Belief, God, Religion... // Glaube, Gott, Religion...
Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:48 am
Uebersetzung Unten;
((Written, saved and prompted at recorded time. Sorry i have to be a bit repetetive in some parts.
Ideas based upon proposals by:"Logrin Parr" in "Some Observations From a Return Player".
No reason for me to spamkill your thread, pal. ))
Have fun. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
This is leading nowhere, but into the bottomless mires of philosophy.
If a mortal "falls", -it- becomes "property" of another god. Beside that, Mortals also have the possibility to repent.
If a god falls, this is result of either loosing wordly power by loosing big numbers of followers,
or loosing spiritual power by loosing certain "gifted" followers. The outcome is that -she or he- will be forgotten.
Gods tend not to repent.
Mortals are made to act and then to cease existing.
Gods are made to inspire and then to cease existing.
Just because Sirani wants to be loved, does not mean she will be, by all.
Gods tend to "know" who they are, so they do not (need to) reflect very much. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
How about another approach?
Gods want to gain influence, because they "know" that they are on the right path.
A god may gain influence in two ways.
Rising the number of followers (=>PROSELYTISATION), or trying to gain power over followers with a high grade of wordly power (=>CORRUPTION; No matter which god. Even Sirani would tend to lie or make use of wonders, if it was appropriate to "convert" an "evil" mortal).
((I`ll not use the words "good" and "evil" from now on.
Instead "friendly/positive" and "unfriendly/negative", to allow specific associations, individually for any god.
If spoken of "improvement", this marks a rising degree of belief towards a specific god by a single person or a whole society, not a shift towards any "good" alignment. REMEBER THIS WHEN READING ON...))
PROSELYTISATION can only be achieved by giving inspiration to mortals who have the possibilities to spread the belief on.
May it be on a low level, by touching the dreams of many mortals for example, or by granting single mortal(-s) a high grade of insight to the lore, creating (a) Prophet(-s).
((Well. This is where the / my idea of FAVOR roots.))
The Touched;
depending on the ammount of GENERAL improvement it is able to perform towards the society.))
The Gifted;
-Serving as EXAMPLE, to a positive surrounding;
-Proving its effort as HERETIC, to a negative surrounding;
The Example;
loose FAVOR if the supported society/religious group acted against the graces of the specific god.))
The Heretic;
gain FAVOR if the supported society/religious group acted for the graces of the specific god.))
Depending on the outcome of its efforts, no matter whether positive or negative, a "gifted" mortal may ascend to a Saint.
A Saint may be granted the possibility to canalise true fragments of a deity into reality.
((I will not specifically write about divine CORRUPTION and SAINTS right now, as such powerful tools should stay in hand of GMs. As far i can see....))
~may~
((Written, saved and prompted at recorded time. Sorry i have to be a bit repetetive in some parts.
Ideas based upon proposals by:"Logrin Parr" in "Some Observations From a Return Player".
No reason for me to spamkill your thread, pal. ))
Have fun. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
This is leading nowhere, but into the bottomless mires of philosophy.
If a mortal "falls", -it- becomes "property" of another god. Beside that, Mortals also have the possibility to repent.
If a god falls, this is result of either loosing wordly power by loosing big numbers of followers,
or loosing spiritual power by loosing certain "gifted" followers. The outcome is that -she or he- will be forgotten.
Gods tend not to repent.
Mortals are made to act and then to cease existing.
Gods are made to inspire and then to cease existing.
Just because Sirani wants to be loved, does not mean she will be, by all.
Gods tend to "know" who they are, so they do not (need to) reflect very much. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
How about another approach?
Gods want to gain influence, because they "know" that they are on the right path.
A god may gain influence in two ways.
Rising the number of followers (=>PROSELYTISATION), or trying to gain power over followers with a high grade of wordly power (=>CORRUPTION; No matter which god. Even Sirani would tend to lie or make use of wonders, if it was appropriate to "convert" an "evil" mortal).
((I`ll not use the words "good" and "evil" from now on.
Instead "friendly/positive" and "unfriendly/negative", to allow specific associations, individually for any god.
If spoken of "improvement", this marks a rising degree of belief towards a specific god by a single person or a whole society, not a shift towards any "good" alignment. REMEBER THIS WHEN READING ON...))
PROSELYTISATION can only be achieved by giving inspiration to mortals who have the possibilities to spread the belief on.
May it be on a low level, by touching the dreams of many mortals for example, or by granting single mortal(-s) a high grade of insight to the lore, creating (a) Prophet(-s).
((Well. This is where the / my idea of FAVOR roots.))
The Touched;
((=>The single "touched" mortal will receive a small bonus in favor if the surroundings are positive, while the main ammount of favor will be spread, almost even, to every member of the society, depending on the individual way of living.))Any "touched" mortal has the possibility to communicate its experiences and beliefs, within the boundaries set by its mental or social abilities and possibilities.
Depending on the general belief or orientation of the surrounding society, this communicative approach may bloom or not.
A "touched" mortal may find its own ideas accepted by a society friendly towards its ideas. The result would be a rising degree of understanding, concerning the whole society. A "touched" mortal is unlikely to turn into a prophet, as it has its life center in the worldly spheres, which improve enough by a shared belief, to grant a happy and fulfilling life.
There is no need for a further improvement of the current state.
((=>The single "touched" mortal will receive a small to medium bonus in favor if the surroundings are negative,Yet there is also the possibility that a "touched" may find its ideas refused by the surrounding. Before risking damage to the self or society, the "touched" would abandon the sprouting belief, to preserve the current state of the social structure.
A "touched" is unlikely to turn into a heretic, as individual social penalties clearly have a higher weight then the maximal possible improvement to the surroundings.
depending on the ammount of GENERAL improvement it is able to perform towards the society.))
The Gifted;
The "gifted" has two possible ways to achieve its god given goals:A mortal may have "earned" the "gift" from a certain god, or not.
Some earn the "gift" by living the life of a "touched" and improving an already positive state.
Some earn the "gift" as a gods CORRUPTING answer to a life not lived in conformity to the current surroundings.
Some are born to be "gifted", bearing the load of a certain fate.
The role of a "gifted" mortal is to serve as a gods "bridgehead" towards reality.
Any "gifted" mortal receives additional abilities or possibilities concerning the social interaction towards its surroundings.
Additionally a "gifted" mortal may canalise divine powers, depending on the "strength of the gift",
or the individually earned "sanctity".
-Serving as EXAMPLE, to a positive surrounding;
-Proving its effort as HERETIC, to a negative surrounding;
The Example;
((=>The "example" might gain FAVOR by personally doing positive deeds to society andThe "example" may try to increase the belief towards its god by performing deeds to receive positive perception by the surrounding society. Often the "example" starts out as a laughed at "visionary", then working its way up to become "living proof" of a POSSIBLE utopic state. From the beginning, the "example" might try to act as public as possible, to proove the positive attitude of its good towards the society.
The main goal of the "example" may be to create trust towards its own deity, with support of the surroundings.
The path of the "example" will have to overcome many obstacles, may it be the inclusion of religious minorities,
the treachery of people with worldly interest or the terror of heretics within the own ranks.
If the "example" is unable to adapt to the surroundings and find solutions for these problems,
the achievements may be genocide, worldly corruption and continuous shattering of the society.
loose FAVOR if the supported society/religious group acted against the graces of the specific god.))
The Heretic;
((=>The "heretic" might loose FAVOR by personally doing negative deeds to society andThe "heretic" may try to convince its surroundings by executing deeds showing the power of its deity,
or using its "gift" in a manipulative manner to reach as many people as possible, from a hiding place.
The "heretic" may use divine powers to create courage or fear, certainty or doubt and love or desperation
towards the god served by the majority or the god worshipped by himself.
The main goal of the "heretic" may be to create doubt towards the deity, it is against, or found doubt on the failures of a worldly majority.
The path of the "heretic" will have to break through many obstacles, may it be the sureness of reigning majorities,
the power of worldly posessions or the missing compliance of fundamentalists within the own ranks.
If the "heretic " is unable to adapt to the surroundings and find solutions for these problems,
the achievements may be neverending persecution, loss of backers and early shattering of the religion.
gain FAVOR if the supported society/religious group acted for the graces of the specific god.))
Depending on the outcome of its efforts, no matter whether positive or negative, a "gifted" mortal may ascend to a Saint.
A Saint may be granted the possibility to canalise true fragments of a deity into reality.
((I will not specifically write about divine CORRUPTION and SAINTS right now, as such powerful tools should stay in hand of GMs. As far i can see....))
~may~