Open for business - Turin's metal works and such.

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Wed May 01, 2002 7:27 pm

Hello all this is the notice of the openning of my new store which is located where I am currently at. I hope to take on a business partner to help out but till then it is just me. I take orders and have some stock. Here is a list of my prices.

Fire swords 20gp
Plate armor 20gp
Knite helmet 15gp
Knite shield 20gp
Knite gloves 10gp
Knite boots 10gp
Snow flake amulett 20gp

Arrows 2gp a piece unless 200 or more ordered then 1gp each(Arrows must have order place for them here)
Cross bolts same as arrows
Bow 10gp
cross bow 15gp
Wind arrows 3gp each unless 200 more then 2gp(must place order)
Top battle staff 20gp
Wands 50gp

Orange healing potions 7gp each
Mana potions 7gp each
Green healing potions 10gp each(must place order for all potions)

At the time this is all I sell I hope to increase my stock soon but I can only make so much. Blackscales I offer you a partner ship in my business please speak to me.

Erdrick · Post by **Erdrick** » Wed May 01, 2002 7:33 pm

I am sorry Turin, those prices are WAY TOO LOW, much unrealistical.
Plate Mail armor costs almost as much as a whole village back in medieval. Now you sel it for a measly 20 gold?! Outrageous!
I don't know what you are trying to accomplish, but you are really ruining my business with those prices. Maybe you're blind, but theres something called SMACC trying to correct this.

Turnupto · Post by **Turnupto** » Wed May 01, 2002 8:18 pm

Think of smacc! A few guys nearly killed me....

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Wed May 01, 2002 10:38 pm

Erdrick for your information as long as I make the armor myself I can sell it for what ever price I want. After all the Iron ore and coal are free and it doesn't take that long to smith the stuff. So I don't see the problem with selling the stuff I MAKE for the price I choose. Now if you and your friends think that you can tell me what price I can and can't sell stuff for. Then you are try to take away compition between businesses. The freedom of smithys to choose thier own prices. Not to mension coming across as some high and mighty authority of some sort. So to put in words you can understand you have no right to tell me what prices I can sell MY weapons and armor at.

Astral · Post by **Astral** » Wed May 01, 2002 11:26 pm

Youre not going to be able to retain your skills for long if you continue with these outrageous prices. SMACC sets the standards for all trading now, and your prices do not comply. So you either comply and raise the prices, or dont comply and close shop. Simple as that, no in between.

Erdrick · Post by **Erdrick** » Thu May 02, 2002 12:18 am

When you sell for prices like THOSE, it doesn't even make sense! Did you read what I just told you? I really don't mind if you offend SMACC, but when you get in the way of true blacksmiths, I won't even try to help you. You continue like that. Sure, the newcomers will enjoy loads of cheap armor. But then, when the village is in flames, we can all blame it on you.

Beowulf Roughknight · Thu May 02, 2002 12:32 am

To Erdrick,

"When the village is in flames?" What does that mean Erdrick? That you are going to set fire to the town because you are mad at him for his prices being too low? Turin's prices have nothing to do with the welfare of this village. I don't really see what the big deal is, though I do stay near SMACC prices. Really Erdrick, the village in flames? You would have no one to blame but the people that didn't help to "stop" or "prevent" the flames. I highly doubt that he will be to blame for that.

P.S. When you said that the price of plate in the medival era was almost the price of the village, you were exaggerating WAAAY too much. It was a bad era, but not THAT bad.

To Turin,

I must say, your prices are low. So low that there is no point in selling anything for you. I don't see how you profit from this in anyway, but if that is how you turn a profit, then that is how you turn a profit. You are right Turin, it is your equipment, just be careful when dealing with the SMACC people, they tend to be edgy it seems when prices get that low. If you want my opinion (which you probably don't) then I would say that you should raise prices at least by 130 gold on your knight's equipment. Leave your arrows and that sort of thing the same, but charge about 130 more for fireswords, plate, and all knight's equipment.

Sincerely always,
Beowulf Roughknight

Astral · Post by **Astral** » Thu May 02, 2002 2:41 am

If you look at Erdrick's post with the slightest common sense, you can easily see that what he meant was this:

The "young ones" who would normally be too weak and scared to go around attacking the town and such. But now that they have easy access to cheap armor and weapons, they are no longer all that weak and WILL go around and attack people and such. And the blame falls at the source of the problem, the one who sold them the cheap equipment.

((And no, Erdrick wasn't exaggerating when he said plate armor cost that much. The SMACC prices are even too LOW to be realistic. In Illarion, EVERYONE has plate armor who is more than a couple weeks old. If you look at stuff from the middle ages, you will see that only the very high class knights own plate armor. That is the way it should be. So if you think he is exaggerating, think again))

Blackscales · Post by **Blackscales** » Thu May 02, 2002 4:04 am

Dear Turin,

Yes, I will join you. But I do see sence in razing the prices a little. It is your shop and your equipment, but you do need to make a profit.Not to much.And yes bad people will buy cheap armor, but good guys will too. SMACC prices do not really matter as much as you think they do. Just because Turin is a better smithy than most, doesn't mean you should get angry at him for selling his things cheaper. I do not see anything wrong with him selling HIS armor for HIS prices. If he can make a profit quicker than the other shop, then good for him. If he can't, he will raise price. So leave him be, you act like a bully because you are afraid that he might put your " Old Guild of Merchants" out of business. Yes I will join. Erdrick has never been nice to me, and I have never been nice to him. We get along better, but refusing me the right to join his guild does give me bad blood.Yes, I would like to put his guild out of business.

Sincerely,
The snake

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Thu May 02, 2002 10:18 am

Well then, since he seems to keep to his prices, all people who follow the SMACC agreement should boycot him, and neither sell to nor buy from him.

Erdrick · Post by **Erdrick** » Thu May 02, 2002 1:28 pm

Blackscales, I never turned you away from our guild. I just told you to look at your recent posts, which were very disrespectful.
Normally, in a guild, we work as a team. While you and I can be friendly, I don't think the trust will ever become more than it is now.
But thanks for bringing my guild into this senseless topic. (*GRML*)

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Thu May 02, 2002 6:16 pm

Hello Turin,

as an opponent of SMACC I am happy to see someone who sells to such fair conditions. And to ensure that the boycot won't ruin you, I offer you to buy your whole stack of items for the mentioned price.

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Thu May 02, 2002 7:43 pm

Blackscales thank you for agreeing to work with me. and since even you think my prices are a little to low I will change them a little. After all if we are partners we must agree. So I will come up with a new list.

Francesca thank you for the support But my Items are for those who need them. Plus as it says in your signeture you are a member of the silver star merchants or did i miss read that? If you are I would rather not have you do this. But if you ever need arrows or potions I can't refuse your business.

Erdrick if you are the head of the silver star merchants then what are you afraid of? After all are you not the best merchant in illarion? So what is there to be scared of O great one. haha.

Damien I sell things to those who cannot make them for them selves or do not have time to. So what good would it do for and your friends not to sell me things? I can make any thing I need myself.

Astral Was that a threat if you do not change your prices you will not retain your skills for long. Well good to so we are all being mature about this.Willing to kill over money. HA you are no better than those thieves that run around stealling any thing they can. Really Astral I thought you where much more mature then that.

And for those of you who think that my prices will be the end of us all just remember. I am not selling mage books so there is no way the town will go up in flames and that both good and bad can purchase my armor and weapons. And I am not going to run Background checks on my custamers just to make sure they are killers.

New list

Fire swords 50gp
Plate armor 50gp
Knight helmet 30p
Knight shield 50gp
Knight gloves 15gp
Knight boots 15gp
Snow flake Amulett 50gp

arrows 2gp a piece unless 200 or more ordered then 1gp each(Arrows must have order place for them here)
Cross bolts same as arrows
Bow 15gp
cross bow 20gp
Wind arrows 3gp each unless 200 more then 2gp(must place order)
Top battle staff 50gp
Wands 100gp

Orange healing potions 10gp each
Mana potions 10gp each
Green healing potions 20gp each(must place order for all potions)

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Thu May 02, 2002 8:47 pm

Fransesca, Turin, others.

I am sad to see that you wipe the floor with common good.
Do you really think that it's rigth that a newbie will gain the best suit of armor, best weapon ect with a hour or two playing?

"P.S. When you said that the price of plate in the medival era was almost the price of the village, you were exaggerating WAAAY too much. It was a bad era, but not THAT bad."

Do you even relize that not every peasant wore a plate/chain/splint armor on the medieval ages? No, they didnt- a knigths platemail set was worth of a middle sized farm easily, so only the "elite" had afford them.

"When the village is in flames?" What does that mean Erdrick? That you are going to set fire to the town because you are mad at him for his prices being too low? Turin's prices have nothing to do with the welfare of this village.

Wrong again, they have something to do with the welfar of the village. Lets have a look at the sitiuation, shall we? You basically GIVE the items to newbie. Who are the people causing most of the res-killings ect? Newbies, thats rigth. So you give the tools of destruction to group of people who are the most unable to use them for good.

"HA you are no better than those thieves that run around stealling any thing they can. "

Neither are you.

"As an opponent of SMACC I am happy to see someone who sells to such fair conditions. And to ensure that the boycot won't ruin you, I offer you to buy your whole stack of items for the mentioned price."

Say, if i'd decide to start selling as LOW prices as this one fellow here, you offer to buy my stack too? hah, that migth become expensive.
tell me.. why are you doing this, Fransesca?

(Edited by Caranthir the great at 10:49 pm on May 2, 2002)

Erdrick · Post by **Erdrick** » Thu May 02, 2002 9:29 pm

@Caranthir: Francesca is doing the right thing, if Turin is smart he will sell to her.
If he doesn't, then his intentions are to make everyone the best. Boy, that will be fun, eh Turin? I like it when a gang of strong people raid the town...

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Thu May 02, 2002 9:41 pm

Some things to clear up:

1) Silverstar Merchants and SMACC are two different things.

2) I am opponent of SMACC. I don't care for price lists of others.

3) No one (except someone voted by all people) has the right to set up laws. So in my eyes SMACC is illegal.

4) Since now Turin and all free merchants are under my very own protection.

5) Astral ... think about what you are saying and what you are doing.

Caranthir the great · Post by **Caranthir the great** » Thu May 02, 2002 9:46 pm

Well, i hate be against you, but i believe that SMACC is for common good, and you nor anyone else shall stop it.

If you really want to change it, get yourself into the SMACC council, i am ready to drop my campaign to be elected and give my vote to you.

But..well..i hope that we'll never get that far, but it would be honor to be shot dead by you, Fransesca my friend.

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Thu May 02, 2002 10:48 pm

Caranthir, my old friend, I don't want anyone anything bad. And there work some honoured people on that project including you and Damien. But that project isn't right. You can't persecute people who are against it. You can't rule over the whole population of Illarion. And there will always be free thinking minds like me. You can try to build up a community with a specific market system. But you must allow other systems like the one I prefer too.

It's on everyone's own to join your system. But you can't force people to it (and that's what you do at the moment). The people fear to get hurt by the systems if they won't follow the prices given on your list. And that's the thing I want to prevent.

And I don't care to offer all my power and all my money to prevent the people from such a monopolistic system.

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Thu May 02, 2002 10:54 pm

Ah, Turin ... I hope your offer still stands ...

I want to buy:

5000 crossbow bolts ... 1 gp each ... 20 silver for all
5000 wind arrows ... 2 gp each ... 40 silver for all

= 60 silver

Do you accept?

I also would appreciate to buy some of the other stuff ... I would give you the double sum of the price you offered (but ony if you sell in minimum 100). Please think about it.

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Thu May 02, 2002 11:39 pm

First off I would like to say this"every one who is not buying my stuff dont write any more post here. Go wine some where else". Francesca I shall try to have your order ready as soon as possible but it may take a while I will let you know when its done. Plus you might have to get them from blackscales my business partner. thank you for your business.

Astral · Post by **Astral** » Fri May 03, 2002 3:48 am

You do not own this board and therefore cannot tell us where to post our messages. This concerns us, so I see no reason that we cannot post our papers here.

About not retaining your skills for long, you have to realize that you have enraged many people and you cant expect them all to settle this nicely. If you are bent on destroying the community, it is not about money. This is not about money at all. Do you think SMACC was created just so people could become rich? It was created to protect those who abide by the laws. If you sell for this price, then any lawbreaker can lay their hands on the best equipment. If you had half a brain you would see this. I will be watching you, and if you do anything that results in lawbreaking, then dont expect it to be pretty. I just hope when lawbreakers buy this cheap equipment, you are the first one to be floating back to the cross.

@#5: That was a mild threat, not necessarily from me, but from the community.

(Edited by Astral at 9:05 pm on May 2, 2002)

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Fri May 03, 2002 11:09 am

I will be watching you, and if you do anything that results in lawbreaking, then dont expect it to be pretty.

Which law do you mean?

Astral · Post by **Astral** » Fri May 03, 2002 7:31 pm

I mean people running through town killing all whom they see, wearing their brand new cheap armor and weapons.

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Fri May 03, 2002 9:35 pm

Astral you can give a man a sword but what he does with it is his business. So by selling weapons and Armor I cannot be held responsible for the actions of those who wear/use it. If so then any one who sells weapons and armor are killers. I am sure erdrick has supplied weapons, armors, arrows, or potions to a killer before. If so should he be killed for the others actions? Plus if some new comer gets his hands on a sword do you think he will know how to use it. Even if he has good weapons he has had no trainnig so it won't really matter what he has. Erdrick wht in the world would people who I have sold weapons and armor to come back and kill thier supplier? It doesn't make since to me. And finally this page is for orders only and if you keep posting here my orders might get lost in the mess. So please stop posting here I have asked nicely go the other side of the wall. And one thing Astral if you think that selling weapons and armor is wrong then me and alot of other people are going to be very unhappy. My advice to you is if you do any thing to break the law I will get evey person I can to hunt you down and punish you for what ever you did. But it would probally only take me to kill you.

Turin Ironhammer · Post by **Turin Ironhammer** » Fri May 03, 2002 9:37 pm

one thing I for got I will be gone from illarion for a day or two on business. I will work twice as hard on your order francesca when I get back.

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Fri May 03, 2002 10:29 pm

fine

And if there's any conflict between you and Astral, remember, I am on your side.

Gandela · Post by **Gandela** » Fri May 03, 2002 10:33 pm

Wäre nett wenn jemand folgendes Übersetzt:
"Smacc, ist noch kein Gesetzt, wird aber mit Sicherheit eins. Noch können wir niemanden zwingen nach smacc zu handeln, aber bald. Und wenn es soweit dann werden wir auch smacc auch durchsetzten und jeden einzelnden zu dumpingpreisen verkaufenden Pfuscher zur Hölle jagen! Und ich sage es euch wer jetzt berreits aktiv gegen smacc handelt wird keine guten Karten haben wenn wir offiziel gegen ihn handeln dürfen! Wir sind Meister unseres Handwerks und keine stupiden Proletaria und wir werden niemals uns so herrabsetzten das wir unsere Meisterstücke zu solchen Preisen verscherbeln. Wer Platten Panzer für 50gp verscheurt hat endweder so eine Massenpoduktion das es nur Schrott sein kann oder wählt Dumpingpreise um die Konkurenz auszuschalten und eine Monopolstellung zu erreichen. beides werden wir mit Wirtschafts und wenn nötig auch Waffengewalt unterbinden!
Ich hoffe ihr bessert euch!
Meister des Eisens Gandela

(Edited by Gandela at 10:36 pm on May 3, 2002)
Edit: del ooc

(Edited by GMcFly at 10:00 pm on May 4, 2002)

Erdrick · Post by **Erdrick** » Fri May 03, 2002 11:20 pm

Heh, you think that you could win against me?
Think again.
And Francesca, I have some things to give you, try to find a buyer. I am sure you can lump them together with what you already have.

Caranthir the great · Fri May 03, 2002 11:28 pm

Whom are you speaking to, Erdrick?
"Heh, you think that you could win against me?
Think again."
in that part.

Francesca · Post by **Francesca** » Sat May 04, 2002 1:54 am

@Gandela ... vielleicht solltet ihr erst einmal erwägen einen Rat der Bevölkerung zu wählen, der Eure "Gesetze" auch rechtmäßig umsetzen kann/darf/wird. Denn Gesetze einer Gruppierung wie der Euren empfinde ich nicht bindend. Vielleicht solltet Ihr eine Art Marktplatz errichten, denn dort könntet Ihr Eure Gesetze festsetzen. Aber niemals für die gesamte Welt.
Zusätzlich frage ich mich wer hier die Monopolstellung einnehmen will. Ich diktiere keine Preise. Ich passe mich dem Markt an. Aber denkt doch mal darüber nach was Ihr versucht!

Und seid Euch sicher, ich werde immer einen Ausweg finden.

@Erdrick: I am interested in your offer if there are fair conditions for that deal.