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Hey all,

So I've been messing around with my old battle mage character, and he seems... really weak. Too weak. I'm talking cream puff here.

I get that gems are a thing, and armor level is a thing... but do they all make THAT much of a difference? My character is max level, uses daggers, has max agility, and around 10 constitution, yet he still gets wrecked by basic mobs like bandits... and sometimes when there are too many rats.

I hope I'm doing something wrong? Or missing something? Can someone explain?

See if this helps but yes, armor makes a pretty big difference if you aren't high skilled in one or the other.

http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... =6&t=38503

I'm sure others will come along with more suggestions.

If that's the case then hopefully it's as simple as gearing my character correctly! I will have to seek a smith and test it.

Thanks for the link, I've seen the guide before. Fighting skill isn't really a problem. (for once)

I imagine having 4 strength might have a lot to do with my character's general combat effectiveness, from what I know about the new combat system and how heavily it relies on attributes...

Morbius wrote:I imagine having 4 strength might have a lot to do with my character's general combat effectiveness, from what I know about the new combat system and how heavily it relies on attributes...

Yes - but you can change attributes with the trainer NPC and enough money or you become a potion addicted, both works.

Djironnyma wrote:Yes - but you can change attributes with the trainer NPC and enough money or you become a potion addicted, both works.

Potion addict... lol. I guess he could get really friendly with a druid or alchemist...

Yeah, I've heard about the NPC trainer, trouble is the price doubles each time though. It's not really affordable. Plus if magic get implemented again any time soon (which is probably extremely unlikely) it wouldn't be worth it.

ifyour battlemage is a bad guy, join the legion! He''ll get training and potions!

Other groups do training and hand out potions, too.

But in short, two things are vastly different from pre-VBU:

• -Attributes weight very heavily in combat, while having little effect otherwise (aside from learning speed).
  -Combat skills are more important in that they enable you to equip good stuff*.

Old battlemage-builts are basically useless in combat right now and the cost to respec their attributes is not worth the time required to grind up all that coin. What you 'can' do with such a character are rituals for which you should get in contact with a gm of your liking.


*Don't use equipment over your level. If you do, you run it at 10% effectiveness, which is close to nothing.

Problem is within atributes. Except strenght/agility for fight you also use dexterity. If you put points at intelect/willpower/essence and your char has not around maxed with str/agl (for daggers) and high with dex your attack will suck currently. I dream about day when they remove dex from attack. Currently crafters are stronger fighters than paladins/battle mages. My char can defeat demon skeleton but with great risk of death. Put points at mentals did much to weaken my char. Try to check how many points you have in dexterity. Or even perception.

Q-wert wrote:Old battlemage-builts are basically useless in combat right now and the cost to respec their attributes is not worth the time required to grind up all that coin. What you 'can' do with such a character are rituals for which you should get in contact with a gm of your liking.

Okay, that's more or less what had suspected. Time to retire and become an occasionally magical farmer...

Karrock wrote:Try to check how many points you have in dexterity. Or even perception.

3 and.... 3.

So I guess in summary: armor helps, but overall old battle mage builds are no good... re-specking is too expensive to bother with, and ritual magic is the only thing "magical" mages can do right now?

...woo.

Admittedly this is all a bit disheartening, but still, thank you for all of the information everyone. It has certainly helped me confirm and clarify some things.

Mages can't melee but can be archers, takes some practice but it is possible. You may can adjust the attributes enough to allow decent archery though this mage didn't adjust any.

Kyre wrote:Mages can't melee but can be archers, takes some practice but it is possible. You may can adjust the attributes enough to allow decent archery though this mage didn't adjust any.

Oh yeah. I hadn't even considered archery since it always used to be total rubbish. I recall reading that perception is the main attribute for archery? Dunno how worthwhile leveling the skill would be with only three perception.

Does agility count for anything anymore? I know it contributes to attack speed and task speed... and it's meant to help with puncture weapons, but strength seems to have a far greater effect now comparatively in terms of damage output?

I know in the past strength was better for concussion weapons, and agility was better for puncture weapons... but is there any point in choosing one over the other anymore? It seems like you need both to be a fighter.

I am not the best archer as a mage, missing some attributes of one, but can manage to do a little bit of damage occasionally and worked up from 0 range to over 80. It took a while to achieve but not years and years either. It is also fairly easy to make your own arrows. http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... =6&t=37414

Kyre wrote:I am not the best archer as a mage, missing some attributes of one, but can manage to do a little bit of damage occasionally and worked up from 0 range to over 80. It took a while to achieve but not years and years either. It is also fairly easy to make your own arrows. http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... =6&t=37414

I think it's safe to say my days of soloing dungeons are behind me.

Well that's good to know arrows are easy to come by, might look into it a bit when I'm next able to get in game. Thanks for linking the attribute guide, I've brushed over it a bit already.

Regarding Bows:
Note that the damage you'll do with a bow is calculated the same way as for any other weapon (strength*3, dexterity and perception), so it will be rather low. What does make bows worthwhile nonetheless in a coordinated group is that ranged weapons drain action points from monsters (not player characters) on each hit. The effect is quite noteable, three to four characters (depending on attack speed = agility) can stunlock a monster that way.

Morbius wrote: ... my days of soloing dungeons are behind me.

... nothing more to say

Q-wert wrote:Regarding Bows:
Note that the damage you'll do with a bow is calculated the same way as for any other weapon (strength*3, dexterity and perception), so it will be rather low. What does make bows worthwhile nonetheless in a coordinated group is that ranged weapons drain action points from monsters (not player characters) on each hit. The effect is quite noteable, three to four characters (depending on attack speed = agility) can stunlock a monster that way.

Okay cool. Then at least I guess I can support a bigger groups more effectively than just being a (rather weak) meat shield.