Skillcolors // Skillfarben

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:25 pm

((deutsche Übersetzung weiter unten))

Hi,

I like your RPG very much but there's a little problem. I protanope (redblind, a kind of color blindness). When I see my skills I can see that they have different colors. Well, my problem is that I can't see which color is which.
Most of you will say "Yeah, we shouldn't see our skills" but I would like to see, if a skill is light red or, for example (I don't know if these colors exist in game), green or yellow.
Perhaps you can change the colors a little bit, maybe as sprectral colors from blue to red. Yeah, it's still very difficult but it would be very nice.

Of cause, it would be nicest (right word?) if you gave me a special version with numbers instead of colors (only as a little help in, they don't have to be very precise). Yeah, I know that's impossible, but I can't see much this way.

Alternatively or additively (right words?) you could change it, that not only the Font would be colored, but the background (and the font would become white) I have most problems with colors on little areas, such as different colors in fonts.

Hoping that my English is not as wrong as I think and that you would think about my ideas
Rackere Diplomatre

-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-

Hi,

Ich mag euer RPG sehr, habe aber ein kleines Problem. Ich bin protanop (rotblind, eine Form der rot/grün-Blindheit). Wenn ich meine Skills sehe, kann ich zwar sehen, dass sie verschiedene farben haben, baer welchen Farbton sie haben, sehe ich nicht.
Viele, wenn nicht sogar die meisten werden sagen: "Wir sollen unsere Skills ja gar nicht sehen", aber ich würde trotzdem gerne sehen, ob ein Skill z.B. rot oder grün ist, oder villeicht gelb.
Vielleicht könnt ihr die farben ein bisschen abändern, sodass man dann einen Übergang von z.B. blau nach rot hat. Natürlich wäre es immernoch schwer für mich.

Am nettesten wäre natürlich eine Version, die mir ein paar zahlenwerte ausspuckt (nur grobe Orientierung, keine genauen Werte). Ich weiß natürlich, dass das unmöglich ist, mir eine spezielle version zu geben, aber so, wie es jetzt ist, sehe ich nicht wirklich viel.

Alternativ oder zusätzlich könntet ihr es auch so ändern, dass die schriftfarbe nicht geändert wird, sondern die Schrift z.B. weiß ist und der Hintergrund die Farbe ändert. Ich habe nämlic die meisten Pobleme mit unterschiedlichen farben auf kleinen Flächen, wie z.B. Schrift, färbt sich aber der Hintergrund, ist die Erkennung schon viel besser.

Hoffend, dass ihr meine Ideen mal durchdenkt
Rackere Diplomatre

Josefine da Vince · Post by **Josefine da Vince** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:40 pm

Die skillfarbe besteht nicht aus mehreren Farben. Sondern nur aus verschiedenen Rottönen.

Am Anfang ist er schwarz und sollte man Meister sein, ist er knallrot.

Ich persöhnlich bin gegen Zahlen, da dann wieder die leidigen Gespräche anfangen wie zB: "Wie hoch ist dein Parry skill?" "Och..meiner ist nun schon bei 40, gut nicht? Hab lange dafür gebraucht..." "..."

martin · Post by **martin** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 2:00 pm

Die Farbtoenung ist rot und wird einfach Heller.
Du kannst dich demnach nach der Helligkeit richten. Mehr Anhaltspunkte haben die anderen Spieler auch nicht als das.

Martin

Darlok · Post by **Darlok** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 2:22 pm

Ebenfalls ist bereits im Spiel eingebaut das "Buch der Selbsterkenntniss",
welches dir auch Auskunt über die Fertigkeiten deines Characters gibt.

Es gibt also auch für Farbenblinde eine Alternative.

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 2:26 pm

Darlok wrote:Ebenfalls ist bereits im Spiel eingebaut das "Buch der Selbsterkenntniss",
welches dir auch Auskunt über die Fertigkeiten deines Characters gibt.

Es gibt also auch für Farbenblinde eine Alternative.

Fein fein, werde mich mal umgucken, wenn ich mal wieder reinkomme (mein Char ist auf mysteriöse Weise verschwunden, soll aber wiederhergestellt werden...)

Trotzdem wäre es mit den Flächen nicht schlecht. (Schrift weiß, Hintergrund rot, so kann ich wenigstens ein bissl sehen)
Nebenbei sehen rotblinde rot sehr viel dunkler, als ihr denkt, für mich ist rot ein sehr sehr dunkles grau, auch knallrot... aber wenn es das Buch gibt, is ja alles in Ordnung.

Nilo · Post by **Nilo** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:16 pm

Rackere, if you wish to know that much, take a screen shot of your skills, open MS paint, and view the color values of the red.

For example : it will say "132 Red" ... it will do that all the way to 255 red.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:29 pm

Nartak Ironmaster · Post by **Nartak Ironmaster** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:41 pm

Nilo: I think this is against the rules.

martin · Post by **martin** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:51 pm

Which rule should that be?

Martin

Nilo · Post by **Nilo** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:04 pm

You can already see the skills, its not like its going to tell you any differently.

Whats against the rules is saying "Hey i have 184 red in parry! What do you have?" - I think

Anyhow, its just something that would help him out...

Willum · Post by **Willum** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:16 pm

Nilo has got a good point you already see your skills through the brightness of the red so whats a little verification gonna hurt?

Darlok · Post by **Darlok** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:23 pm

Nothing, just shows us who the skill-horny powergamers are.

Thats why many think, that the skill table should be abandoned in future versions.
A vague inormation, like in the "Book of Selfawareness" is more then enough.

But this goes to far off-topic for the graphics board.

Willum · Post by **Willum** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:25 pm

I agree with the taking away the book and the skills. You made a very good point Darlock powergamers could use that.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 7:01 pm

In further versions, we will somehow manage to remove he feature "powergaming".

martin · Post by **martin** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 7:19 pm

We probably will earn several different nobel prices for that.

Martin

Dónal Mason · Post by **Dónal Mason** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 7:24 pm

Especially since the task is so difficult. Anyone who can do that deserves anything they want.

Kasume · Post by **Kasume** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 8:24 pm

Nothing, just shows us who the skill-horny powergamers are.

Ding ding ding!!!

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 8:35 pm

OK, that will help me, but I didn't want so precide values.

And please: Don't take away book and skills.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 8:54 pm

We will not take them away. Instead, we will put in three additional skills : "Skill-Horniness", "Powergaming", and "GM-Bribing".

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 8:58 pm

Damien wrote:We will not take them away. Instead, we will put in three additional skills : "Skill-Horniness", "Powergaming", and "GM-Bribing".

What's a joke

But I think it's important to know how good you are. If I wanted to fish (in RL), I know whether I'm good or bad.
Think about dying. If somebody dies, he can't guess how good he is anymore. If he thought wrong, he will be dead again 'cause he didn't expect that he's so weak.

I hope I wrote it right, my English is not the best.

Zare · Post by **Zare** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:04 pm

You can know what your skills are. If you try to fish, and you catch alot, then you are good at fishing. If you try to cook, and you don't burn your food, you are good at cooking. Remember, in RL, you don't have a skill list or Book of Self-Awareness

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:07 pm

Zare wrote:You can know what your skills are. If you try to fish, and you catch alot, then you are good at fishing. If you try to cook, and you don't burn your food, you are good at cooking. Remember, in RL, you don't have a skill list or Book of Self-Awareness

Of cause, of cause. But as I can remember, I never died in RL and lost my skilles. When I can do things once, then I can do them mostly all my life. I never die and lose my skills. (And by the way, I never attack mummies

)

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 6:14 pm

Darlok wrote:skill-horny

Skill horny?

Never heard that one before...

Kasume · Post by **Kasume** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 9:25 pm

Mmmmmm skills...

Konstantin K · Post by **Konstantin K** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 3:00 pm

Zare wrote:You can know what your skills are. If you try to fish, and you catch alot, then you are good at fishing. If you try to cook, and you don't burn your food, you are good at cooking. Remember, in RL, you don't have a skill list or Book of Self-Awareness

But IRL, you can actually feel your body. This is a game, and all we got is a little graphic showing our character. Skills are important to see and know. Otherwise you cannot advance efficiently.
It's a same thing as having a personal fitness trainer.
Does Illarion REALLY strive to achieve complete realism? Why?
Does it aim to get rid of powergamers? Again, why? Just group in on the bastards, and kill them.

IRL I know exactly how strong and how fast I am. I can pass examinations and get ranks (belts in oriental martial arts, degrees in educational facilities, and degrees in european combat, IQ tests).
I can precisely measure my strength by lifting weights. I know exactly how many kilograms I can lift on every body part, I know in how many seconds I can run 100 meter distance. I know how many pushups, situps, pullups I can do in a minute. This gets me on a scale compared to other people. I don't have to fight each one of them to see if I win or lose.

Illarion does not have a precise measure of length, weight, speed, time.
Therefore, in the virtual medieval environment, skill values are the only way to tell your actual fitness.

Kasume · Post by **Kasume** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:59 pm

Most people didn't have stop watches or bench pressing in the middle ages.

Zordakh · Post by **Zordakh** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 11:32 am

well i dont consider the skill colors to be very well chosen too..
im having exactly the same problem.. im colorblind.. so the whole "it gets more red" doesnt really help me..
i think red is the color that most people have problems with.. i for myself have only problems with red and brown and green.. the rest works fine

but since i dont check my skills too often i dont really care too much about it.. but i can understand that it can bug other colorblind people..

Rackere Diplomatre · Post by **Rackere Diplomatre** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 2:47 pm

Thank you for your help.

I was asked what exactly I see. When I have a look at my skills, there are two states: black and red. Well, you don't see anything else but I only see these two states. It is either red or black, no states between them e.g light red or dark red.

To correct you, Zordakh: Most people (about 80%) of all colorblinds are green-weak or green blind. Less are red-weak or -blind and really less, I think of 1% of all color blinds, are blue-blind.

I have a question to the GMs: If I edited my EXE-file not to show red but blue, would you recognize it?

martin · Post by **martin** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 2:52 pm

Rackere Diplomatre wrote:I have a question to the GMs: If I edited my EXE-file not to show red but blue, would you recognize it?

No.

Martin

Zordakh · Post by **Zordakh** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 3:14 pm

to answer your question.. i only see different shades of red/black..
but i cant decide which one is more to the red side and which one more to the black..

when i really need to know the colors i mostly ask my roommates.. they can help me very quick

so it really is not a problem for me..

i just wanted to state that Rackere's request is not as silly as it sounds.. without the help of my roommates i wouldnt have a clue

!