Con Artist RP opportunities missed

[Elsi]

Playing a character in search of mage training has been a little frustrating. I did the same thing with her as with the other characters - started her off with a very simplistic goal and let her loose in the world to see who she engages with and what might happen.

One character found employment fairly quickly, the other has found an immediate interest in an area I never would have expected him to go in for, all because their simple interests worked well with the interests of those in game.

For a character whose goal is to become a mage, the options are low. Either you find a teacher, or you walk around being frustrated.... I can't see why there hasn't become an active flim-flam industry of people conning these rubes out of their hard earned (pre-game) cash and equipment.... Think of the RP possibilities. Think of the wealth....

True, there would be complaints to the local law enforcement, and I'm sure that some of the real mages out there would take offence... RP possibilities galore....

(...unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with game mechanics to cook up and successfully run such a PC myself, but if someone wants to run with this I'm open for a dove...)

[Kevin Lightdot]

We have ooc rules for teaching, only 3 students per teacher, that doesn't really help.
There are literally tons of rp possibilities missed every day, because that is what rp is about, making choises.

[Faladron]

Magic is a lost cause to begin with, as you are completely at the mercy of other players.

I gave up trying as I got better things to do than force myself and accordate my RL - shedule over a period of some RL months so I do not miss "lessons"
on learning how to roleplay magic "with consideration" and "well" by other players who give poo about their preached "rules of conduct for magic use"
because they feel that magic is some sort of "big responsibility".

Once they feel unobserved or get bored, the funniest things happen with magic (in a negative way) with little to no roleplay involved.

Things they would probably smack students around for plenty but ohwell, once there's power there's a way to miss-use it, that goes without saying...

[Pellandria]

Don't talk crap, you are here for what a few weeks, mage teacher sprout out of the earth like mushrooms these days, we allready have too much mage teacher on the whole Island, most of them don't really play good mage rp at alll, but hell we have people here waiting for an Rl year to finally get a rune, and you complain because you don't have teacher after two weeks.

[Lance Thunnigan]

She wasn't insulting anyone Pell.
Take a midol. Eesh.
tl;dr.

[Elsi]

Don't talk crap, you are here for what a few weeks, mage teacher sprout out of the earth like mushrooms these days, we allready have too much mage teacher on the whole Island, most of them don't really play good mage rp at alll, but hell we have people here waiting for an Rl year to finally get a rune, and you complain because you don't have teacher after two weeks.

I'm not sure you really read my post. The mage teachers aren't what I'm complaining about at all....

[Faladron]

Don't talk crap, you are here for what a few weeks, mage teacher sprout out of the earth like mushrooms these days, we allready have too much mage teacher on the whole Island, most of them don't really play good mage rp at alll, but hell we have people here waiting for an Rl year to finally get a rune, and you complain because you don't have teacher after two weeks.

qft, how about reading the post before you jump at the words "magic" and "frustrating" like a pavlov's dog?

[Pellandria]

Playing a character in search of mage training has been a little frustrating. I did the same thing with her as with the other characters - started her off with a very simplistic goal and let her loose in the world to see who she engages with and what might happen.


For a character whose goal is to become a mage, the options are low. Either you find a teacher, or you walk around being frustrated....

I was regarding to this and as I said its crap, we have a ton of new mage teachers and instead of constantly complaining or craptalking from ya noobys you should actually start to play the game for a little longer.

[Lance Thunnigan]

Pell.
tl;dr.
GTFO.

[Estralis Seborian]

*sighs*

Calm down, please. This is not the way to discuss things.

[Faladron]

I was regarding to this and as I said its crap, we have a ton of new mage teachers and instead of constantly complaining or craptalking from ya noobys you should actually start to play the game for a little longer.

Also langsam platzt mir hier der Kragen.

Genau so ein bescheuertes Platzhirschverhalten von irgendwelchen Leuten die halt länger schon bei Illarion hängen und die sich daraus irgendwelche aberwitzigen Vorrechte oder ein Universalverständnis des Spiels ableiten ist für mich was schlimmeres als ne Hautkrankheit.

Ich bin auch schon über 2 Jahre hier aber ich führ mich deswegen nicht auf wie der Macker und lass das bei jeder Gelegenheit jeden "n00b" spüren der hier postet.

Genau diese Kälte und das Unverständnis gegenüber "den neuen" sowohl IG als auch am Forum zieht das Spiel weiter runter (Einige der alten "guten" Rollenspieler gehen, aber die neuen die sich entwickeln könnten werden von irgendwelchen grantelnden Platzhirschen niedrig gehalten, also gibts keine Innovationen mehr, kein frisches Blut so zusagen und wenns dann doch welche gibt die beim Spiel kleben bleiben haben sie das schwerste Leben.

In-game bist du doch nichts ohne deine "Leute" und wenn du neu bist schert sich der Rest einen Dreck um dich. Ich möchte nicht wissen wieviele schon nach ein Mal spielen gesagt haben "Das ist nichts für mich" weil niemand auf sie zugegangen ist. (Ich hab meinerzeit ein paar sehr nette Leute gehabt die unvoreingenommen auch mit "neuen" rp't haben und hatte vorher auch wenig bis garkeinen plan wie was wo abläuft aber es wurde mir erklärt und ich habs dann selbst rausgefunden. Jemanden anzuschreien führt genau in die Gegenteilige Richtung (bye bye Illarion), oder zu den vielen Neuen die grad nur im Spiel sind weil sie ihre Skills trainieren wollen und Rp ist halt optional manchmal dabei wenns halt muss, aber #me? was war das noch schnell?
(Ahja dieser Paragraph gilt nicht für neue Spieler die sich eine Elfe / weiblichen Menschen machen der nach dem neuesten Playboy Magazin modelliert ist und als Sahnehäubchen bi-sexuell veranlagt sein sollte, dann findet man nämlich leicht anschluss scheints).

Würde hier jeder mal besser überdenken was so sorglos ausgesprochene Beleidigungen eigentlich auslösen können (und das weiß niemand hier besser als ich) dann gäb es von solchem Hass viel weniger und davon würde sowohl die Stimmung ig als auch hier profitieren.

[Taeryon Silverlight]

Pellandria hat recht. Es wird ständig von Leuten über das Magiesystem gemäkelt die NULL Ahnung von der Sache haben. Mittlerweile haben wir, wenn ich richtig gezählt habe 13 - 15 chars mit BHONA. Das macht insgesamt 45 Schüler. Wenn das nicht reicht für eine Community, in der im Schnitt etwa 30 Charaktere zur gleichen Zeit online sind dann kann irgend etwas nicht stimmen. Der Fehler liegt sich nicht bei uns (den Magielehrern) oder dem System, sondern ganz einfach daran, dass Leute einem 10 Tauben innerhalb von 2 Tagen schreiben in denen sie immer wieder fragen ob man sie denn in Magie unterrichten würde. Noch schlimmer sind Spieler, die zwei oder drei Tage ig rumrennen und dann sobald sie den ersten Char sehen der Magie anwendet hinrumpeln mit dem Satz "Hey, ich bin blabla und will Schüler werden. Unterrichte mich." Es ist doch wohl logisch dass man so einen nicht in die Lehre aufnimmt oder?

Und zu der Sache mit dem "Es werden keine Newbies als Schüler genommen" kann ich nur lachen. Drei meiner sechs Schüler sind weniger als 4 Monate dabei. Eine war zu dem Zeitpunkt als ich sie genommen hab gerademal zwei Wochen hier. Dass ihr keine Lehrer findet liegt an EUCH und eurem ständig meckerndem Verhalten. Bei der Probestunde, die ich wohlbemerkt bereits 1 real Monat im Vorraus angekündigt hatte sind gerade mal 5 zur deutschen Stunde und 1 zur englischen gekommen und das zu einer Zeit, in der man im Forum mindestens 15 - 25 Leute permanent beobachten konnte, wie sie sich darüber beschwerten dass sie keinen Lehrer finden.

Edit: I'm going out for coffee now. I'll translate as soon as I'm back.

[Dantagon Marescot]

Uebersetsung bitte. We have already hit stage 2 of flaming in an originally english topic. Switching to German so the English complainers can't complain when they get home from work/school. (Or so Alex can't reply).

Faladron. I believe Pell is calling the main poster a noob, not you. Don't insult yourself when insult was not intended.

[Faladron]

Finds nur genial dass jetzt alle überlesen worums in dem Beitrag eigentlich geht... wirklich wie Pavlov's Hund. Sobald das Glöckchen läutet (Ich lese "Magie") sabbert der Hund (Ich rechtfertige das Magiesystem obwohls garnicht darum geht aber es könnte ja sein)...

[Kaila Galathil Travinus]

Trying to teach someone the game and even some RP to some extent can be difficult at times. I believe this should be "judged" on the extent of the players knowledge. In other words, if we had a newbie island set up already, this would be an advantage for the new player to do some active RP, but the way it is now, IMO we should be cautious of the extent of the RP to new players ((possibly give an ooc warning/question them etc))

PS..my char was in game for months before ever finding a mage teacher. There are plenty of things to do with a mage char....they can't do much well, but the RP opportunities are tremendous. I would suggest either continue with your char actively RPing, or if this isn't fun for you, make a crafter, or fighter char...or even do both.

[Elsi]

Uebersetsung bitte. We have already hit stage 2 of flaming in an originally english topic. Switching to German so the English complainers can't complain when they get home from work/school. (Or so Alex can't reply).

Faladron. I believe Pell is calling the main poster a noob, not you. Don't insult yourself when insult was not intended.

Perhaps Faladron was taking offense at Pell calling me a noob.

[Mr. Cromwell]

I'm actually very much positively surprised by the fact that you didn't take any offense (or weren't scared away). That's really great.

As a friendly advice; You better just ignore Pellandria as long as you feel like 'new' player. He has a rather bad track record with lashing out at new players here on the boards. By being totally rude, condescending, impatient and harsh towards new people, he sadly manages to be a good summary of what is wrong with the treatment of new community members in general here.

So, just pay him no attention.

[Nitram]

The magic system is in the way its now, nothing but waste. You have less problems if you don't play a mage.

The system will be rewritten sooner or later. But that will still take some time.

Faladron. Please don't speak about things in the game, you don't know how they work currently. That would save a lot of time.

Pellandria. Try to post in a more friendly manner.

Nitram

[Pellandria]

I'm actually very much positively surprised by the fact that you didn't take any offense (or weren't scared away). That's really great.

As a friendly advice; You better just ignore Pellandria as long as you feel like 'new' player. He has a rather bad track record with lashing out at new players here on the boards.

This is why I just recruited a new player, or atleast she seemed so, as a student, but saying that you won't find a mage teacher is simply "stupid" get to know the game and don't run around "Oh take me as student!!!111one" Giving away runes for money will teach people nothing ...no rp, but allright if you want to run around with flames everywhere and people blasting away your char with no #me or any rp, don't come back and cry cromwell.

A Advise form me now: get to know the game longer instead of posting what shoots trougth your mind, that might be the thrd Topic that is more or less useless or untrue and coming from a new player, as taeryon said we have around 15 People with Bhona and that is more then enough to get a student.

[Faladron]

Playing a character in search of mage training has been a little frustrating. I did the same thing with her as with the other characters - started her off with a very simplistic goal and let her loose in the world to see who she engages with and what might happen.

One character found employment fairly quickly, the other has found an immediate interest in an area I never would have expected him to go in for, all because their simple interests worked well with the interests of those in game.

For a character whose goal is to become a mage, the options are low. Either you find a teacher, or you walk around being frustrated.... I can't see why there hasn't become an active flim-flam industry of people conning these rubes out of their hard earned (pre-game) cash and equipment.... Think of the RP possibilities. Think of the wealth....

True, there would be complaints to the local law enforcement, and I'm sure that some of the real mages out there would take offence... RP possibilities galore....

(...unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with game mechanics to cook up and successfully run such a PC myself, but if someone wants to run with this I'm open for a dove...)

How about reading the red text as this is the main topic this thread deals about, a suggestion about forming a group to promote some roleplay besides the one already around, adding a new facette to the game, roleplaywise, and to put simple NO f ing insult or complaint at your oh so precious (directing only Pellandria and Tayron, nobody that has developed the system only those using it) magic system.

[Mr. Cromwell]

One thing which amazes me is, maybe you can answer the question?
Just why on earth should you be given the right to judge anyone's capability for RP? Your main task is IMHO not to be the self-imposed RP-vigilante of the game, but rather to provide the runes (of course, that doesn't mean you couldn't have some control over the students, but you manage to sound awfully elitistic here)

This question is especially acute when considering the fact that you seem to have some major issues with reading comprehension, as for the umpteenth time, it wasn't the teachers he was complaining about anyway.

but hell we have people here waiting for an Rl year to finally get a rune, and you complain because you don't have teacher after two weeks.

Attitude like that is quite frankly, nonsense. Like I've said (and I believe Nitram + Other staff agrees) before; When someone has to wait for 12 months (or like Elderberry, 18 months) for runes, the system is not working. Trying to 'discredit' the other player like that is not nice. Long queues or waiting times are not an intentional feature, for your information. What is the timezone-distribution of the BHONAs like, anyway?

[AlexRose]

Uebersetsung bitte. We have already hit stage 2 of flaming in an originally english topic. Switching to German so the English complainers can't complain when they get home from work/school. (Or so Alex can't reply).

Faladron. I believe Pell is calling the main poster a noob, not you. Don't insult yourself when insult was not intended.

Perhaps Faladron was taking offense at Pell calling me a noob.

You are a noob, you played two weeks. That's not to say you're a "n00b", just new.

However, I played an adept char with no teacher for 1.5 years, and it was fun. There was lots of rp to do, you just have to throw yourself in there instead of expecting it to come to you.

And @Crommy: We're working on it. e.g. we've been letting people we normally wouldn't let have BHONA because we need more English/American teachers etc. There are, actually, quite a few places out there. Currently, William has 3 free places but noone bothers to ask him. All 3 students of him got BHONA. It's presently very easy to get a mage in comparison of when I started. For instance, when I first played, there was no magic system, then the first academy was in the wrong timezone for me, then this system happened and I got Silas as a teacher. Nowadays the teachers are more efficient. We have 10 active mages right now, I think. That's 30 students, and most of these are proficient, meaning in 9 weeks we'll have at least 21 more mages. Then we get more teachers I guess.

So yeah.

[Faladron]

I'll go with Einstein on this one... there are things more proven to be infinite than the universe...

[Llama]

Can't really understand this post.

What you are saying is, that people should pretend to be mages and con other people into paying for learning?

Just one problem with that, nobody will beleive you're a mage until you do some magic stuff, and most mages use magic very openly.

[Faladron]

There, my try upon a translation from what I said previously

I was regarding to this and as I said its crap, we have a ton of new mage teachers and instead of constantly complaining or craptalking from ya noobys you should actually start to play the game for a little longer.

Slowly I am fed up with this.

It's exactly this behaviour of self proclaimed "top dogs" who may have been playing Illarion for longer already, and who try to derrivate some ludicrous prior claims or universal understanding for everything the game is about, which is worse than a sickness for me.

I am here for over 2 years aswell but just because of that I don't act like some bloke and rub it in to every "n00b" posting here at every chance I get.

It is this cold and lack of understanding towards "the new ones" in game and on the forum which drags Illarion down further and further
(some old "good" roleplayers leave but new (possible future) roleplayers can't realy evolve because some grumpy "top dogs" shout them down at every ocassion, thats why there's not much new things contributed to the ig-story, no fresh blood and ideas so to say, and those who still try and stick to the game have a tough time.

You are nothing ingame without your "peeps" and if you're new, the rest cares jack-sh..poo about you.
I don't want to know how many people said "nope, not my game" after one try of playing because nobody made them feel welcome and accepted.

(Back when I started I had some very nice people who without any prejudices also started to rp with "new" people and before meeting those people I had no clue about anything either but it got explained I listened and then I figured things out myself more and more.
Shouting at someone and calling him names leads to the opposite (bye bye Illarion) or to the many new people in game who are there because they want to train skills. Roleplay is optional for them if it has to be done but wait... what was that #me thing again?

(Oh and this paragraph doesnt count for new players that make an elfess / female human modelled out of the latest playboy magazine who as an icing on the top should have bisexual ambitions.Those seem to find people to get along with pretty quickly)

If everyone would start thinking over what carelessly worded insults may invoke (and believe me I know well about that, more than the rest of this board) then there'd be less of this hatred and that'd improve the mood both ig and upon these boards.

[Dantagon Marescot]

Hmm... So we have an incredible amount of horribly rped mages (on the grounds that magic is spammed everywhere in town because they are bored and need something to do), all because we needed a few more english speaking teachers... What is this world coming too?

And personally when I read the post I thought it was a complant about not being able to find a mage teacher. Which kind of bothered me because I don't think it should be easy for just anyone to learn magic. Id rather see more mages deticated to living their lives to learning. I almost view mages as scholars and scientists of the ways of magic, not as powerful goof balls who spam magic and go running around screaming for, as Deinarious would put it, "MOAR POWER!" No... They are thinkers, philosophers, sure you get a few bad eggs. But that is currently how half the magic community seems to be. What happened to the life long learners, not the hours a day powergamers?

*Tosses her two cents into a pond of greedy fish so they can choke.*

[Retlak]

Hmm... So we have an incredible amount of horribly rped mages (on the grounds that magic is spammed everywhere in town because they are bored and need something to do), all because we needed a few more english speaking teachers... What is this world coming too?

Mages cast magic in town because they want to.

Warriors battle eachover in town because they want to.

It's not bad roleplay, it IS roleplay. If you don't like something, don't point fingers etc, Just use the exit instead.

[Llama]

Hmm... So we have an incredible amount of horribly rped mages (on the grounds that magic is spammed everywhere in town because they are bored and need something to do)

Hope you're not referring to the animals in the workshop

[Elsi]

Hmm... So we have an incredible amount of horribly rped mages (on the grounds that magic is spammed everywhere in town because they are bored and need something to do), all because we needed a few more english speaking teachers... What is this world coming too?

Mages cast magic in town because they want to.

Warriors battle eachover in town because they want to.

It's not bad roleplay, it IS roleplay. If you don't like something, don't point fingers etc, Just use the exit instead.

It is not bad roleplay. Reacting to it, making IC rules, and having PCs enforce the rules is roleplay too.

[Retlak]

That's what i was trying to say. It is not bad roleplay by any means.