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Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:39 pm
by Mephistopheles
So, I've had this idea for poisoning for awhile but just haven't got around to putting in a discussion for it.

So the area of alchemists already encompasses temporary boosts, so added to it could be poison. It would be an added weapon buff that would be temporary starting from its first use. Permanent poisoned weapons are kinda dumb, poison would wear away and fade.

So poisoned weapons I guess would have x% chance to poison, and deal an added x% damage over time on the affected target. Armor and possibly trinkets could maybe add a poison resistance factor. And certain creatures like the swamp dragon and contaminated ratchild can be immune to poison.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 4:05 pm
by Jupiter
Poison will come back one day but it is unclear in what exact way. That smiths need poison made from alchemists to create a poisoned weapon is very likely, though.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 4:49 pm
by Velisai
That smiths need poison made from alchemists to create a poisoned weapon is very likely, though.
For what reason(s)?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:02 pm
by Jupiter
What excactly do you mean? Why smiths should need poison to create poison weapons? If so: For the same reason that fire daggers require pure fire. It fits and makes sense (and it also encourages interaction).

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:14 pm
by Velisai
No, I mean why is is it likely that there will be a decision in favor of permanently poisoned weapons and not temporary poisoning?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:53 pm
by Estralis Seborian
:?: :?: :?:

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:42 pm
by Velisai
Okay, we have two possible ways of doing this in this thread.

1. An alchemist creates a bottle of poison and gives it to a crafter. The crafter makes a weapon, using iron, handle and poison, then gives the weapon to a fighter. The fighter uses the weapon indefinitely if it is repaired whenever it needs to be.
This way encourages a bit more interaction between alchemist and crafter.


2. A crafter creates a weapon. An alchemist makes some poison. Both give their products to a fighter. The fighter uses the poison to temporarily improve the (possibly only non-magical) weapon.
This way encourages a lot more interaction between alchemist and fighter.


I wanted to know why 1. is more likely to be implemented. Is it only to increase interaction between alchemists and crafters, for which there is less incentive than with fighters currently? Are there technical and/or other reasons?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:46 pm
by Jupiter
Velisai wrote:I wanted to know why 1. is more likely to be implemented.
It isn't. MY intention was to point out that alchemists will create the needed poison - if temporary for fighters or permanent for crafters is yet to be decided.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:50 pm
by Mephistopheles
This was just an idea i hoped to be discussed, I personally would favor poisoning being used as a temporary buff for non-magical weapons, However Im not a dev or really part of the team so I'm just putting out some ideas.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:48 pm
by maryday
((RE: Ou est le poisson?))


How about putting BOTH horses before the cart?

Temporary poisons as usables (Vials, tubs, tiny frogs or...whatever), derived from the alchemy sys.
Problem here is that there are several (new?) stats/vars (without naming poison effects here) needed for that to work properly;
For the poison ((You are free where to put save throws. Either Quality or Durability, or both)):
-Poison Quality:This is a direct modificator ((</= 1)) on the effect. It is used to reflect the skill of the person producing the poison AND the effect of certain skills or magic spells ("cure poison" for example).
((-Poison Quantity a nice to have linked to "Container Quantity")).This stat could either reflect the total ammount of poison applied to the weapon, maybe even stackable while lowering "Poison Durability, OR the ammount of poison required to execute a poisoning attempt aka min. ammount of poison to be delivered to victim to attempt poisoning.
It could also be linked to "Weapon Affinity".))
-Poison Durability: This is a var (1/10.000) used to reflect the overall quality/effect of the ingredients and the condition of the poison as applied to its vector...
((errm.. say "the Weapon")). The total number of possible "uses"(poisoning attempts)) derives from this stat. The decay of this stat is influenced by (the above) "Poison Quality" linked to "Poison Quantity" OR (the below) "Weapon affinity". The effect of certain spells/skills can be put to effect here ("slow poison" for example).

For the weapon/projectile:
-Weapon Affinity: This could be a combination of both the weapons abilities to contain AND to deliver applied poison. It CAN be a var OR a modificator.
->Var (1/10.000): Basic decay of "Poison Durability" for one use of weapon ((affected by "Poison Quality")). The higher the var, the more poison is needed to for a single poisoning attempt ((Var/Quality for the decay effect.)).
->Mod (</= 1): ((My mental abilites do not suffice right now to link it to one of the stats above.))
(("Containment" and "Deliverance" could also be seperate stats... :wink: I will not write here about basic function contamination as would be for example: Presence, Availability, Path of consumption...))

Examples could be:
"Narguns Handshake" (Divine) on a wooden club: Quality=1 (Divine), ((Quantity=1 of max.3,)) Durability=3, Affinity=3
"Black Lily Dragon" on a "Galmairian Pigtail": Quality=0.25 (Journeyman Quality), ((Quantity=0.2 of max. 50,)) Durability=5.000, Affinity=50




Permanent poisons as ingredients (Vials, ingots, dragon teeth, demon horns...whatever you can imagine, maybe even ingredients that first would have to be created by high-lvl alchemists),
derived from smithing ((+carpentry->ARROWS!)) sys.
All stats ((not counting "Poison Durability")) mentioned above also apply to weapons enhanced by craft or magic.


My personal opinon is that "Permanent Poison" weapons/projectiles would need ((mentioned exotic ingredients AND)) certain magical gems.
A simple sys would base upon the use of one kind of gem (emerald for example) while an advanced version would include all different kinds of magical gems in different patterns.
Preferably the production of such powerful objects would have to be linked to magical or divine rituals and (already mentioned) alchemy.


((That much chaos for now.))

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:51 am
by GolfLima
Ideen für Gift / Gifte

Allgemeines:
1) permanent vergiftete Dinge vergrößern meiner Meinung nach nur den Pool der schon vorhandenen „besonderen Gegenstände“ und machen zeitlich begrenzt vergiftete Dinge sinnlos
2) eine Einführung von permanent vergifteten Gegenständen hat nur einen kurzfristigen Effekt für Handwerker / Händler
3) neben der Möglichkeit Vergiftung einzuführen sollte zeitgleich auch die Möglichkeit der Heilung von Vergiftungen eingeführt werden
4) der noch nicht eingeführte magische Diamant könnte eine wie auch immer geartete „Gift“ Funktion bekommen – Schutz oder Verbrauch bei der Herstellung des Giftes – wie kann man einen magischen Diamanten erhalten?
5) Herstellung und Weiterverarbeitung des Giftes sollte an bestimmtes Fähigkeitslevel geknüpft werden (z.B. Alchemie , Magie > 75 – Begrenzung Anzahl der Dinge & Förderung Interaktion der Char.)

zeitlich vergiftete Waffen:

• Herstellung des Giftes NUR durch Alchemisten mit Abfüllung des Giftes in Flaschen (Nutzung seltener Kräuter (z.B. Wolfsfarn) um die Anzahl der „Giftflaschen“ zu begrenzen)
• „Herstellung“ der zeitweise vergifteten Waffen möglicherweise NUR durch Magier, welche aber das Gift dafür von Alchemisten & die Waffe vom Handwerker benötigen würden (fördern von Interaktionen und die Herstellung wäre ein Alleinstellungsmerkmal für Magier)
• Schnelle Heilung möglicherweise nur durch Priester möglich
:arrow: damit wären schon einmal 4 Berufsgruppen involviert (Alchemist, Handwerker & Magier zur Herstellung der Waffe, Priester zur Heilung der Schäden)
• Steuerung der zeitlichen Begrenzung möglich über
o Zeit
o Anzahl der Hiebe / Stiche / Schläge
o :arrow: ich weiß nicht ob & was davon besser umsetzbar ist
• desweiteren wären zusätzlich noch offensive „Vergiftungszauber“ für Magier möglich (Frage zusätzlicher Verbrauch von Ressourcen?, welche wären das dann?)

andere zeitlich vergiftete Gegenstände:
• Rüstungen, Ringe, Amulette, Schilde(?) könnten eine Art Schutzfunktion (verringertes Vergiftungsrisiko) bekommen (eine zeitliche Steuerung der Wirkung des Giftes könnte hier problematisch sein)
• die Herstellung sollte dann analog den Waffen bei den Magiern liegen

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:29 pm
by maryday
GolfLima `s Ideas for poison(-s)

In general:
1) permanently poisoned weapons add to the pool of "special items" and take away the sense of temporary poison
2) introducing permanently poisoned item is only of short term use for crafters / trader
3) beside introducing poisons there should also be a system of curing poisons developped, at the same time
4) the not yet implemented "magical diamond" could receive a role concerning poisons, either as ((reusable?)) protection of the person producing the poison or beeing used up. How can a magical diamond be obtained?
5) Production and processing of the poison should be linked to skill lvl. (for example: Alchemy, Magic >75; =>Limitation of produced goods and support of char interaction.)

Temporary poisoned weapons:
- Production of poisons ONLY by alchemists by filling poison to bottles (Including special herbs, to limit the overlly produced ammount of poison, "Wolverine Fern" for example.)
- Production of temporary to be poisoned weapons by mages ONLY, who have to purchase the poison from alchemists and the weapon from crafters. (Again the support of interaction.)
- Quick healing probably only possible by priests.
- That would make four char classes involved (Alchemist, Crafter, Mage and Priest).
- Control of time limits ((of the poison effect?)) possible by
o time
o number of hits
(o I do not know which might be suiting better or might be easier to implement)
- Also offensive magical "poisoning spells" would be needed for mages (Do they use ingredients here? Wich would these be?)


other temporary poison items:
- Armour, Rings, Amulets, Schields(?) could receive some kind of protective function (lower risk of beeing poisoned as example). Damage over time caused by the poison could cause some problems here.
- The production of the weapons should be in the hands of mages

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:20 pm
by GolfLima
thanks to maryday for the translation :wink:

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 12:31 am
by Uhuru
I like the idea of temporary poisoned weapons... some of my thoughts...
-Crafter makes the weapon.
-Alchemist makes the potions needed to poison/re-poison the weapon.
-Anyone can apply the poison.

The weapons used can be only specific ones, but at nearly any level and weapon type.
-Quality of the weapon effects poisoning, only in that it effects when a hit lands.
-Quality of the poison, strength, effects the poisoning effect when a hit does land.

There should be several different types of poison, giving the user options on how much s/he wishes to spend on the product. The more expensive poisons kill better, naturally, but are more difficult to make, requiring far more complex recipes.
-The options allow warriors to use the better poisons on better blades and weaker ones on training blades. Or, however, they wish.
-Complex, meaning 15 ingredients as apposed to only 5.
-It is up to the ability of the alchemist to determine if/when to use rare herbs, however, if there is no other way to brew a potion then use them, then the alchemist needs more training. Most potions should be able to be made without them, it's just a matter of how many side effects are acceptable. And, poison should be no exception.

When applying poison:
-Bottle in hand.
-Weapon in belt.
-When using the bottle, an interface should pop up asking the character which weapon s/he wishes to apply the potion to like when socketing the magical gemstones. (Although, they don't have to be held in hand, so that may not be necessary here.)

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:55 am
by Mephistopheles
Some ideas for different types. The possibilities are endless.
-Clouding poison: -2 perc (not stackable on multiple hits) and a weak DoT ((damage over time)) medium use time

-Poison of encumbrance: emcumbers the foe or stuns him/her for a short time on a successful hit. Medium use time.

-Disorientation poison: -1 str and -1 perc and -1 int (not stackable on multiple hits) with weak DoT. Short use time.

-Blood thinner poison: -2 con (not stackable) weak DoT. Medium use time

-Shadow's delight: weak DoT long use time.

-Burnout poison: medium DoT and medium use time.

-Poison of impending doom: high quality advanced poison with high DoT and short use time.

-Cherass' kiss: one hit use upon application of the weapon. (If its a miss, parried, or saved then too bad. One use) -75% the victims health is gone. High quality and advanced poison (obviously :p)

Just throwing ideas out there. I like the idea of keeping the current permanent weps and also having temporary poisons. I am not sure of these are possible but ill just shoot by throwing out the ideas.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:37 pm
by maryday
((IMO this here turns out nice, so far. Ok. you`re right. I should at least try out alchemy.))


Indeed, the list can be endless.
(The first two points are directed towards POs with experience on chars played in former Illarion sys. The third directs to Everyone.)

An early step might be that some POs with experience on high level mages throw all negative and alterating magic effects into one pot, creating a basic list ((It must not necessaryly be understandable by anyone.)).
Then the way of approach could be to include all possible reverted ((if not already in)) effects of the present alchemy sys ((some alterating effects or effects in the class of change can go unchanged;) )).
Now an understandable, public list of effects (or at least classes, with examples) (A) would have to be created.

The third step could be to explore other sys beside ours, creating a list of effects (or classes of effects) EXCLUDING effects/classes of the list (A) above.


((For example i personally had no problem basically scrapping an Arcania 2 sys within maybe 4 or 6 hrs.
If you would want to take some time for exploring D&D or Pathfinder sys, it is another thing. A single person is unlike to create a complete basic sys overview simply as one person is unlike to play the needed total number of chars, each for enough time.
Think about which systems you liked in your gaming career. ANY could be of interest, no matter whether mario, metroid, aquaria, anycraft.
Write a short overview of the sys you would like to mention. Try to keep it an overview, name exact effects as examples only.
Do not name its name.
Post it.))


((Try to refrain from postin`incomplete Ultima reviews all alone;)) :twisted:

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 6:15 pm
by Uhuru
Exploring other games is a nice idea maryday, but something to consider is if we want to be like other games? Has Illarion ever wanted to be like other games?

Looking at the games to see what they are doing and how, just to give us a starting point to go off and do our own thing, is one thing, but I'm not sure the dev team would appreciate us trying to include a list of what they are doing and trying to emulate them. Which is what it seemed you wanted to do, but I could be wrong.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 6:24 pm
by Uhuru
Mephistopheles wrote:Some ideas for different types. The possibilities are endless.
-Clouding poison: -2 perc (not stackable on multiple hits) and a weak DoT ((damage over time)) medium use time

-Poison of encumbrance: emcumbers the foe or stuns him/her for a short time on a successful hit. Medium use time.

-Disorientation poison: -1 str and -1 perc and -1 int (not stackable on multiple hits) with weak DoT. Short use time.

-Blood thinner poison: -2 con (not stackable) weak DoT. Medium use time

-Shadow's delight: weak DoT long use time.

-Burnout poison: medium DoT and medium use time.

-Poison of impending doom: high quality advanced poison with high DoT and short use time.

-Cherass' kiss: one hit use upon application of the weapon. (If its a miss, parried, or saved then too bad. One use) -75% the victims health is gone. High quality and advanced poison (obviously :p)

Just throwing ideas out there. I like the idea of keeping the current permanent weps and also having temporary poisons. I am not sure of these are possible but ill just shoot by throwing out the ideas.

Ok, I like that you have so many ideas here. Thinking we need to flesh them out some, especially as I'm not sure what you mean by being not stackable and also delivering DoT. Ok, so it can't double hit a person? But if we think that through, you are still using your sword, hitting, it is depleting its poison, assuming it is a temporary poison and not a permanent one (you didn't indicate which you thought would be temporary or permanent use). If you can only land one poisoning hit that isn't stackable, seems harsh to keep the poison draining from the weapon, which will likely happen. However, I see your reasoning, in that you don't want people to drop dead from 70 hits and weak poison, let them recover, then another poisoning strike. Right?

However, they can and should carry antidote, which they could drink at anytime, just like they pause to eat. So, with that in mind, shouldn't they all stack? I mean, Uhuru is carrying this badass poisoning weapon, she's going to want it to friggin' poison! Won't people get confused and frustrated if it doesn't?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:39 pm
by Mephistopheles
Sorry i meant that the stat reducing effects arent stackable because if someone gets hit so many times theyd end up with 0 con or 0 str etc. The DoT should stack :P

Again these are not concrete, the devs will decide what they can do and are willing to do.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 8:43 pm
by maryday
((DoT=Damage over Time, if you were unsure;))
There should be some influence of poison quality and weapon affinity.

The question is how complicated you want a sys of resistances to be.
Do you want fleshed out nutrition/hydration/activity included to poison sys?
The question is whether you want to include a sys of fears?
Or flesh out the area of elemental stuff?
What effects can affect the mind?

((EDIT; because of translation issues cropped;))

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:25 pm
by maryday
Here we go again.
My intention is not to suggest new herbs for introduction yet to show a palette of possible game contents.

((Due to possible copyright issues i allowed myself the freedom to censor the names of the herbs. This is a free translation and excerpt.
I post this not as list for features i want explicitely implemented, yet as a LIST OF EXAMPLES how different herbs might be combined or processed PERIOD.
This list is most likely to be of no use in this discussion.
You are free to write me a PM if you want an overview of another system of your choice.))

Every herb could have different stats as follows. %s are dependand of medium attributes/stats. Listed here only poisonous herbs, no healing or planetouched stuff.

Price: Worth if purchased in an area where it may be harvested (low-medium-high-very high).
Area: Rough classifications in which surroundings the herb might be found (hot-moderate-cold).
Landscape: Ecological structure within an area (woods, dunes, rocky surface,etc.).
Herblore: Minimum of herblore skill needed to sucessfully recognize / know the herb (low-medium-high, processing not included).
Part: The part of the plant in which the active substance can be found (whole-root-stalk-leaf-blossom-fruit/seed).
Effect: Effect if consumed raw, contacted, eaten....
Use: "Name of the poison" the herb may be part of, naming of other ingredients or procedures (easy-medium-difficult) in production and effect(-s) of finished poison.
Danger: In general danger when harvesting or otherwisely contacting the plant.

20 mostly horrible things, fresh and raw from the rippin`rig.
Have fun.
Don`t waste too much time;P

- - -

Code: Select all

[b]Herb_01[/b]
Price: medium
Area: hot
Landscape: desert and neighbouring
Herblore: low to medium (high; thorn harvest)
Part: fruit of a cactus
Effect: INT, PER, DEX, SPD suffer a short term penalty for less then half an hour (basic penalty is 10% of attribute);
Use: dried or fresh parts of the fruit can be orally consumed, while the strongest effect can be obtained by smoking dried parts, blended. Light hallucinogenic, mainly on taste and smell;
Danger: DEX check upon harvest. Fail causes dangerous poisoning guided by heavy hallucination (up to ten thorns at once, according up to 30% health loss. EVERY thorn deals additionally -5%
up to -15% penalties on each INT, PER and SPD for less then half an hour.
Excessive consumtion may cause stunted sensuality.

[b]Herb_02[/b]
Price: medium to very high (if processed)
Area: moderate to hot
Landscape: swamps, woods and floodplains
Herblore: low to medium
Part: skin of a mushrooms head
Effect: Unprocessed and orally consumed a low health damage is dealt, combined with a low attribute loss on STR and PER (duration minimum of an hour).
Use: grinded along with thistle oil and a stabilizer ((Firnis?)) a weapon poison may be created. Extracted with alcohol a consumption poison may be created.
Both poisons would inflict low to moderate damage, every hour for at least four hours. Weak persons might die from the damage.
Danger: toxic

[b]Herb_03[/b]
Price: medium to very high if processed
Area: hot
Landscape: rainforest, woods, skirts of wood
Herblore: medium to high (low for indigenic)
Part: stalks / vines
Effect: not edible pieces of vine
Use: grinded with chalk and bone, thereafter reduced a "poison of fear" can be created. It is a weapon poison, afflicting low to high damage on health while penalizing PER, DEX and SPD (basic 

penalty is 5%). Weak persons are likely to die from the damage.
Danger: none

[b]Herb_04[/b]
Price:low to very high if processed
Area: hot, exotic
Landscape: humid woods
Herblore: high (medium for indigenic)
Part: seed of a vine
Effect: One eaten seed will rise STR (+5-10%) for 12hrs up to 30hrs. The consumption of another (and every other) seed while the duration of the first has not ended will cause low health damage, 

while the STR bonus will stack.
Use: seeds can be grinded for receiving an oil which may be extracted by alcohol to receive a more pure version of the positive effect. Consumption of the oil will rise STR (+5-10%, also stacking) 

for 2hrs up to 20hrs. The first consumed unit will cause low health damage, the second medium, the third high...
Danger: rising toxity

[b]Herb_05[/b]
Price: very high to skyrocketing high (if properly collected and processed)
Area: moderate to hot
Landscape: ponds and lakes
Herblore: low (in general) high for specific kinds
Part: blossom or pollen of water flower
Effect: if breathed in it may cause low to medium health damage and attribute penalties (5%-10%) on INT and PER. Hallucinogeniv. Effect may be fully negated by save throw.
Use: a dangerous breath poison may be created. The duration is up to 2hrs. EVERY 5 MINUTES low to medium damage is dealt. If the save throw fails, the victim will go unconscious within the FIRST 5 

MINUTES of the effects duration. Heavy hallucinogenic with massive shifting of perceptions. The victim is very likely to die, no matter of its CON.
Danger: inhalation, death

[b]Herb_06[/b]
Price: high to very high
Area: unknown
Landscape: rocky areas and mountains
Herblore: high to very high
Part: blossom of a flower
Effect: Hallucinogenic, mainly taste and smell. The victim will fantasize about known or unknown tastes or smells. The victim is unlikely to stop contact with the origin of the smell or will try 

to consume the blossom (or the object that has been prepared with the blossom).
Use: a mind affecting perfume may be created from the herb, by extracion with alcohol. Any person(-s) breathing in the perfume (not the user) will suffer WIL / INT penalties and are heavyly 

attracted to the perfumed person.
Danger: issues when trying to reach for a blossom, eating toxic food

[b]Herb_07[/b]
Price: low
Area: hot
Landscape: reinforest, woods and sometimes cultivated
Herblore: low
Part: fruit of a scrub
Effect: none, as long the fruit(-s) have not started to ferment.
Use: If the person consuming the fruit has consumed alcohol within the passed three days or is going to consume alcohol within the following three days after consumption of the fruit, it is very 

likely to die from the combination.
Danger: possibly toxic, death

[b]Herb_08[/b]
Price: low to high if processed
Area: moderate
Landscape: lake shores, floodplains and swamps
Herblore: medium to high
Part: stalk and blossom of a shrub
Effect: none
Use: Grinded and boiled with a little bit of alcohol a potion positively affecting INT and DEX (+10%-20%) for half an hour up to two hors. If the consumer takes the potion within the following 30 

days after the first consumption, he will most likely (80%) develop a massive addiction. If addicted, here will be no more positive effect when consuming the poison. If the addicted does not 

consume one unit of the potion EVERY SECOND DAY he will suffer penalties on INT, PER, DEX and SPD (5%-30%)
Danger: INT and DEX decay upon long term use possible

[b]Herb_09[/b]
Price: high to skyrocketing high (if processed)
Area: hot
Landscape: rainforest, rocky area, riverbanks
Herblore: high
Part: parts of vines
Effect: not edible
Use: Parts of the vine are fermented and changed by seperate procedures thereafter to receive a ((the)) weapon poison. INT and SPD decay -10% after one minute, itching. Thereafter STR and DEX 

decay -30% and health damage ONE TO FIVE HP EVERY FIVE SECONDS FOR 15 MINUTES.
Danger: toxic, death

[b]Herb_10[/b]
Price: high to very high
Area: moderate and hot
Landscape: Plains, woods and riversides
Herblore: medium to high
Part: blossom or seedpod / seed of a shrub
Effect: Living blossom emits a visually hallucinogenic scent guided by euphoria (duration is five minutes to one and a half hour).There is a 15% chance (cummulating for every consumption) that the 

victim may develop an addiction. After the effect for the same duration a penalty of -50% to WIL and each -10% INT, PER.
Oral consumption of the blossom may cause either fear, joy or lethargy, depending on colour. Duration is twenty to thirty minutes. Consumption of several blossoms does rise both duration and 

intensity. The ingredients are not hallucinogenic yet affecting/mirroring own emotions.
Use: Oral consumption of the seed leads to almost instant full loss of conscience, guided by fear, for a duration of fourty minutes up to an hour. Astra..*scratched off*..is possible yet 

dangerous. Permanent full loss of mind is possible. The first consumption adds +10% on fear of death, and interdicts its lowering for one up to five "levels~20%.
Danger: addiction, personality decay

[b]Herb_11[/b]
Price: high to very high
Area: moderate and hot
Landscape: plains, waste, woodland edges
Herblore: medium to high
Part: juice of stalk and leaf of a shrub
Effect: high corrosive
Use: Grinded and pressed, then mixed with different ingredients processed into a dangerous weapon and contact poison. The weapon poison deals additionaly 0% up to 75% damage EACH successful hit.
The contact poison may cause [insert]% up to [insert]% corrosion damage each hour for two up to twelve hours, if untreated. Skin will loose any perception. Leather, cloth or wood will be 

decomposed.
Danger: toxic on contact to the plant

[b]Herb_12[/b]
Price: none
Area: cold
Landscape: shadowed mountain flanks, highlands, woods, waste
Herblore: low to medium
Part: spore of a mushroom
Effect: Exploding mushrooms (also see below) cause a breath induced poisoning on up to 15 ft. distance. CON save throw. If failed STR or END. If failed the consumed spores will sprout within the 

victim EITHER 60% on skin or 40% in lungs. On skin it is causing 0% up to 15% health decay for two up to ten weeks, each week. Health regen is afflicted. In lungs 0% up to -50% health penalty and 

each WIL, STR, DEX penalty of 20%. Both afflictions count as sicknesses.
Use: none
Danger: contact toxic / inhalation

[b]Herb_13[/b]
Price: medium to very high
Area: cold
Landscape: swamp, woods, humid grounds
Herblore: high
Part: skin of a mushroom
Effect: none. DANGER: Exploding mushrooms can cause breath induced (DEX-save dice) health damage of -10% up to -80%.
Use: The skin of the mushroom is extracted with alcohol, mixed with FRESH pistils of a certain herb, reduced and grinded with chalk and oil to ointment. PER (sight) +50%, four up to six hours.
Danger: Inhalation; Bright sunlight causes -15% up to -60% penalty to certain PER (visually) skills.

[b]Herb_14[/b]
Price: low
Area: hot
Landscape: woods, wood edges
Herblore: high (low for indigenic)
Part: fruit of a tree
Effect: STR +30% bonus and INT penalty -30% up to -80%, for two up to ten hours. If penalty bigger then 40%, sleep. Positive low hallucinogenic.
Use: "several"
Danger: addiction, personality decay

[b]Herb_15[/b]
Price: high to very high
Area: hot
Landscape: river banks, woodland edges
Herblore: very high to unknown
Part: pollen of flower
Effect: The inhalation of pollen of up to four blossoms grant extatic hallucinations for one up to five hours and thereafter penalties of -20% on all attributes for three up to twenty hours.
The inhalation of pollen of five or more plants deliver -20% up to -60% health damage, each hour for 1 hour up to 5 hours. Any victim is likely to die.
Use: unknown
Danger: inhalation, overdose, addiction, death

[b]Herb_16[/b]
Price: high to very high
Area: cold
Landscape: woods, wood edges
Herblore: medium to high
Part: whole mushroom
Effect: poisonous upon contact, health damage -30%
Use: Grinded to salt and bone glue fixed (often coloured) dangerous weapon poison. Within 5 seconds of failed save throw -10% up to -20% health damage, burning, every five minutes, for fourty 

minutes, sweating. Many victims are likely to die.
Danger: contact toxic, death

[b]Herb_17[/b]
Price: high to skyrocketing high
Area: moderate
Landscape: waste, plains, woods
Herblore: medium
Part: fruit of a (toxic) scrub
Effect: one fruit toxic-50% up to -90% health damage.
Use: Grinded in oil or grease to an (almost) tasteless ointment. May be used as slow yet dangerous weapon poison. Half an hour after beeing initially sucessfully beeing poisoned causes CON decay 

-10% and health damage -10% up to -50% every 5 minutes for up to thirty minutes. Any victim is likely to die.
Danger: contact toxic, muscle paralysis, death

[b]Herb_18[/b]
Price: medium up to high
Area: hot
Landscape: rainforest, rocky area, woods, highlands, (plantations!?)
Herblore: almost unknown
Part: root of a shrub
Effect: not edible, orally consumed vomiting, -20% health damage, health regen stunted.
Use: Grinded and reducted, mixed to oil and little alcohol creates a beverage causing a high grade of self-satisfaction, and massive addiction (must be save thrown against each 10% difficulty, 

stacking, for each passed consumption).
Oral consumption of the beverage causes INT, PER and SPD each -20% initially. Thereafter low WIL and INT decay, nervousness, etc.. A failure in the processing or consumption may cause -66% health 

damage for every 30% difference of CON and dice.
Danger: addiction, overdose, personality decay, death

[b]Herb_19[/b]
Price: high
Area: cold
Landscape: ponds, lake shores
Herblore: low in general (almost unknown for the fruit)
Part: blossom or fruit
Effect: blossom scent inhaled hallucinations of sensual quality and strength. hangover on the next day. picked flowers loose the power.
Use: Eating the fruit causes light euphoric stimulations and wish for sensual contact (one up to three hours).
Danger: swimming in an area overgrown with the plant may cause drowning. excessive consumtion may cause stunted sensuality or sexual infertility.

[b]Herb_20[/b]
Price: low to high
Area: hot
Landscape:river banks, swamp, woddland edges, woods, plantations
Herblore: medium (low for indigenic)
Part: leaves
Effect: orally applied a burning taste, good against bad teeth.
Use: dried, smoked unblended. Low to high hallucinogenic, depending on the kind of noise or music the consumer is hearing.
Danger: [insert]

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Fri May 02, 2014 11:06 am
by Ufedhin
Temporary and permanent poisons for non magical weapons would be nice ,Temporary poison should increase the amount of damage the weapon deals (no change in weapons looks),the quality of the poison determines only the duration in days it stays active on the weapon.(blunt or slashing ranged or stabbing ,it matters not),it is applied to the weapon by the the holder of the poison potion.A kind of temporary alchemist weapon buff .

Lets keep the green glowing permanent poison weapons for the smith/ alchemist relationship ,this poison is a totally different breed,this poison potion is more potently magical and when used by a gifted smith will create those lovely green alchemically smithed poison blades.
This poison crafting potion should be made using a pure element or two plus the herbs and catalyst,thus keeping it expensive and uncommon.

Keep it simple i say. :lol:

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 12:11 pm
by Estralis Seborian
Once there is a good proposal without ((strange brackets)) and stuff written in tiny font, I'd be interested in reading a summary - perhaps on Mantis?

Keep in mind we have graphics for some poisoned weapons, but not for all. Also, if you don't want to use them, we got to drop them from the game.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Tue May 06, 2014 2:26 pm
by maryday
@ Estralis: Define "graphics for some poisoned weapons".
Does it mean "weapons with poison applied to them" or
"weapons which are poisonous because of their production / included materia".

- - -

I share Ufedhins opinion here on the looks. Temporary poisoned weapons would need no special (individual) graphic.
The most simple solution could be to to have a transparent greenish overlay infront of the item (or behind of it, if individual graphics allow this).
This way all weapons with the possibility of beeing poisoned could be addressed at once. There could be different kinds or colours of the overlay(s) though, for showing different kinds or classes of poison.

The existing graphics could still be used for permanently poisonous weapons. Dropping graphics should always be the last solution.
How about giving all "permanently poisoned weapons" overally low (permanent yet item quality/durability dependand) poison(ing) stats while giving them each, an individual, high "poison affinity" (depending on weapon class, origin or individual shape)?



((I`ll think about including IG / wiki contents like herbs and weapons and finally a summarized translation of this thread in the meantime. And the Mantis..*Sighs while nodding twice slowly*))

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 8:47 am
by Ufedhin
Estralis Seborian wrote:Once there is a good proposal without ((strange brackets)) and stuff written in tiny font, I'd be interested in reading a summary - perhaps on Mantis?

Keep in mind we have graphics for some poisoned weapons, but not for all. Also, if you don't want to use them, we got to drop them from the game.
Done. :D

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 9:42 am
by GolfLima
:arrow: could someone explain to me what is the sense of temporarily poisoned weapons if there are also permanent poisoned weapons?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 3:29 pm
by Ufedhin
well yes indeed, someone might not like the idea of carring a permanent poison weapon :shock: , but just want it for a certain fight against a horror, a character might also not be able to use any of the permanent poison weapons able to be made, he/she might well use a bow for example or a wooden dagger or a bent hat pin, your hardly likely to get a smith to forge you a permanent poison club now are you?

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 3:48 pm
by GolfLima
Sorry, now i´m totally out. :(

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 6:17 pm
by Uhuru
I was under the impression that the temporary poison would be stronger. Perhaps different than just a standard poison. Probably not something you'd want to use for a training weapon.

Re: Ideas for poisoning

Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 11:36 pm
by Uhuru
Ufedhin wrote:
Estralis Seborian wrote:Once there is a good proposal without ((strange brackets)) and stuff written in tiny font, I'd be interested in reading a summary - perhaps on Mantis?

Keep in mind we have graphics for some poisoned weapons, but not for all. Also, if you don't want to use them, we got to drop them from the game.
Done. :D
Uffe, is this the "summary" of the whole proposal? If so, there is quite a lot missing. Will you be adding all the details?
http://illarion.org/mantis/view.php?id=9952