About elves and other races compared to humans

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 8:22 am

Let's take for example the elves, the most similar to humans in physical appearance and size. The background information about elves in Illarion count them as adults at about 180 years, but how about the appearance ratio to humans? In other words:

1. Do human and elves look the same until the age of human adulthood (around 18 ) and then humans continue to look older while elves stay the same as they looked at 18 for the next couple thousand years?

2.OR do the appearance of elves change until they are 180 at the same rate that human appearance changes until they are 18, so that a 90 year old elf looks like a 9 year old human? (meaning that elves appearance change at a much slower rate until for the first 180 years and then appears to stop changing completely after that)

3. OR neither of these rates?

In my opinion I favor #1 over #2 because number #1 seems more plausible and easier to work with. At least it is possible for elven and human children to grow up together looking similarly during childhood.

Then what about dwarves, halflings, lizards, orcs, etc? That is, if their appearance can be compared to humans.

Then also, at what age for each race do they usually have children?

Shadow Wraith · Post by **Shadow Wraith** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 11:20 am

Elves have long life spans, and are considered "immortal".
Elvens do age, but a a very slow pace...
so it doesnt mean there is a age where the elvens finally start to get old.
They are getting old, but they are able to maintain a health and more youthful life span.
Human Children and Elven Children look the same and developed in a way you can say the "same way" too. But the difference is, a aduld stage of a human comes much faster.
Humans are considered to be "slow in maturing"... so imagine how slow elvens get, since it takes 180 years.
In that case, elvens reproduction rate is quite small, though numbers can be large. Elves live in a heavily controled environment, not doing to much or too little.

Basicly, think of it this way,
18 year old male human or female, is considered mature, and near or near, or is, adult.
180 year old elven male or female is considered mature.
10x slower.

it could be very well possible that human children, in the race to grow and age is faster, though there isnt much to brag about when your going to live only "so amount" than the elves...... oh.... about 1900 years avg???

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:01 pm

Shadow Wraith wrote: Basicly, think of it this way,
18 year old male human or female, is considered mature, and near or near, or is, adult.
180 year old elven male or female is considered mature.
10x slower.

We know this already. I'm talking about the rate of change in physical appearance.

Brendan Mason · Post by **Brendan Mason** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:43 pm

Elves do not appear to grow old on the outside until they reach extremely old years, then (so I have read) their appearance deteriorates very rapidly and they appear much much older than the oldest of humans.

Shadow Wraith · Post by **Shadow Wraith** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 11:46 pm

"10x slower"

that was the rate.

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 12:01 am

Then according to your theory, if a human and elven child grow up together, when the human reaches 18 years of age, the elf will still look like less than a 2 year old baby.

Shadow Wraith · Post by **Shadow Wraith** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 12:44 pm

dyluck, perhaps you should go to someplace and find a elf and ask him or her.
i dont care if its santas little work shop, or some mystical forest, but go and ask.

Who really said they had to grow at the same rate in childhood?
what mith of orcs, elves, dwarves dont differ?
who accually "seen" a orc and said they have green skin? why not red? why not blue?
i told you it was "basic" meaning its logical, but not advancely, and until i hold a elf prisoner for generation of sciencist to see, we wont know, and can only tell from the stories we've heard.
and like history, its his or her story, and they will be different.
if you all ready knew, why did you ask?
if you did ask, why do you reject?
if you know its fact or atleast the two you have stated, then show us the internest artical about how the army raided santa's workshop and examine the lifespan of elves...

seriously---

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 4:39 pm

Consider the "counts as an adult" as a society-based adulthood. Elves would grow slower than humans, perhaps about twice as slow, not slower. They would be full-grown at about 30 or 40 years. They would grow faster in their youth also, then aging less and less. Even at extremely high ages, they would look young, but you would be able to catch a glimpse of their real age by looking at their behaviour, and perhaps by looking into their eyes.

Shadow Wraith · Post by **Shadow Wraith** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 6:01 pm

"Elves would grow slower than humans, perhaps about twice as slow, not slower."

so....
A truck would be bigger than a car, perhaps twice as big, but not bigger...

right?

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 7:09 pm

Correct. You got it, not quite, but almost.

The "not slower" means : it is not slower than twice as slow.

Means, if a human baby and an elven baby grow up together, after three years they look almost same, after seven years, the elven one loks as if about two to three years yonger, at the age of fifteen, the elf would look as ten to twelve. Art the age of about twenty, the elf would still look as aged fifteen or so, and at the age of thirty, the elf still looks as if he was about sixteen to eighteen. At the age of fourty, the elf looks as if he was about twenty to twenty-three, and does not seem to age anymore. He may still grows onr or two centimetres, but extremely slow, until he is about a hundred to a hundred and fifty years old. So, take an elf as "full grown", physically, with about fourty years, and in elven society, he counts as a full adult at an age of 180.
It's that simple

Setherioth · Post by **Setherioth** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 9:08 pm

Who really said they had to grow at the same rate in childhood?
what mith of orcs, elves, dwarves dont differ?

-Shadow Wraith

Nobody said that. That was the whole point of Dyluck making this topic. He was asking about it. He wanted to hear peoples opinions. He wasn't saying that was how it worked and that you should tell him how wrong he is...

Dyluck · Post by **Dyluck** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 9:08 pm

I never said anything HAD to be a certain way, shadowraith. The subject dosen't have a set standard yet for Illarion, that's why it's open to discussion now, that's the whole point. You just fail to understand that your general use of the words "growth" and "maturity" fails to differenciate between physical appearance (which we are discussing now)and mental (which is already provided in the backgroundstory) and that the rates of change between physical appearance and mental maturity does not neccesarily have the same rate of change. Feel free to say what you think the rate is, but no need to feel offended just because your theory isn't agreed upon.

Shadow Wraith · Post by **Shadow Wraith** » Sun Oct 20, 2002 9:10 pm

Human Age-Elven Age (look based)

born-born
7-4
15-10
20-15
30-18
40-23

41to100 -does not age
180 (3 generations later)-26

(*warp*)

300-30
500-38
800-40
1000-50

1500-70(*turning point)

2000-140 (age deterioration increase dramaticly)

~=2000 years = end of aging of a elven.

Oh-Kay, I see what you mean