Mithril

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:03 pm

I propose a new "metal" that can be mined and shaped through smithing. I have seen the substance "mithril" in many RPGs and I think it might be beneficial to the illarion experience...
Please post your thoughts on this.

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:05 pm

One more time: This is not The Lord of the Rings. Why do we need it?

Aragon · Post by **Aragon** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:08 pm

Please use the search function first, before posting a new proposal.
There are several topics where this was suggested by typing "mithril".
It doesn't make it easier for the Dev-team to have the same ideas in several topics all over the board (in my humble opinion).

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:14 pm

Giandor, that wasn't nice.

So if someone proposes a books, should I also reply 'This is not a bookstore, do we need them?'

As a note, also Orcs, Dwarves and Elves appear in the book.
Does the same rule apply to them too?
Perhaps we should remove all the rings too, because I somehow remember that the book mentioned one or two..

Instead of new metal, I would perhaps pefer to see new 'specialities' in the existing weapons.

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:21 pm

@Sir Giandor HA! That's a good one! This isn't LOTR so we dont need mithril? Let me tell you Mithril a metal does NOT belong to LOTR alone but many fantasy RPGs. It pervades fantasy RPG. So going from your post let us take out elves, halflings, orcs, dwarves, AND humans and be left with lizardmen because this isn't LOTR? That's a funny one I must admit...
@Aragon Perhaps this was mentioned earlier and discussed, but I don't see the harm in addressing and bringing it up again as there are now most likely new GMs and people on the illarion staff that were not here before and did not read/discuss this anyways.
@Caranthir Specialities in the weapons...that would be very nice! So axe-fighting would be separate from slashing weapons and archery separate from distance...

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:24 pm

Okay maybe it was not nice. But this is specially a thing from TLOTR. The people can use their own fantasy.
And i reacted a little bit agressive cause so many people are stealing "ideas", pictures and sentences from TLOTR.

But this is the effekt when hollywood do a film. It become to famous. And the people dont use their fantasy.

Aragon · Post by **Aragon** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:27 pm

@ Elaralith

Seemed, that you haven't tried it ...
the last topic, in which mithril was proposed, ended on 31.12.2002
And the GM's haven't changed since a year ago.

Sorry, that I must speak against you.

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:28 pm

@Sir Giandor I say to you again..."mithril" is NOT a thing specific to LOTR. It is a thing that appears in many fantasies that are NOT LOTR. So you do not want people "stealing" things from LOTR...think of it not as stealing but borrowing and using it in a creative away in a different atmosphere. Again from what you say about not taking anything from LOTR then basically half of what we have in illarion would be gone because 'oh' it appears in LOTR as well.

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 6:55 pm

The 'Weapon speciality' -thing I mentioned was more like
'Sharp axe' or 'Heavy durable breadknife' kind of thing..

Adano Eles · Post by **Adano Eles** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 7:17 pm

Mithril appeared in LOTR first. So all those games actually stole the idea from Tolkien. Yes, I know that half the fantasy genre was stolen from Tolkien as well, but this doesn't mean that we couldn't use our fantasy to make up our own special materials.

I vote for Medoran steel.

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 7:20 pm

Naw, plain steel doesn't not ring in my ear so nicely.
I think that a new kind of metal should be four for this purpose.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:22 pm

The search function is a useful tool.
Here is an early discussion about mithril.
Bror's last post pretty much sums it up.

http://www.illarion.org/community/forum ... 3&start=40

My thoughts are that a proposal such as this needs a few more specifics. Such as how this affects iron smithed items? Weaker but lighter? Heavier but stronger? Less useful but better looking? Harder to find, but more valuable? Or else it's just like proposing "more herbs, more spells".

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:35 pm

Not quite correct. First mithril wa mentioned in "A Hobbit Tale - There and back again".Also from Tolkien. Just the Roleplay-Games based on Tolkien, mostely, we dont have to "borrow" all thinks from them. Here are only some species "borrowed". But they establish in this genre.
But I dont know about a reason why we need to "borrow" more like this.

Please explain your need for a new metal.

Salathe · Post by **Salathe** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:37 pm

adamantin is also a fantasy material, and i didnt get it from runescape!!! ive seen it in some of my baldurs gate games, and they spell it adamantine, not adamantine like runescape does

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:39 pm

Apart from the name.
Put the Question to yourself : why do we need a new material?

Salathe · Post by **Salathe** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:47 pm

well if we had a new material, then we could get stronger armor, and weapons

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 11:54 pm

For the role play side of this, possibly some very rare metel which would have excellent qualities would be good for role play in my view. 1) If it had its own skill for smithing it like gold does it would incourage more player interaction because people, mostly smiths, would always be looking to by it from people.2) if anyone ever got good enough to make good weapons and armor then they could use the items mabye as a reward for completeing a quest or something. Their are many good things to adding a new metal which would be better then iron but as hard to find as gold. I think if used properly it could improve the role play/ player interaction in Illarion. But we don't have to call it mithril, I mean come on lets show some creativity here people.

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 12:31 am

This sounds very well now

Salathe · Post by **Salathe** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 1:30 am

yea at first when you asked why we need one i wasnt sure =P

but haveing quest would be nice

Adano Eles · Post by **Adano Eles** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 9:34 am

Medoran steel ain't just plain steel... It's the result of generations of firemountain dwarfs mixing different materials into the iron to create a metal that is harder and more flexible then anything known...
And as my char is the only Medoran in Troll's Bane I would have the monopoly on it

Nevermind...

Actually, I am more for this kind of alloys or magical enhanced materials, then for some super-material. Maybe we could introduce some rare metals which can be mixed with iron to get stronger or otherwise better alloys. It could even be that different mixtures would have different effects, i.e. lighter, stronger, stainless (doesn't break as fast)...

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 1:23 pm

I think that this 'Special effect' should be income of high skill + luck, and some randomizing, which would make it more likely for a master than a apprentice to create a 'Sharp dagger', yet he could not 'attempt' to create the spesific 'effect' on the dagger, that would keep it 'fun'.

Also to promote player to player trade, the quality of the item should not affect the price from eliza, so 'Uber dagger of slaying' would give the same 3 gp's than a plain dagger.

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Wed Jan 29, 2003 5:04 pm

@Dyluck Hmm, mithril was extremely light and discovered by the dwarves. And it was although light as a feather it was stronger than any known material including iron etc. etc. It was VERY hard to find and the dwarves coveted it. Let me give an example...one mithril chain coat could buy all of Trollsbane. It looked like ...shiny silver....kind of gives off a light of its own.
@Salathe Yes the whole idea is to have a higher class of weapons and armor-> artifact almost.
@Sir Giandor Why do we need anything? For RP of course!
@Turin That is exactly what I mean!

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 3:54 am

I'm glad some one agrees with me. But I think what we don't need right now is more metals, what we really need is more broken down skills. For example, when you first start out you have basic knowledge on every skill, you can make daggers, bags, staffs, the basic item for any job. Well how is it that if you make nothing but daggers till you can make second level items you also know how to make a new kind of shield and helmet? I mean you made nothing but daggers the whole time. I think what we need is to have an armor making skill for chain mail and plate armor, and lets say a sword making skill for daggers and swords, and a shield skill for shields. That would mean most smiths would only be able to make about to things real good. That would even more make players interact for needed weapons, armor, ect, and then even good smiths would have to buy things from other good smiths. Well thats my two cents.

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 11:30 am

@Elararith: We need this material not, cause for roleplaying.
If you are doing you play well you dont need those things. Everyone could destroy demons with those weapons and shields. And I think we dont need them.

But maybe you can get a spell on your weapon like a potion from a druid.
Only used 3-4 times then you has to do it again.

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 8:47 pm

@Turin You contradict yourself horribly. You say that we do not need a new material right now because of the hardness of skills, but then you go on to say that we should split up blacksmithing...
@Sir Giandor To enhance the atmosphere of RP changes are good. If not why do you think the illarion staff are working already so hard for many changes?

Kragmar · Post by **Kragmar** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 10:33 pm

If your talking about new metals, why not add metals like copper or bronze or steel. Steel is (I think) an alloy of iron, copper, and nickel. Couldn't we just put these other metals in the game and let someone smelt them into steel? It would be more "realistic" (for everybody who likes realism) and add another couple of new skills out there for everybody to learn as well as adding a better metal to the game. I don't know anything about metallurgy so I don't know what else these two metals(copper and nickel) were used for. I know bronze could be (and was) used for chandeliers and candlabra(sp?). Does someone else have good ideas for these metals?
Kragmar

Sir Giandor · Post by **Sir Giandor** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 11:06 pm

I dont know why the land need anothe metal for creating weapons. This would be dangerous and many to strong people would use it.

Cain Freemont · Post by **Cain Freemont** » Fri Jan 31, 2003 12:01 am

Giandor:
This metal would not get into the wrong hands so easily if it were mined in a special place, and you had to mine up around 4,000 of something else before that... the area to find it could be FAR from a depot, so it would take a long period of time just to get 1 of such a rare material...

Just my thoughts.

Personally, I like the idea of a new metal...

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Fri Jan 31, 2003 12:34 am

I don't like the idea of a new mined and smith material right now because we have too many miners and smiths already. I can imagine once people hear there's a new stronger material, then all of sudden even more people are mining, trying to find it.

Elaralith · Post by **Elaralith** » Fri Jan 31, 2003 12:39 am

@Sir Giandor ...Mithril if it were in the game would have to be very rare! And hard to smith so you really would not have everyone wearing a mithril chain of armor. And now with the 10x harder skill system that would be near impossible...
@Dyluck Now, later its all the same as these are just proposals to be considered...