I'm a bit annoyed.

Algoran · Post by **Algoran** » Mon Mar 22, 2004 10:34 pm

Logged on with Algoran today for the first time in a while and was met after five minutes with this exchange :

Someone (56***) whistles an old miners tune.
Someone (56***): Hallo
Algoran glances at the (race deleted).
Someone (56***): How are you today?
(I walked away without responding.)
Someone (56***): ((good rp..you must be proud))

Now I had expected to be called rude or illmannered or any number of IC insults but not the OOC one.
My character may have a problem with the others particular race, be up to no good, not of been in a chatty mood or any other number of reasons. By "glancing" at her I showed that I had noticed her but had chosen not to reply. Rather than choose to pursue, or not, the reason for my rudeness she chose to put out an OOC message.
This is not nicey nicey land where all peoples are nice all the time. If a character is rude to your character it does not mean bad RP it means they have a reason, or at least should do.

Ok I feel better now.

Domitrio · Post by **Domitrio** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 12:51 am

Algoran, I've had a bit of trouble with people thinking they know what "Good RP" is. I was in a conversation last night, where I was told that if a character does not stick to one or two trades that it is Bad RP. I told the player, in OOC (he was talking in ooc beforehand) that I was a jack of all trades, but a master of none. He told me that that was wierd and that it's wrong to do that. Now I want to know. In real life, or even in a fantasy world like Illarion, does a person have to stick to ONE job? I personally dabble in quite a many things, but it is because I'm not good at any of them, and of course I won't become good doing it that way, I don't want to. Do you think this is bad RP?

Derinoar Fallvictor · Post by **Derinoar Fallvictor** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:24 am

Now but if you where highly skilled ((master and all that stuff)) in all of them than i MIGHT consider pg which means bad rp

Gerhalt · Post by **Gerhalt** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:10 am

First off, I want to know who besides the GM's have the right to decide what is good Roleplaying. If you are doing your best, then so be it. Domitrio, I think it's Ok to dabble in all trades. As for Fallvictor's point, there is one circumstance where I would not consider it powergaming. If the character (in real time) has been around for a long time, having high skills would only be natural. However, if it's a new player who has been playing a month and has a lot of skills maxed out, that's powergaming.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:21 am

perhaps ya could have wrote #me turns and goes without any response? just an idea *g*

Darkform · Post by **Darkform** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:35 am

Jhon my main charicter is a farmer / druid whitch makes him good at pesantry , duid potion mixing (around 8 skills ) , alcamy (he is a scientest typ do to his Druid work and farming) , lumberjacking (for pot ash) , mineing (for quarts sand) , bottlemakeing (ah self explanitory he can't buy bottles fast enuf) , herb lore , and um mayby others based aroud the concept of a farmer Druid

but even in full war outfit and a firesword he has difaculty with even the darn flys . he is never to be a good fighter .

this is 6 skills not includeing the 8 druid potion mixing skills .

there is no way to be 1 job and have a charicter that is a druid / farmer

oh ya other skills involved based on true farmers jobs = upkeeep of livestok whithch gives him leather wool and meat thesse things ecept the meat are hard for him to sell so he instead uses them in the skills of tailor (we have a very small amount of tailors that buy raw materials mayby because the sale of tailored goods is a low demand market)

added as a edit I have stood around and been killed by monsters befor as Jhon when some of his skills deviated from this plan I would be glad to have a cap on some of his skills like tailor , miner , and lumberjack . something around a 50% skill max cap on those and all combat skills he has

mayby when choseing a way to make a job clas instead of preset have the max amount a skill can reached per charicter have a limit based on the players choce of skills he will not know as good . mayby start a new charicter with the ability to have all skills but at 50% max and let the player adgust the % him/her self for each skill where if one is to be at 100% max then 2 have to be at 25% max to balance out the abilitys . also if someone reduces there max bellow ther curent skill level in that skill then all skill above that level is gone so that noone can abuse this buy haveing max one skill then reduceing the max and keeping the skill in order to make him/her self be able to learn another skill at a beter level .

I think I will stop typing now befor I use up the whole system just on one post.

Hermie · Post by **Hermie** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:58 am

Galim wrote:

#me turns and goes without any response

I see what you mean Galim, but don't the graphics just show/explain this already?

Sometimes people use #me's too often IMO, which reminds me of another thing. I find it annoying having slow connection to the forums sometime, and I read a post on the RPG board that takes a while to read and all I find is that someone writes what their character is thinking. This is completely useless! We don't need to know what someone is thinking, or saying .. only what they are writing (except maybe board quests or stories). It just bugs me that someone replies to a written post with something like:
Uncle Bob thinks to himself "Man, I could really go for a tako right now"

He walks away laughing about something, but you wouldn't even know this anyway because you're looking at a written announcement on the town walls.

And the previous post could have just read:

A parchment hangs from the wall for all to read, it says:

I will be auctioning a pie outside the shop tomorrow afternoon!

Signed Aunt Sue

Bloodhearte · Post by **Bloodhearte** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:12 am

That reminds me of an event that happened 2 days ago where a ghost whispered to me and another player ((assholes)) because of my character killing his.

Why do people freak out when they see their character dying? On a game?

I can't say I appreciated it, so I would strongly suggest players start convincing themselves that my shady, mean man of a character is NOT identical to the player behind him.

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:14 am

I don't think you can really use to many #me's, because each #me give you a clearer perception of that character. Although there are times when #me's should not be used. A good rule to go by is that if it can be observed by the senses you can #me it. For example you could say #me thinks that the orc looks dumb. Because no one can observe your thoughts. Even things like #me is angry could be put as #me looks angry.

Gerhalt · Post by **Gerhalt** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:45 am

I think you meant you shouldn't say "#me thinks the orc looks dumb." You can still rephrase that and keep the same meaning, such as putting "#me stares at the orc disdainfully."

About Bloodhearte's being insulted. In the guide (I think, I know it's in there somewhere) it specifically says that insults, if any are exchanged or spoken, must be directed at the character, not at the person behind the screen. If I got killed, my character would be ticked off, but I wouldn't call the person who killed me names. Sure, I might insult his character, but insulting the person behind the screen shows your inability to play the game and roleplay properly.

Keikan Hiru · Post by **Keikan Hiru** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 9:50 am

Insulting leads to banishment, this is out of question.

If someone insulted you OOC in the game, report it, it will be checked with internal logs, and the insulting player will find himself in a nice vacation from Illarion.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:19 pm

jhon, ya forgotten ya grandmaster gemcutting, ya very good goldsmithing and iam sure some other skills ya haven't mentioned. ya character HAVE too many good skills.

i don't think ya can use #mes to often hermie. well, of course #mes who says what ya are thinkng are foolish. but #me about that what ya are doing are important.

Bloodhearte · Post by **Bloodhearte** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:13 pm

Keikan Hiru wrote:Insulting leads to banishment, this is out of question.

If someone insulted you OOC in the game, report it, it will be checked with internal logs, and the insulting player will find himself in a nice vacation from Illarion.

Well, I do have the logfile.

Do I PM the part, or send it somewhere else?

Keikan Hiru · Post by **Keikan Hiru** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:33 pm

PM it to a GM or send it via mail, you can decide.

Alora Ironforge · Post by **Alora Ironforge** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 4:41 pm

This game is not about levelling up or hunting monsters. There is no global chat and no experience points. This game is about roleplaying, which means you interact with other people and your environment as if you were a person in a real medieval fantasy world.

Yes Algoran,
you stood infront of me for 3 minutes OOC time and then walked away,
Obliviously in a rush to go kill something because there were only 3 people online so you werent in a rush to chat with someone else. I thought this game was about interaction and roleplaying. I understand when people say #me ignores the dwarf or #me walks away without saying anything to the dwarf but when I walk into your screen and you "glance at the dwarf" and stand there dumbfounded for 3 OOC minutes, then walking away without even saying #me walks away or #me brushes the dwarf off and leaves.
Means you only really care about running off to level your skills and have no care to interact with the people.
The best times in Illarion are spent around campfires or in meetings talking. The quote above states quite clear, If you do not wish to Roleplay go play something else.
So if i have done something wrong in everyones eyes, then ban me.
But i bet you will think twice before you run off totally ignoring someone without the #me commands. And Im sorry..the #me commands are the most important part of this game. Its the only way for others to know what you are thinking and feeling and doing.

Remember, this game is SUPPOSED to be about interaction. The rules demand it.

Alora

Gro'bul · Post by **Gro'bul** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:57 pm

Wrong Alora, he can ignore you without any #me commands and do whatever he wants and it will not be breaking the rules. Just because his character holds a grudge against yours, doesn't me he (the player) hates you in any way. I don't think I see enough racial discrimination to tell you the truth. You don't know and can't prove his intentions for leaving, so don't turn this into "your a powergamer and I'm a better roleplayer" ping pong tourny.

Hermie · Post by **Hermie** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:26 pm

Why would someone need to do #me walks away? The graphics show his character walking away already. It's not really necessary because the graphics show this. I think #me's about what someone is doing is only completely necessary when it's something the graphics don't show, for example: #me rubs his hands together #me shivers and wraps his cape around himself. Otherwise we'd be writing #me lifts his right foot and moves it forward, then lowers it till it touches the ground. As his right foot touches the floor he lifts his left foot and moves it in front of his right and lowers it to the ground again. All the while his arms swing alternatively in time with each step.

Gerhalt · Post by **Gerhalt** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 9:38 pm

#me's are used not only to describe what can be seen, as you said, like the walking away, but they are also used to give a clearer description of what the graphics already show. Sure, saying "#me walks away" isn't necessary, but no-one will accuse you of being a bad roleplayer if you go ahead and show your action anyway.

Algoran · Post by **Algoran** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 9:41 pm

Alora it really is not my intention to have you banned or even told off. My point was that you cannot insist that someone chats or interacts in a certain way with your character. Illarion is indeed about interaction and roleplaying but that does not mean my character has to chat with yours or even acknowledge its presence. It was Algoran's intention to be rude to your character. By glancing at your character Algoran made it clear he had seen you but did not wish to talk with you. I admit perhaps I could of used another #me to make it slightly clearer but it never occured to me that you had not got the point. Having said that there was still no need for the OOC comment you made.

The fact that there are only 3 people online does not matter. There is a town full of people all the time. Things are happening even if it's only me online.

Algoran has spent many a long time around a campfire chatting with friends. Your character is not, and probably never will be, one of those friends. This is not a reflection on you the player but your character, she is not the sort Algoran would think twice about.

As for leveling my skills I would gladly compare my characters to yours. For the amount of time he has existed his skills are quite low. But I understand your need to cast the slur.

Darkform · Post by **Darkform** » Tue Mar 23, 2004 11:55 pm

Galim wrote:jhon, ya forgotten ya grandmaster gemcutting, ya very good goldsmithing and iam sure some other skills ya haven't mentioned. ya character HAVE too many good skills.

i don't think ya can use #mes to often hermie. well, of course #mes who says what ya are thinkng are foolish. but #me about that what ya are doing are important.

curently Jhons gemcutting is non-existant and his goldsmithing is also gone .

I haven't serched out to get these skills back and probably wont even be cuting any more gems or doing any more goldsmithing . his curent skills where totaly wiped out about 3 dats ago he will get back the ones he should have and leve gemcuting-goldsmithing alone .

Ezor Edwickton · Post by **Ezor Edwickton** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 1:11 am

yeah Gerhalt i mean "can't" instead of "can" there.

Nilo · Post by **Nilo** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:08 am

Okay, i understand its out of question.. But will this person be permanently banned? Couldnt you just give him a very strict warning, that if it ever happens again you will ban them? I mean.... could you just give them jail time or something?

I know this person, and I think he role plays very well, he might just get mad some times... Could you just give him a warning?

Bloodhearte · Post by **Bloodhearte** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:11 am

Personally, I don't think he deserves a permanent ban nor warning. Maybe just a break?

It's up to the GMs in this case.

Drolagas · Post by **Drolagas** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:15 am

it definatly warrents punishment..banned for a month perhaps in the extreme, but calling someone an A Hole...what person hasnt heard language like that before? really...i doupt anyonw was really offended it is such a common thing to hear...((i dont live in a slum or anything, or go to a crappy school-so it sint jsut wher ei live or anything))

Bloodhearte · Post by **Bloodhearte** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:17 am

Drolagas wrote:it definatly warrents punishment..banned for a month perhaps in the extreme, but calling someone an A Hole...what person hasnt heard language like that before? really...i doupt anyonw was really offended it is such a common thing to hear...((i dont live in a slum or anything, or go to a crappy school-so it sint jsut wher ei live or anything))

It's not that he called me OOC either simply a 'moron' or something extreme like [insert string of swear words here]. It's just the simple matter of fact that he insulted the player behind the character, and that warrants at least a tiny break from Illarion to cool off.

Arkadia Misella · Post by **Arkadia Misella** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 3:47 pm

I would say just the talk ehre about it is enough to open his/her eyes. I also do not think this person deserves a ban. I think a warning would be just fine....

Algoran · Post by **Algoran** » Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:02 pm

Just a note about Algoran and Alora.

We, the players, have communicated via PMs and we have both agreed that we BOTH made mistakes. Apologies were exchanged and as far as I'm concerned that's the end of it. I would just like to add that I wish all conflicts could be ended in such an adult manner.
I hope to still see Alora around town and though Algoran will continue to be rude, I wish the player of Alora all the best. Her RP was actually very good.

The player of Algoran.

Illarion.org

I'm a bit annoyed.

I'm a bit annoyed.

Bad RP?