe same item over and over just so they have something to sell. No, they cannot just find people to sell to as 98% of the people will only buy form a specific person so new smiths cannot even start to sell anythign until they are well skilled or get lucky.

5) some of the smithign steps just take too long, 31 hammer hitsfor one step is enough t put even a meth addictto sleep

1) Lets not mess with the attributes -please-. For all that is good, leave the friggen attributes alone. They are a pain to try and mess with to start with.

2) Two seems ok, but that would just result in everyone taking up repairing their stuff all the time, with no smith.

3) I like the idea of 'encouraging' mining. But maybe we should have some more 'public' mines. Right now, there are three mines that I know of that give coal. One is closed off due to IG things, one is very distant from the rest of the island and technically you should pay to use it, and one is through a forest and way out in the middle of no where.

4) I disagree with the reasoning behind this, but I do agree with some changes to the npcs. Npc's by smithed stuff for very little, such as a serinjah sword for like 10 copper, and then sold back for a silver, or more.

5) Some of the steps do take a while, but I think it is important to do that. If not, then we will have so much 'rare' stuff floating around. One of those is the Shield of the Sky. At one time it was extremely rare, now you can find one for a few thread.---My ideas----

1) More uses for copper. Copper right now, is the laughing stock of the smithing world. Its good for details, and its abundant. It is very rarely used.
2) Balancing the products made. Serinjah's still are quite powerful, to a point where anything else is almost silly to be bought if you want a slashing weapon.
3) The armors themselves are very good, but it seems more and more all warriors will -only- by one type. Maybe after a certain 'level' of smithing, make them all equal, or give one an advantage over anouther, such as "Salkamar can take slashing weapons excellently." "Lor Angur can deflect magic much easier!" "Silversteel can do both, but not as well as either." The same would be for helmets.
4) Give a use or bonus to some of the lesser used objects. Such as the Elven rainbow sword, or the Elven sword. Maybe give them boosts with elves? Maybe some of the axes, yes I know some do have some range to them, should have a bonus when used by orcs or dwarves.
5) Magical elven armor, should be only worn by elves. Otherwise, it isn't 'magical elven armor' its 'Magical one race fits all armor.'
6) Make 'sizes' to the armors. A smaller person would wear a 'smaller' armor. This could be determined if the human has 'short man' he has a 'small armor.' A regular man could wear regular, and a tall man would need 'large' armor. For simplicity, it could be that the small plate armor would fit a small halfling as well, or a small orc, lizard, ect.

Heh that was just a fluke...

[Saril]

hehe Jupiter, diese Systeme heißen nur Magiesysteme. Beim Schmieden muß es ja nicht wie oben beschrieben auf die Attribute wirken sondern kann auch auf die Waffe usw selbst wirken. z.B

geschärft = +10% auf Schaden
verziehrt = - 5% auf Schutz, + 5% auf Aussehn
schwer = +10% auf Schutz, - 15% auf Beweglichkeit
usw

Also nichts mit hokus pokus sondern schwere Arbeit ^^

[Weilanderus]

da ich keine ahnung habe wie IG das runensystem gehandhabt wird (ich spiel nen zwerg aus silberbrand , das heißt bei uns gibt es keine magier,druiden oder sonstiges)
aber warum dürfen wir als Meister ne magische Elbenrüstung herstellen?
also ist der gedanke ja schon implementiert.
nun muss es sich halt auf waffen erstrecken, ob du es nun sagen wir nen diamanten einarbeitest und die schärfe erhöhst.
Oder Gold einarbetst damit dein status nach oben geht.
oder ob du ne Schmiederune erarbeiten musst die eben weil nicht magisch aus gold diamant oder ähnliches besteht. alles daselbe halt einmal mit dem wort magie und einmal ohne
gruss agnir

[pharse]

Es ist nicht auszuschließen, dass es mal ein Runen/Magiesystem für Handwerker geben wird. Aber davor kommen die Druiden, Priester, Barden und wohl auch noch die Kämpfer... dann vielleicht die Handwerker

[Jupiter]

Ich möchte zu dem einschmelzen von Erzen noch was sagen.

Es wäre das daste den Skillgewinn dabei vollkommen auszuschlaten. Warum? Weil es dazu verleitet einen Schmiedechar ertsmal minen zu lassen und dann durch das Einschmelzen ordentlichen Schmiedeskill zu bekommen.
Das ist auch nicht gerade förderlich für Vollblutminenarbeiter, da Schmiede momentan eh Selbsteversorger sind.

(Ich würde den Skillzuwachs auch beim Dreschen, Getreidemehle und ähnlichem abstellen. Von solchen primitiven Arbeiten lernt man doch wircklich nichts.)

[Saril]

Jo meine rede, wenn ganz weg nicht gewollt halt nur einen Bruchtel vom jetzigen. Optimal eben ganz weg.