Forced RP????

Lrmy · Post by **Lrmy** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:53 am

Yes, we all know this has been talked about a lot. I just think people are misusing the forced RP rule to their advantage.

This is what I think...

If you disagree, please speak your mind.

Lord Arcia · Post by **Lord Arcia** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:09 am

I see most of these things as acceptable to me.

#me punches the human in the throat.

That, not so much. This would be much more acceptable:

#me swings unexpectedly at the human, his aim directed at his throat.

Personally...I would probably take the hit, unless I knew for a fact that my character was more skilled. But hey, it's not a perfect world, is it?

Gro'bul · Post by **Gro'bul** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:46 am

Apparently I lack a sense of roleplay, not wanting my character in detrimental to them situations (not that I haven't willingly played along with a bajillion of them). Perm killing without consent isn't possible for players. IMO pushing is technical abuse, not rp at all. I really don't understand why it even exists, nobody could ever explain that one to me.

Lrmy · Post by **Lrmy** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:54 am

I was also implying that the person role playing with you/against you was using proper role play.

Cassandra Fjurin · Post by **Cassandra Fjurin** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:13 am

Lord Arcia wrote:I see most of these things as acceptable to me.

#me punches the human in the throat.

That, not so much. This would be much more acceptable:

#me swings unexpectedly at the human, his aim directed at his throat.

Personally...I would probably take the hit, unless I knew for a fact that my character was more skilled. But hey, it's not a perfect world, is it?

The problem with this is, if you don't force the other would do. I had this on another game.

the situation was something like: I runned along a small corridor. As i runned through the next corner someone other stands there. I stopped to rp before nearly crashing inside the other person.

The result was. I crashed inside the other person but the person react like the überhero. made a roll on the floor stands up pressed me to the bottom and had overwhelmed me.

Without any chance to react. The most people dont like it when there chars have some weaknesses or can be surprised. No they all have überpowers and x-ray eyes. Better reflexes than any other and the strength of 12 men.

All what it's not technically solved will tend to be used in force rp action.
You can always see the two sides of the coin. You can call it forced rp that i nearly ran into the other person because maybe he had heared me before. And you can call it forced because he had such über powers.

Juliana D'cheyne · Post by **Juliana D'cheyne** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 3:23 pm

IMO the acceptable on the picture with adaquete RP, #me's, is what is done in game.. I have no problem with it.

Aegohl · Post by **Aegohl** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:50 pm

It is more like this, in my opinion:

Forced RP:

#me kicks person x in the shin.

Non-Forced:

#me swings back his leg and, aiming at person x's shin, let's his leg go into a wild kick.

Forced RP:

#me picks up the small person x and puts her on my shoulder

Non-Forced:

#me kneels down with a friendly smile to the diminutive person x.

"Would you like a ride, deary?"

Person X: "Sure"

#me grabs the small person x under the arms and pulls her up over his shoulders.

Forced RP:

#me yanks the pants of person X down around his ankles, embarassing him in front of everyone.

Non-Forced:

#me , with a bellowing chuckle, stealthily grabs at person x's pants, hoping to embarassing him in front of the crowd.

________________________________________________________

In pen and paper roleplaying, which is where this all started from, there were dice rolls for all these things. You learned quick to stop acting as soon as there was some question of odds of fate or such, so the GM could roll the dice.

At Illarion we don't have a personal GM to follow us around and decide what is fate or not, and so we have two options:

We can steal the decision and take it upon ourselves (forced rp) or...

We can be the gentleman and put our fate into the hands of the other players, fully expecting that they would do the same for you (non-forced rp).

Sure, you're not always going to get what you want, or get the most enjoyable result out of non-forced rp, but it's just what a gentleman does. Non-forced rp is like opening the door for a lady, while forced rp is like closing it on her face; it's just rude.

Michael Isman · Post by **Michael Isman** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 10:58 pm

This thread has just been Aegholified.

The Returner · Post by **The Returner** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:28 pm

I'm always opening doors for pretty ladies...

but they slam it in my face ;_;

I guess I should stop following them to their homes and demonstrating my lock picking skills

Talaena Landessi · Post by **Talaena Landessi** » Tue Apr 03, 2007 11:46 pm

No personal attacks!

Arien

The Returner · Post by **The Returner** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:12 am

- Deleted -

Arien

Cuthalion · Post by **Cuthalion** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:39 am

Simply ad try to everything. Noone cares he could posibly avoid "almost" getting overun I think. Basically dont do somthing to a char without his/her permission if the outcome is important. This has been discusses many times though. I agree with Dain's list. But before taking those items suposingly being traded, he should use a #me, where he sais he TRIES to take them. The "victim" should react f.ex like this: #me does not react quickly enough to stop him.

abcfantasy · Post by **abcfantasy** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:46 am

Or you could avoid the 'try' and just consider everything is an 'attempt'.

A quick, stupid and lame example:

Person1 punches the man on his chest.
Person2 predicts his move and quickly hops back.

You know, something like that.

Cuthalion · Post by **Cuthalion** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:49 am

Yup, if you prefer.

Ku 'Agor · Post by **Ku 'Agor** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 9:08 am

Aye, I started to learn this 'forced RP' directly after Ko.

The general population will only be concerned with motions.
#me swings a punch the enemy (possibly with), aiming for his uncovered gut.
#me tries to kick the chair out from under Jorokar (That bastard

)
#me offers a hand to the woman.

Anything like that. Newbies will try things like #me kicks the man in the groin.

Simply put it, if you do anything that does Not relate to what your character can do (E.G. kick, punch, run away, offer aid) and that would not have any aftereffects of the other person (E.G. kicked him down, knocked him out, ran away from and hid successfully, aided the other person).

Just a note, though. I find Jailing Force RP. Issues.. I hate Jailing.

Aegohl · Post by **Aegohl** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:14 am

The reason why jailing isn't considered forced rp is because the staff and the players came together and came up with a number of rules on jailing that both parties would accept. If we accept a certain fate before play begins, it's not forced rp.

However, you would be right to say that this agreement was made a long time ago (in fact, it was in those halcyon days that we veterans talk about where Hagen was the Captain of the Guard, and Grant Herion went around ruining everyone's day) and perhaps it's time that it was discussed again.

Of course, back then the guards were able to actually teleport someone into jail. I thought that this was all roleplayed out nowadays and people were actually put in jail via rp?

Ku 'Agor · Post by **Ku 'Agor** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:15 am

It is, but by RP you mean

People bitch moan and complain until someone accepts jailtime.

After a lengthy battle of locking the victim into the jail, someone busts him out or he uses a portal book or he uses a temple blackstone or something of that nature.

People bitch moan and complain until a GM forces 'correct' jailtime.

Aristeaus · Post by **Aristeaus** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:16 am

Jail time should have a timer placed upon it.

When a character gets jailed for 1 day and ends up in there for over a month due to not being online at the same time as another character with a jail key, the process becomes rather tedious :p

Keikan Hiru · Post by **Keikan Hiru** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 11:22 am

But the moment you implement a timer again, you make jailing once again engine-enforced.
It didn't work that good back then, it became more and more a OOC punishment like a ban.

And I honestly do not want to have another Hagen von Rabenfeld running arround.

Ascius · Post by **Ascius** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:29 pm

And I honestly do not want to have another Hagen von Rabenfeld running arround.

He was one of the best players the online list ever had to offer.

And about jailing, I think the timer back then worked quite well. It gave people time to calm down, or even change their 'way' of acting.
Some criminals are such worse played, that it is only annoying.. getting rid of them for a few hours is a favour, others are played so well that you want to be robbed.

But, many seem to forget, that most of the characters ingame are considered to be on a 'good' or normal side. Gobiath, and especially Trolls Bane is a small town, everyone knows everyone. It's only normal that thiefs and bandits get known very fast, and the punishment will be hard.

At the moment, Trolls Bane has some slight lack of authorities, but once that changes again (if it does), criminals will have to expect hard and quick punishment again.

What was done to thiefs in the past in the real worl? Their hands were cut off. Being in jail for some time is nice compared to that.

Mr. Cromwell · Post by **Mr. Cromwell** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:38 pm

Yeah, but on the other hand:
In the real world, the bandit could hope to kill the witnesses/victims and thus make it a bit more difficult to know who did 'it'. In Illarion it takes about fifteen minutes and the entire island knows what the bandit looks like. Mask, no mask..

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:50 pm

That´s the point.

There should be a "disguise" skill, if you activate it, some of your ID numbers are hidden, the better you are the more are hidden. And you should be able to tell someone a false name, an alias.

but in the meantime

I would appreciate to see a general rule, how many or what numbers are allowed to be written publicly.

Mr. Cromwell · Post by **Mr. Cromwell** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:11 pm

Actually, better way of doing it would be some item (hood?) that gives you a new ID as you equip it. This ID would be constant and unchangeable(causing every character to basically have 2 ID's, normal and "hidden") for the time your character equips the hood. Because if you "hide" the ID totally/randomly scramble it, then nobody has any chance of EVER catching the person. Ever. Which would be even worse sitiuation.

But that probably requires some heavy changes in the way character names are dealt with..

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:29 pm

hm that would also be nice...but I actually meant that if you activate this skill you lose constantly "mana" at the same time.

But I think we´re going far off topic here^^

about forced RP:
due to the software there will always be misunderstandings. Anything is OK as long as there aren´t negative effects on a char who didn´t agree. By knowing that there are rules that will be enforced a criminal agrees to jailtime, but of course not to a hanging or something, except the case that there are appropriate laws or announcements (e.g. if you perm kill a citizen of Briar the punishment is hanging).
After all I think we should not forget that this is just a game, a game about RP and fun for everyone and not about whose char is the greatest.

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 5:30 pm

Coding suggestion:

The hood scrambles the number in a CONSISTANT way (example X2)

If there is a report, the GM has only to divide by two to get the correct one.

Easy, and simple.

Kiilii Zaltana · Post by **Kiilii Zaltana** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:15 pm

One problem with that, though, are the oldest players who still have rather low numbers. Doubling might conflict in that manner (although it'd be interesting--a char disguises themselves, but looks so much like another character that they are mistaken for them).

Maybe a coding using random letters assigned to the various digits 0-9. 1=R, 2=C, 3=K, and so forth, thus translating the player number from "Someone (1937434652)" to "Someone (RNKYFKFPQC)" so you "know" they're hidden, but not sure exactly who it might be.

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Wed Apr 04, 2007 6:21 pm

new discussion-->new topic pls.