Orcs vs. Gaurds: rp gone bad

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Sat May 28, 2005 10:21 pm

This is only for those who were there last night, at the stand off between the new orc guild and the town gaurd.

It started out a a great rp event, but after a while it quickly went down hill, and crashed, exploding in a large fire ball (so to speak). I eventually just left because it wasn't even rp anymore, it was just crazyness, and i didn't want to stand there arguing in ooc with anyone. But i think it needs to be sorted out now. So anyone who was there last night, lets get this sorted out.

When it really started to fall apart was when, we had decided to jail the two orcs (now not having a technical jail, we had to rp it). So some of us (at least two to an orc) started bringing them away, when one of them decided to run behind a building out of sight and run away. How two defeated orcs would have managed to escape dosen't really make sense to me. Then at least one of them ran up to pendar and was slain, while another, or maybe the same one (i'm not even sure anymore) ran away, and decided to slay some of us. By this time it had become just plain silly, so i decided to leave.

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sat May 28, 2005 10:49 pm

Your incorrect, the orc that ran into the shadow of the building and up to Pendar and was cut down, was Grutar. He stayed at the cross after he was slain. Grebar, the other orc, took advantage of Grutar's death by running away while everyone attacked Grutar. Then another orc, Cyrus, came and cut down Bailey and Revlen. Grebar got away by running away. And Grutar got away, because, frankly, the roleplay was bad enough, I just let him get away as, it wouldn't have been fair to put him in jail after EVERYONEs roleplay was questionable.

Ereaes · Post by **Ereaes** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:03 pm

actually, The one that supposedly ran away was short by a poisen dart, from Cyrus, and fell and died ((logged))

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:16 pm

Ya no one ran into the shadows there was 3 orcs there two you captured one that was hiding. the one you thought ran into the shadows was killed as a diversion for cyrus to escape who was hiding and watching to see if pendar would pay. Apart fromm all the ooc thatr was going on the rp was actually ok talk to pendar or me or both on msn sometime you seem confused

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:20 pm

The well it would have been highly improbably that the orc could get away with so many gaurd holding him. But that didn't seem to stop him (bad rp). Both orcs should now be in prison.

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:21 pm

o ok i didnt realise grutar ran onto the shadows to get away from you and to pendar that was screwed up. however grebar didnt get away he was killed by cyrus((is hit by a poison dart and falls to the floor dead.)) so he has been deleted i think and cyrus was hiding watching to see if the money was paid.

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:31 pm

So grutar, should not have gotten away then, he should be in prison now, grebar is dead and gone, while Cyrus is still on the lose.
Sounds right?

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:32 pm

Your forgetting the dead halfling hostage?

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Sat May 28, 2005 11:36 pm

I don't think anyones character even knew there was a hostage. Somebody thought it was velerie or something, others were just confused, like me. Then that got into the who ooc discusion that was going on at the same time.

Post by **Estralis Seborian** » Sun May 29, 2005 12:53 am

I didn't read the stuff above, just a remark:

This is a game that is supposed to make fun. If it does not for everybody, something is going wrong.

Play together, not against each other. This game is not about winning, "we don't play OOC chess here".

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sun May 29, 2005 1:24 am

ya the halfling was a bluff one of the gaurds named them the other orc tried to tell you it wasnt but you wuldnt listen

Pendar · Post by **Pendar** » Sun May 29, 2005 2:21 am

Okay my 02,
All that actually happend was RP broke down this was actually a case of to much OOC courtesy. Strange as that may sound lol.
The two orcs in question have so far been a pleasure to play with and I have seen a sense of fair play most uncommon in this game.

They have let beaten apponents run and not taking the "kill".
One of them got dropped from the server and came to apologise for logging and offered us a chance to kill him if we wished.
They have really taken it upon themselves to play villans and try and make it fun for all as i see it. ~~Hats off to both for that~~

The reason I say to much OOC courtesy is we were all trying to ooc our way into a friendly resolution for a situation we should have just played out and discussed later. It is that fine line issue, sometimes a few((messages)) can really clean up the rp and stream line it or as last night it all just gets messy.
For my part no harm done, I have spoken to the players of the orcs since then and we chatted about what went wrong and then chatted about future plans.
As estralis said we are not hear to win or lose and yes we should continue to play considerately at the same time I think all of us present to last nights rp learnt a little about letting the game flow and will carry that forward.
Thanks to all the players involved in last nights conflict which spanned hours for the most part I hope fun was had by all. I certainly got some great RP out of it....
Brian

P.s to clarify Po valerie had an idea she might get grutar to kidnap her as he had allready attacked her. When my enemy spoke of saving the girl, it sprung logically to pendars mind they would have grabbed the little one he cares for..thats all.

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Sun May 29, 2005 7:11 am

Yeah, i must also add that those who played to orcs did to a very good job of rping. And did so in a sensable manner. I don't really know how everything got so broken down in this incedent, i guess it is a just something to try and learn from.

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sun May 29, 2005 8:03 am

Hay thanx guys its nice to no I can rp a villan and not be hated by the players

reidan · Post by **reidan** » Sun May 29, 2005 8:04 am

You really shouldn't try and blame this on the orcs. If i remember correctly someone tried moving me and attacked me and you all pounced on Grutar thats how it got confusing.

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sun May 29, 2005 8:06 am

No one is blaming anyone.
We just need to slow down read whats being said and cut out the ooc just play it out see what happens.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Mon May 30, 2005 9:43 am

Well, now what I think about this.

1. it was too much ooc, by everyone. i tried to stop it, but noone heard on me. Next time DON'T start to discuss everything ooc.

2. it was the usual bad rp by villians who got caught and are going to lose. you may do good rp while you win and may slaughter others, but the second you are going to lose the rp goes to hell. every orc was sourrounded by three humans. even holding swords against their throuts, but they done an escapes, and that more than one time, without any #me. That sucks. Just because they don't wanted to accept that their orcs are in problems and will go to jail.

we roleplayed a great trap. we had finally the possibility to be ingame with enough fighters. and we ambushed the orcs and sourrounded them fast and good. and than their rp and the ooc discussions made everything just terrible. that was no fun. and my desicion is that I won't play along with that orcs anymore. i saw such roleplay more than enough in the past when the movement attacked the town again and again. and at other times. not again, i say. not until the orcplayers will write here that they won't do such shit again.

WE roleplay that we lose. we roleplay our characters hurt, beaten and bleeding. weak and at the ground. and we ahve the right to await the same by the orcplayers. or this is just a "i am the best and slaughter everyone" rp like every time by the evil characters.

Cliu Beothach · Post by **Cliu Beothach** » Mon May 30, 2005 4:37 pm

Please do not change this into a GOOD vs EVIL rp. Each one has their own faults, and it depends on the player, not the subdivision.

Moirear Sian · Post by **Moirear Sian** » Mon May 30, 2005 7:39 pm

I wasn't there so I'm nobody to judge, but something I read here irritated me. I underlined some things that raised the hairs on the back of my neck and commented them.

Galim wrote:2. it was the usual bad rp by villians who got caught and are going to lose. you may do good rp while you win and may slaughter others, but the second you are going to lose the rp goes to hell. every orc was sourrounded by three humans. even holding swords against their throuts, but they done an escapes, and that more than one time, without any #me. That sucks. Just because they don't wanted to accept that their orcs are in problems and will go to jail.

So you'd rather have all villainous characters dead or in jail? This doesn't make sense, especially considering the current situation in the game (alot of people complaining that the RP is not too interesting, which I've been coming to disagree with). Why do all things have to end in puffy clouds? Did that even happen here? I can't tell because this thread just says everything in a wild mishmash of... stuff.

If I visit the first page of this thread, there's that comment of Garrett's which makes it hard for me to comprehend what you're saying:

Garett Gwenour wrote:I just let him get away as, it wouldn't have been fair to put him in jail after EVERYONEs roleplay was questionable.

Well...

Galim wrote:we roleplayed a great trap. we had finally the possibility to be ingame with enough fighters. and we ambushed the orcs and sourrounded them fast and good. and than their rp and the ooc discussions made everything just terrible. that was no fun. and my desicion is that I won't play along with that orcs anymore. i saw such roleplay more than enough in the past when the movement attacked the town again and again. and at other times. not again, i say. not until the orcplayers will write here that they won't do such shit again.

With all due respect, that does not sound either like a fair decision nor does it make any sense, in the context of what you wrote.

As I also don't quite see the problem, if there is any. I don't understand how someone could stop roleplaying with someone, or lower themselves to that level just because they think their RP is better than that of the others. If it is, then it makes no sense to stop playing with them if you want them to play as good as you think you can.

Ahh, welcome to my kindergarten of Illarion.

Galim wrote:WE roleplay that we lose. we roleplay our characters hurt, beaten and bleeding. weak and at the ground. and we ahve the right to await the same by the orcplayers. or this is just a "i am the best and slaughter everyone" rp like every time by the evil characters.

An overgeneralization. Like I asked, why should you stop doing that with them? You're just going to ignore them and act like they are not there? You call that roleplaying?

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Mon May 30, 2005 7:54 pm

yes, you are right. you wasn't there and understood nothing.

listen, it is NOT fun when the evil ones come and beat you up and escape everytime and you have no chance to win as good one. it is not good when you got into a good planed ig trap, you are sourrounded by three guys, a sword at your throut, and than simply run away because you have to go to jail. juzst because you dont want to lose one time.

and no, sorry, the rp of the peoples who planed the mabush were good, until someone started to talk ooc, than everyone talked ooc and i told them again and again to stop.

and the reason why i wont play with them is, that i played more often than you could imagine in the past with such players who do such rp. and it is NOZ fun, its not fun to roleplay with them. so this time i will ignore them, until they will accept too that they lost, like we do. and until they will do fair and good rp when they lose. or next time we will simply play as nothing happened when the yattack us. this would be the same.

Moirear Sian · Post by **Moirear Sian** » Mon May 30, 2005 10:28 pm

Listen Galim, what I was saying is that you could let them get away, yeah, wow, logic and pride aside.

But I suppose fairplay is still hardly tangible for you and you insist that all villain characters must be melodramatically hung and eliminated a.s.a.p.

The "horribly-played villain orcs" as you somewhat put them, have not really been around too awfully long.

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Mon May 30, 2005 10:44 pm

Ok well Galim seems to be the only one with the problem.
So let me point this out. Cyrus who the trap was made for was NOT one of the two orcs you trapped he watched from a hiding place. It all went bad (ingame) when Cyrus killed Grebar wich acted as a diversian then he ran from his hiding place. Seeing him (who the trap was for) a bunch of gaurds ran after him, giving the other orc just enough time to escape. Now i know Grutar did ignore/not see alot of #me holds the orc but then again there was like 8 diffrent convos going on and two orcs that you guys knew about so it could get confusing. So from what I saw/heard it didnt go to bad. It seems your just pissed coz you didn't get the bad guy. Galim or however you spell it, look you got all the time in the world to catch us. I mean if you caught us then and jailed or killed us, what would you do tommorow? wouldnt you rather have the whole rivalry thing going, that way you know something is going on. I just started rping a villan to make things more exciting so maybe when something big happens (which i assure you is on its way

) you can have your victory but untill then why not just enjoy the game.

Turonga Mudwater · Post by **Turonga Mudwater** » Tue May 31, 2005 1:18 am

It seems like what happened was the numbers were so similar that no one really knew which orc was which, so when one ran away people thought it was the one in captivity running and so on and so on.

What I do not want to here is that all villians play so terribly because they dont get caught, everytime we have something like this certain players say how terrible the RP was on the Villan for not getting caught, theres no way around it. Ive heard "the villam went right through the gate which would be garded by invisible gaurds" Ive heard "we surronded them and they just ran" Ive heard "we stabbed them but they still ran, even though they'd be hurt" I've heard "hey did it at a bad time of day". Enough, From the little bit I played in this situation I thought it was great, I tried to distract Pendar to let Cyrus get out and I thought the roleplay was amazing considering what little preperation there was and how terribly attacks and raids seem to go.

This seemed like a good RP thing, so you got alittle confused oh boo hoo, what do you want the player with bad roleplay banned? I dont understand it they make the game interesting which you all say its not then you say how bad RP it is. I've seen bad RP from the jist of you complaining (some players I've never seen before) so enough, we've all had bad Roleplay from time to time, besides no one can even deem what is and what isn't good roleplay, thats been something confusing for as long as I've played.

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Tue May 31, 2005 1:22 am

I remember also that people use to say "villains always whine on the forums when things don't go the way they want". It seems to be different nowadays.

And if one happens to get away, why not just turn them into a four legged animal, that's always the way to go.

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Tue May 31, 2005 1:48 am

Ya thanx for the little pig think lol do you have any idea how hard it is to rp a pig?

Lady Arynne · Post by **Lady Arynne** » Tue May 31, 2005 2:10 am

What do you mean? Pigs are easy to RP....

#me rolls in mud
#me gazes stupidly
#me rolls in mud some more
#me snorts obnoxiously
#me eats grass
#me rolls in mud even more

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Tue May 31, 2005 2:13 am

lmao ya ok sure but to rp and enjoy it is a differnt story

Pendar · Post by **Pendar** » Tue May 31, 2005 3:16 am

The highlights are not aimed at each poster individually they are merely my responses to the issues raised by each person posting

Fooser
He was turned into a pig for a seperate reason and it had nothing to do with his run in with the guard and no guard to my knowledge requested any intervention.
The orc turned into a pig was not the one we had captured any way. Just so you know

Turonga
We speak of different incidents, but you make a good point these orcs were chased all day. The incident that caused the problem was some hours after you stopped me.
On the whole it was great fun as I stated in an earlier post.

Galim
I can see how this irritated you as you were only there for the one part that broke down. How ever let me say again on the whole the day long conflict was a huge sucess in my mind. I and other seemed to enjoy it.

Sian
As I have said before and will see again, I dont want my role as guard captain or the guards as a whole to be a kill joy outfit. I expect and will encourage jail breaks. I will as I have done today continue to seek resolutions to conflicts with out a character dieing for good.
We are after all, each of us here to have fun.

In closeing the only time a villan will get on my nerves is when he/she becomes a PKer. A reign of terror on town were you kill some people is fine. Returning the same day to kill more or the same person again is going to annoy me. Simply as this not a PVP game...player killing is simply a small aspect of it.
Our dearly departed Kaja was a great example of a villan, I will sorely miss his take on being "evil". Even though i never saw kaja attack any one he was hunted and PKed often enough. This is what i would like to avoid from both sides good and evil...the stage were conflict becomes so completely game ruleing all other RP must cease to facilitate it.
Cease daily or long term...of course some one walking up with an axe may interupt my chat with so and so..lol
This game needs the space to include good and evil players, all rp being centered around Trollsbane makes this problematic. I do ask all potenial villans to bear that in mind and understand that were as I dont want to spoil your fun if you get banned from town especially for a crime like "murder" sending some one to the cross. I will have little choice in my role as Pendar but to keep you out of town.
Brian

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue May 31, 2005 2:52 pm

I mean if you caught us then and jailed or killed us, what would you do tommorow? wouldnt you rather have the whole rivalry thing going, that way you know something is going on. I just started rping a villan to make things more exciting so maybe when something big happens (which i assure you is on its way ) you can have your victory but untill then why not just enjoy the game

to be honest, no! believe me, it is NOT fun to have every day trouble and fights with villians who come into town and try to cause chaos and problems. i saw that often before. it is NOT fun. yes, villians are fun, but just in measures. and not every day, or even more times in a day. a good villian player shouldn't let his character appear too often in a week and do again and again the same, causing fights, rob the peoples and push the guys ingame around. this way it will be fast just annoying, and not fun. many villian player did this failure in the past.

even every second day would be too much to come and push guys around. this game is again, NOT about fighting, and not about evil ones causing troubles every day.

you want to play evil ones? play them smart, and, play them not too often. just playing evil ones who attack and rob others will lose fast interest and start to be annoying. try other things. and don't try them every day. plan for longer time, for weeks. come in town just 2 or 3 times in a week, but not more often. and don't try to cause or make the same every time.

because that is what i see the danger in the orcs roleplay. because they start like the movement. and that was NOT fun that days

Turonga Mudwater · Post by **Turonga Mudwater** » Tue May 31, 2005 4:34 pm

I realized they were different incidents, but you got my main point, These orcs had been running around all day building up the "suspense" so to speak. The started to let their little plan give way, put it all into motion and then they finnally did it; I thought it was played out amazingly (I was semipresent for Other parts on a different char)

Galim I realizes its not fun everyday, thats why it doesn't occur everyday, Big player controlled events like this rarely occur, the last I remeber was the Bloodskull attack, which was some time ago. You seem to complain at every instance a Villian comes to town. I thought the Movement was pretty fun, They overthrew Darlok, The Game needs more things like this, its obvious many players hate the gaurd, what are they supposed to do sit there? Some Characters have other motives aside from being the knight, they are greedy, they want a kingdom, and they will get it through whatever means. Events like these happen rarely as I said and should be cherrished not shot down. Sure theres the everyday rabble rousing (*cough* Me *cough) but that would be common in every town, so I think the way it is going is very good.