About the recent plot.

[A dark figure]

I don't want to speak too much OOC about this, since I am personally enjoying it greatly, and am sure mostly everyone involved is enjoying it too, but I would like to say something:
I am not a GM, have absolutely no other powers than a normal player.
I did not receive any help from a staff member, except from dropping clues (items, trees, herbs, etc..) on the ground to heat the plot up a little.

Everything is done in a good, roleplaying way.
I am sure most have suspicions about who she or he might be, but that's the whole point of it!

After the plot ends, I will personally explain how everything was done, every single happening, every single kidnapping. The real persons behind the players of the orcs, Seer, accomplices, will be revealed **If they agree themselves** , so you can thank them of their awesome roleplay (I'm doing that right now too.) And I simply hope everyone is enjoying their time.

If someone /really/ does not want to get involved at all, and disliked the plot, please send me a PM, and none of your characters will get involved at all. (E.g; If your character is a lonely farmer that speaks to now one..)

Thank you,
A red eye has been drawn on the end of this parchment.

[Samantha Meryadeles]

I wonder whatelse may happen to make the guards looking even more like fools and idiots. currently the rp i follow on the boards turn the guards into a joke. and thats sad.

-they get kidnapped

-someone simply walks into their jail and frees someone other as if he is buying some potatos in a shop.

-they get pinned against trees and tremble in fear after a huge and bulky orc was able to sneak upon them through hiding on a tree and jumping down.

-they have, so it looks at the forum, no clues and are helpless.

-they lose important allies and help since those are frightened of the seers actions and do stupid failures.


when i read about callith and bailey redoing the guard i thought "hey, that looks good...looks like we will have again an active and usable guard". and i was happy. since we missed such a guard for a too long time.
But somehow the whole RP at the forum changes that and makes them looking bad =( .

If i dislike something at the whole plot and happenings then this...that it, so it looks from the view of an outsider, makes the guard and its members looking like a joke.

wish that wouldn't be so.

why do we still have a jail? Seems 90 % of those kept there are able to escape it anyway.

Why do we have a guard? All they can do is jail someone for a few days until he escapes or gather 20 men to send one or two powergamed criminal chars, IF they ever are able to catch them, to the cross and see them again the next day as if nothing happened.

Isn't there an other solution?


sorry if that appears offtopic. but it is something that bothers me since a long time now and what dampens my motivation to play, since i tried to play a char busy with law enforcement and such.

I see currently not really a chance that we will have any other RP beside criminal rp much in the future.

Don't understand me wrong. Such RP is needed, if done good. But too much can be very destructive. Too many bandits, too many evil Warriors and lichs and whatelse, too many kidnappings, too many murder...

it summons up so easily over the last months.

Now i read at the RP forum that again a lich or whatelse, lets say a messager of the darkness, evil and powerfull, appeared on the isle...

will that never stop? or atleast become innovative again? Do we really need the 50. bandit chief or master mind of crime? or the 20. lich and moshran servant?

Have we lost the ability to do other roleplay this days then this?

I miss the times at the camp fires...everything was easier that days...everything appeared different...better...less stressfull and more entertaining. everything seemed better structuted and originally.

*sighs*

maybe i become old in illarion too...too old for the illarion we have now. i am an illarion pensioner who misses the good old times.

wheres my walking stick and pigeon food? The roleplayer park is waiting for me. Hope they have the promised virgins ready.

Patric

[Nitram]

will that never stop? or atleast become innovative again? Do we really need the 50. bandit chief or master mind of crime? or the 20. lich and moshran servant?

May i just didn't got it since i don't read the RPG Board very exactly.

But who are the current ones you count in that list?

Nitram

[Juliana D'cheyne]

I am actually enjoying the plot...and never thought the Guards looked foolish. As in RL, the good guys don't always win...especially not right away. Criminals can out-number law enforcement (but I haven't really noticed this ig). As far as a key, or I assumed it was a key, that unlocked the jail cell...it seems that would also point to the identity of the Seer?

[Fooser]

I'm not really involved or even close, but from a distance it seems intriguing, enough so that there seems to be a lot of stress placed on certain people. I also don't see how the guards are looking foolish there. They can only do what they can given the situation. Callith, Bailey, and whoever else is an active guard is probably the best guard group there's been in months. Also consider that they dont have that many people, and probably won't due to the way the citizen list is (made up of A) Knights B) People who are already guards or C) People who dont like them or don't care). I might be missing something like Nitram, but I havent noticed all these bandits people keep talking about..

[Siltaris]

All I want to say is that at the moment there are too many plots going on to handle every one in an appropriate way.

[Siltaris]

Also consider that they dont have that many people, and probably won't due to the way the citizen list is (made up of A) Knights B) People who are already guards or C) People who dont like them or don't care).

The citizen list has little to do with the number of Guards. The Citizen list represents the the current will of players to be active and to get involved into more political roleplay - to play 'good' chars....

[Bailey Thunnigan]

...and never thought the Guards looked foolish. As in RL, the good guys don't always win...especially not right away.

Ehehehe. The Guards.. well that's a topic for it it's own. I think playing a guard is one of the most difficult things ingame. Why? Because it is annoying. Yes, I'm still playing a guard. I'm playing guards since my very first char. Why? Because it is needed.
Because someone has to do the dirty job, and nothing else it is.

You gain nothing from it. You don't get paid. You have to get your equipment yourself. You have to handle with newbie-attackrs. You have to handle with bad rped criminals. And when you are lucky you can deal with good rped criminals. 90% of the chars in general are hating the town guard. And no matter how often you save the chars life, no one will ever thank you for it, care about it or take it in consideration.

That is the reason why there are like no guards ingame. Because it's not only no fun for the char, but it's neither a lot of fun for the player either. And still there are a few people trying to deal with it, because it's non the less a gain for the game. Because not all the players are able to just watch and shrug the shoulders because nothing concerns them.

.. so if you ask me. The Guard fraction 'never' wins. No matter what..

[Juliana D'cheyne]

Juliana grins at her post and getting a pen writes at the end of it

I like a challenge, what do I need to do to join?

[Kiilii Zaltana]

I'm enjoying it (my char isn't ).

[Bailey Thunnigan]

Juliana grins at her post and getting a pen writes at the end of it

I like a challenge, what do I need to do to join?

Pouncing either Bailey or Callith ingame


*

Now what I would like to achieve is a guard that could be at least a little bit similar to what it was in former times. It wasn't only a bunch of warriors, it was actually a family. And that was the only RP where you could have find 'rest' from the stress. It was like that when Hagen von Rabenfeld was captain; it was like that when John Irencius was captain and it was like that when Pendar was. Your char had the feeling to belong somewhere.. knew people he can trust. Sitting around with them at a campfire and having some good time. In my opinion that gave the game a certain flair.


err, sorry for hijacking your thread, Seer.

[A dark figure]

You will get punished for that, Bailey.

The Seer

[Enwell van Illdoran]

i agree with Siltaris. There are wa to much plots going on. Me char is a member of the grey light. I always hear anything about what is going on on the island. and serious, i lost the thread in its whole. Although i am enjoying these criminal RP, i think this causes more trouble. And thats the problem in Illarion: Everybody can play a bandit. He dont even needs a good concept to play one.

Good RPed Bandits rather attract players to play a bandit themselves.

But the point where i am agreeing with Patric is: there is currently no oppsite fraction which could attract players.

The guard fraction plays good, no doubt about that. but they look like fools, when there are two bandits attacking someone, then get slayn by free fighters like Aleytys, and vice captain of the town guard bailey hasn't noticed anything while standing in front of the tavern. That makes guards look like fools.

For my oppinion:
If the Bandit fraction gets support from the staff with dropping clues, there should be support for the guard fraction as well.

i like to hear a staff member oppinion about this..

((Rock it, Nitters, *gives him the microphone*))

[A dark figure]

The droppings of clues were to help the ones seeking the captives and finding The Seer.
It doesn't help The Seer to leave hints around. He wouldn't do that, but I asked it to be done so it might.. add a little thing to the plot..

And with all my respects, I didn't come one day, create a char, and start kidnapping people. There is a concept.

[Siltaris]

There is a concept behind the official structures and all doings of Troll's Bane as well. Seems if two concepts are going against each other - the one was set up with lots of work over months and is planned to get improved over the upcoming weeks; the second concept undermines the first one.

What I want to say: If anyone does any actions in game, one have to think not only about ig-effects, but about issues of whole game balancing and game mechanisms.

Just to make clear: This is no offence at all to the Seer. Your plot is a good one as it seems. But there is little opporunity for myself to get really involved at the moment, cause of too many plots going on.
However, I will (have to) try to deal with that situation. And that's what I'll do.

[Nitram]

The problem, i think is that too many players here want to have power. They want to lead Trollbane. Unimportaint if they are able or not.

Now it shows, no player is able to lead this town. Unimportaint if the player has a plan how to do it or not.
There is to much opposition by players who start to play the mean characters now with the only order to take over the town.

Its sadly. But at the end all this opposition will lead only to one thing.

To a GM-Leaded Trollsbane.

In case Siltaris and her Government fails due too many villain characters I will start and discussion at the GM Board about taking over the town with a gm character and lead it with this Char.

You, the players, showed that you are not able to accept any authority in the game but forced authority of the gms.

Nitram

[Ku 'Agor]

Nitram, you fail.

Miserably.

Go away. Now.

[Korm Kormsen]

you fail.

Miserably.

well, than he is in your company.
or do you think it's success, to enter a guild (clan) and then work against it?


Edit: aparently i am wrong, and it was a success.


i think Nitram is right. we got a lot of players, who want to play chiefs, but few players, that want to play simple braves.
(and i don't exclude myself here)

[Dariya]

you fail.

Miserably.

well, than he is in your company.
or do you think it's success, to enter a guild (clan) and then work against it?

i think Nitram is right. we got a lot of players, who want to play chiefs, but few players, that want to play simple braves.
(and i don't exclude myself here)

you ARE a chief, and you have followers or braves

but anyway, this discussion again shows me, that Illa isn't about RP anymore ... but about skills: train fighting as much and often as you can to kick all the others' a....s and to rule ...
this is a sad development, which ... well, yes obviously can only be solved by GMs interfering

*sighs* too bad

[Fooser]

You, the players, showed that you are not able to accept any authority in the game but forced authority of the gms.

Translation: Some random character will come out of no where, perhaps we might even be blessed with some overly cliche story. From there the town will split again between people who think it's stupid, and people who have a tendancy to kiss GM's ass whenever the possibility arises.

[Nitram]

Translation: Some random character will come out of no where, perhaps we might even be blessed with some overly cliche story. From there the town will split again between people who think it's stupid, and people who have a tendancy to kiss GM's ass whenever the possibility arises.

Yes, no way else since noone else is able to handle it differently.
Did not happen now. But it will happen if it goes on like it is now.

EDIT: But may it become slightly worser, Fooser old friend. I think the town will become something like completly inactive. It will stagnate, since the "GM Leader" will hardly do anything then order the repairing of buildings/walls that got distroyed like quests and knocking down attacks from players who want to take over the town by a massiv amount of NPC Guards.
Thats the reality of a GM leaded town.

I don't like this too. But in case its the only way... it shall happen.

Nitram

[Taylor]

I find this stupid. Sorry to bring the proverbs. But here it is. "The Change of Leadership is never stable. Revolution brings a rain of blood, only when you can suppress the ones through a non-violent struggle, can one obtain peace"

Sorry. But having a GM lead the town. and Seriously Over Mauling any character that tries to take over is Bullshit. Thats right. Bullshit. Characters in game can't even summon skeletons, yet you want to summon invisible guards from no where, to keep your lust for power sustained. I think that the players have every right to Lead, and Overthrow the government. Their are tyrants and those loved by the people. We should deal with our own problems in game. Gm's should just watch for people destroying the RP atmosphere and Do quests. Do not budge into Player affairs just because you don't like how it is going, But is still a valid RP. You do this more often than naught. and Frankly. I'm sick of it.

Though the one that did this the most has left, and been banned. I still do not want to see gm Interference. It would destroy the whole purpose of living in trollsbane. Since you would be under the control of a Character so overpowered that he is a tyrant. And that char will never be Present for anything. Atleast with a Player char, there is humility and fragility. It makes it more real, more fun. Someone will come along that will unite everyone just as Pendar Did. But it takes time. Do not stick your nose into Valid RP affairs just because you want something to go another way. Thats Bollocks. I've seen it happen more than once, and some of the offenders got a mere slap on the wrist and a "Bad boy. Stop that."

[Kiilii Zaltana]

I'm with Taylor on this one...

Throughout history, no governing power was ever certain nor stable. Greeks conquered the world, Romans conquered the Greeks and more of the world, Roman Empire fell apart into tribal warfare, individual countries developed with little sporadic wars between them, World Wars I and II created/split/removed/merged several countries, and the end of the Cold War split the world's largest (land area) superpower into several smaller countries.

By creating an indisputable, invincible, static government, you severly limit potential RP. Illa, at this point in time, is more oriented around individuals and groups rather than entire races banding together. T&M Trading, a multiracial corporation, is a more cohesive entity than the race of elves as a whole.

The towns themselves are static emplacements, and granted... races lay claim to their respective locations. Looking at history, however, how many different cultures have laid claim to Jerusalem over the past 5,000 years? Let's see... Egypt, Persia, Greece, Rome, Arabia, England, Israel, Palestine, etc. Same town, different governments, all always in flux.

Flux is a realistic, and often healthy, attribute to a culture. Right now, the world of Illarion (IG) is in a state of flux. If someone can come along to unite the people, then I say let them try. They have plenty of competition to test their mettle and resolution to the matter, and if they can quell everything else, then they're the best chance we (as characters) have for a leader.

[Nitram]

I find this stupid.

Same here but i have no different idea to make the town calming down. Do you have a idea to establish a stable leadership?

ISorry to bring the proverbs. But here it is. "The Change of Leadership is never stable. Revolution brings a rain of blood, only when you can suppress the ones through a non-violent struggle, can one obtain peace"

Then we have revolution since more then a RL year. That the problem and this is the realy crap. And exactly that has no chance. Eighter the players are able to chance that constant situation of "revolution" or the GMs have to solve it.

Sorry. But having a GM lead the town. and Seriously Over Mauling any character that tries to take over is Bullshit.

Its not good, but much better then the instable current situation. Everyone who tried in the past to give the town a stable government failed due powerhungry characters, whos players are the most times not able to lead a town, since the lack of ideas and knowledge how to handle something like this.

And only

Thats right.

Characters in game can't even summon skeletons,

I have no idea, why you are writing this. But i think that is pretty good since that power would be too much for our powerhungry wanna-be townleaders.

yet you want to summon invisible guards from no where, to keep your lust for power sustained.

In case the players force to gms ( like they do at the very moment ) to take over the town. That is a step to make the gm government stable. In case the players make us taking over the town as gms, that status will not change for a VERY long time.

I think that the players have every right to Lead, and Overthrow the government.

From time to time yes. But at the moment, EVERY goverment gets NO chance to establish, since there are allways a few players who don't like the current leading characters or players and want to stop them leading this way. In case the players do not exept any governship and do not give any other leadership even a slightly chance to establish, the players loose there right to lead Trollsbane.

Their are tyrants and those loved by the people.

Currently it is in face in this way, that some like a leading characters and some other do not. The groups changes from leader to leader, but there are allways those who are with the leadership and some who are against. And allways those who didn't like the current leadership attacked the town in some way and knowed the leadership of. Took it over and got knocked out days or weeks later. And so on.

We should deal with our own problems in game.

That's absolutly right. But as it seems the players are not able to get along with that situation and are not able to solve it. And exactly that is the point were the work of the GMs start.

Gm's should just watch for people destroying the RP atmosphere and Do quests.

And destroying the RP atmosphere is currently happening now. It those instability in importaint positions makes it impossible to establish real RP atmosphere in the town. So in face, all these intrigues are destroying the RP since it is just too much.

Some intrigues are good for roleplay and nice. But too much destroys it. and exactly this is happening now.

Do not budge into Player affairs just because you don't like how it is going,

We have to budge the players, if there roleplay destroys the fun of everyone else.

But is still a valid RP.

Valid roleplay is not good roleplay at the same time. And good roleplay requieres that all involved parties have fun with it. And in case your roleplay destroys the fun too often, you become a OOC problematic player. And be handled in this way.

You do this more often than naught. and Frankly. I'm sick of it.

I'm in a good mood today, so i did no read ths.

Though the one that did this the most has left, and been banned.

And not without reasons. But that was not the fault of the other players.

I still do not want to see gm Interference.

Same here. But as i sad. In case the players leave us no different chance...
They only have to except a government and let it working.

It would destroy the whole purpose of living in trollsbane.

There is currently no purpose to live in this town, since the situation changes every day. One day you are fine with the government, having everything handled ( e.g. with your house, taxes and stuff ) and the next day, the old goverment has been knocked out, a new is in, and you have to discuss again. That the problem of that instability.

Since you would be under the control of a Character so overpowered that he is a tyrant.

Yes, and? At least it is stable and does not change every second day.

And that char will never be Present for anything.

Correct. He will be never there. Thats the price of the inability of the players to accept something a other player created. Thats the buissness of the player to change this problem.

Atleast with a Player char, there is humility and fragility.

I do not get the point of this. Sorry.

It makes it more real, more fun.

Indeed. But too much of it destroys the fun

Someone will come along that will unite everyone just as Pendar Did.

His regime fall and he left. He was not better then anyone else.

But it takes time.

Many many are sick of the problems, since some great characters, think that they have to lead too. But then they face that they are not able too. And everything goes down the pan.

Do not stick your nose into Valid RP affairs just because you want something to go another way.

The current way is just bullshit. Plain and simple. You are not able to handle it. The gms are able. Be sure.

Thats Bollocks.

As the current situation is.

I've seen it happen more than once, and some of the offenders got a mere slap on the wrist and a "Bad boy. Stop that."

But at the end all had success. So your "slapping" was not really successfully.

Nitram

[Alytys Lamar]

I think the new Government needs only more time. Let Siltaris play and Callith and Bailey administrate the guards...

It's a lot of work to be a leader >.<

Btw.. I would it really dislike a GM interfere here

So I agree with Taylor and Kiilii, all cultures and great towns in past are in a constantly fluctuation with the leaders, with revolutions, crime and more or less conflicts. So let it flow...

[Rasteel Olin]

I find this stupid.

Same here but i have no different idea to make the town calming down. Do you have a idea to establish a stable leadership?

ISorry to bring the proverbs. But here it is. "The Change of Leadership is never stable. Revolution brings a rain of blood, only when you can suppress the ones through a non-violent struggle, can one obtain peace"

Then we have revolution since more then a RL year. That the problem and this is the realy crap. And exactly that has no chance. Eighter the players are able to chance that constant situation of "revolution" or the GMs have to solve it.

Sorry. But having a GM lead the town. and Seriously Over Mauling any character that tries to take over is Bullshit.

Its not good, but much better then the instable current situation. Everyone who tried in the past to give the town a stable government failed due powerhungry characters, whos players are the most times not able to lead a town, since the lack of ideas and knowledge how to handle something like this.

And only

Thats right.

Characters in game can't even summon skeletons,

I have no idea, why you are writing this. But i think that is pretty good since that power would be too much for our powerhungry wanna-be townleaders.

yet you want to summon invisible guards from no where, to keep your lust for power sustained.

In case the players force to gms ( like they do at the very moment ) to take over the town. That is a step to make the gm government stable. In case the players make us taking over the town as gms, that status will not change for a VERY long time.

I think that the players have every right to Lead, and Overthrow the government.

From time to time yes. But at the moment, EVERY goverment gets NO chance to establish, since there are allways a few players who don't like the current leading characters or players and want to stop them leading this way. In case the players do not exept any governship and do not give any other leadership even a slightly chance to establish, the players loose there right to lead Trollsbane.

Their are tyrants and those loved by the people.

Currently it is in face in this way, that some like a leading characters and some other do not. The groups changes from leader to leader, but there are allways those who are with the leadership and some who are against. And allways those who didn't like the current leadership attacked the town in some way and knowed the leadership of. Took it over and got knocked out days or weeks later. And so on.

We should deal with our own problems in game.

That's absolutly right. But as it seems the players are not able to get along with that situation and are not able to solve it. And exactly that is the point were the work of the GMs start.

Gm's should just watch for people destroying the RP atmosphere and Do quests.

And destroying the RP atmosphere is currently happening now. It those instability in importaint positions makes it impossible to establish real RP atmosphere in the town. So in face, all these intrigues are destroying the RP since it is just too much.

Some intrigues are good for roleplay and nice. But too much destroys it. and exactly this is happening now.

Do not budge into Player affairs just because you don't like how it is going,

We have to budge the players, if there roleplay destroys the fun of everyone else.

But is still a valid RP.

Valid roleplay is not good roleplay at the same time. And good roleplay requieres that all involved parties have fun with it. And in case your roleplay destroys the fun too often, you become a OOC problematic player. And be handled in this way.

You do this more often than naught. and Frankly. I'm sick of it.

I'm in a good mood today, so i did no read ths.

Though the one that did this the most has left, and been banned.

And not without reasons. But that was not the fault of the other players.

I still do not want to see gm Interference.

Same here. But as i sad. In case the players leave us no different chance...
They only have to except a government and let it working.

It would destroy the whole purpose of living in trollsbane.

There is currently no purpose to live in this town, since the situation changes every day. One day you are fine with the government, having everything handled ( e.g. with your house, taxes and stuff ) and the next day, the old goverment has been knocked out, a new is in, and you have to discuss again. That the problem of that instability.

Since you would be under the control of a Character so overpowered that he is a tyrant.

Yes, and? At least it is stable and does not change every second day.

And that char will never be Present for anything.

Correct. He will be never there. Thats the price of the inability of the players to accept something a other player created. Thats the buissness of the player to change this problem.

Atleast with a Player char, there is humility and fragility.

I do not get the point of this. Sorry.

It makes it more real, more fun.

Indeed. But too much of it destroys the fun

Someone will come along that will unite everyone just as Pendar Did.

His regime fall and he left. He was not better then anyone else.

But it takes time.

Many many are sick of the problems, since some great characters, think that they have to lead too. But then they face that they are not able too. And everything goes down the pan.

Do not stick your nose into Valid RP affairs just because you want something to go another way.

The current way is just bullshit. Plain and simple. You are not able to handle it. The gms are able. Be sure.

Thats Bollocks.

As the current situation is.

I've seen it happen more than once, and some of the offenders got a mere slap on the wrist and a "Bad boy. Stop that."

But at the end all had success. So your "slapping" was not really successfully.

Nitram

Nitramified.

[Taylor]

Thank you Nitram. For proving my point of how bias you are. There was a Revolution. Overthrowing Stephen. DO YOU REALISE HOW LONG IT TOOK JAPAN TO SWITCH FROM THE TOKOGAWA ERA TO THE MEIJI ERA?! 15 fucking years. So you saying that the revolution has been going on for a year, and is ruining rp is just plain hypocrisies. You can not. I repeat, Can not interfere like you did with the Silverbrand Revolution. Siltaris is keeping the Government under control politically. Once we can get some people to start caring, and playing a Guard. then we will have physical stability. Oh, and one more thing. Don't quote and harass me again. I was not targeting you.

[Rasteel Olin]

He wasn't harassing you, Taylor. That's the way he replies to messages.
Anyways, playing a guard is no fun.
Karl Salameh, for instance.
It was boring, and crappy.
The ONLY way for perhaps the government being able to be led by players, is if GMs gave the leaders, every week or so, something like.. 30-40 silvers. So they can pay guards, and other workers.
Only that way, will people want to become guards and such.

[Nitram]

The ONLY way for perhaps the government being able to be led by players, is if GMs gave the leaders, every week or so, something like.. 30-40 silvers. So they can pay guards, and other workers.
Only that way, will people want to become guards and such.

But in the case, the GMs give the town this ( or and different ) amount of silver.

How to do it, that its fair to all other towns?
And will the players who get nothing from the money, accept this? Or will they moan, that the gms are soooo unfair?

What was discussed to modify the amounf of silver by the active characters who are citizens of this town. But who checks if they are active or not. Every ( say month ) again and again.

@Taylor:
As Rasteel said. It was not against you, that is my way, trying to challenge your arguments.

but you placed the main question.

Once we can get some people to start caring

How?

Nitram

[Ku 'Agor]

That does seem fair, nitram.

We should try that. Say (5-10Silver)x(Active member) = Per Week.

If people complain, we stop, and we can be on our own.

And then, we can lose to you mighty GMs on top of Mount Olympus.