Illarion.org

Currently, the humans in this game FAR outnumber all the other races. (elves come second, and i think they have a quarter or so of the human numbers)

This isnt necessarily a bad thing, but it does mean (imo) there is an opportunity to shake the humans up a little.

What im proposing isnt really a new race.. but another type of human. The storyline idea would be for a new race of warlike people from the east landing on the eastern shores of Gobaith. Think like the mongol invasion.. except war wouldnt be declared immediately. They would just arrive and set up camp.. war could come later of course.

People would then have the choice of creating a (normal) human character, or this new eastern arrival (obviously we would come up with a name for them). They would be from a continent in the east as yet unknown, have darker skin, wear light armor, and be experts in longranged fighting. They would be warlike, but honourable, having left their home in search of fresh land, on behalf of their God/emperor in their homeland.

Their stats would be the same as the other humans, but they would have slightly altered graphics. They would also get their own class kit.

Once you create one of these humans, i think it would be awesome if you started out not in trollsbane but the warcamp on the eastern shores. This camp would be a essentially a set of cooking fires, leather rugs as beds, with a (command) tent at the centre. There would be npcs, with an npc warcheif in the command tent, who would explain to new warriors their position, where they are from etc, with a merchant who specialises in buying furs, leather, longrange equipment. I dont think this is 100% necessary, obviously its a worry people wont play if their character starts of in a place with noone else around.. but i think it would add a lot.

I think this should be considered, as unlike other race ideas, i dont think this would dilute things due to the larger number of human players we have already. It could also provide an awesome new storyline.

That sounds like a lot of fun to me...
But it also sounds like quite a lot of work. The question is: who is going to script all this???

Pointless. We have enough different races and even for the ones we have we have far too less players.

The thing that the humans outnumber the other races is correct but usual. The other races are just much harder to play and the majority of the players of the different races hardly play the other races even slightly in the way the races should be played. They are just all like humans.

And the "outnumbering" is much smaller then you think.

We have currently the following active played characters:
Humans: 341 (51,2%)
Dwarfs: 69 (10,3%)
Halflings: 32 (4,8%)
Elves: 149 (22,4%)
Orcs: 35 (5,2%)
Lizards: 30 (4,5%)
Gnomes: 2 (0,3%)
Fairies: 5 (0,7%)
Goblins: 3 (0,5%)

While the amounts of elves is slightly too high in my opinion (since say 80% of that elves are played like humans with long ears) all other values are fine. Maybe the Gnomes, Fairies and Goblins are a little low numbered. But that goes along with the point that they require a additional application. Something that wouldn't hurt the other races but the humans as well. To increase the level or the RP a little.

So at the end I can say the proposal is rejected. There is no point in another race.

Nitram

The point would be that it would be fun and create interesting rp? lol, i wont argue though.

We have 9 races. All of them have great different possibilities to create fun and interessting roleplay. They just need to be played. Useless to put in a shit load of work to include another race just to stand at the end that still noone is using the possibilities. We have the potential but the players do not use it. Thats the point.

Well personally, i would get rid of gnomes as a race (no offense to anyone who plays one). Virtually none are played, and the only ones ive ever met are played in exactly the same way as halflings.

What about scrapping the idea of including it as a new race then, but keeping the storyline and camp?

We have 9 playable races, few totally unused. Introducing a 10th race, taking into account the work for that, isn't very reasonable. But the general idea is not to be blamed. Have a look at the Nordmark - there, a group of players decided to play a tribe of non-normal humans (Norodaj, see: http://illarion.org/illarion/races/us_humans.php ). So, it works without additional graphics. Furthermore, for humans, there are serveral peoples to chose from.

Founding yet another new camp/town is also not very reasonable. Illarion has 5 major towns and like close to ten minor settlements (e.g. Kallahorn, Caelum, Nordmark, this lizard-thingy , Farmer's Union, Goldburg, Eldan monastery and Druid's house). How about using just these encampments for sophisticated plotlines as you described?

a nice feature would be if we could have graphics for the different human races. through this you could see if the human is norodaj, serinjah, ama–shoon, salkamaerianer, albarianer or gynkeesh. but this means grafics for at least 5 new "races", so we forget this better.

Ivar Kraftimarm wrote:a nice feature would be if we could have graphics for the different human races. through this you could see if the human is norodaj, serinjah, ama–shoon, salkamaerianer, albarianer or gynkeesh. but this means grafics for at least 5 new "races", so we forget this better.

Yeah, if they dont like my idea, no way in hell are they doing that <_<

The proposed camp would be very small btw. It wouldnt be a massive new town requiring a ton of work.

Well as someone allready said, why not take over the Lizard templeor kallahorn or caelum, you jsut need manpower and you could etablish a base there.

Because none of these places are near the ocean/sea shore, so it wouldnt make sense. Unless you'd mind an invasion of tol vanima?

A faction system is planned. That is pretty similar to your idea with camps etc. (Albarians - Salkamaerians - Gynkeesh)

The Lizard temple is directly on the shore and Caelum aswell as Kallahorn stand only sligthly away from the shore.

rofl I'd like to see them try.

Caelum IS on the shore. It's like 3 squares from ocean.

IMO we want MORE humans and less of the other races.. If you decide you wanna play your human char as a pygmy, fine by me, but do you really need new graphics to do it?:P

Edit: Everyone (including myself) complains that the nonhuman races are not played correctly, but is there really a good description of the behaviour of these races anywhere? If not, it might be a good idea to invest some time in making one...

lol Caelum cant be taken over by a bunch of men wearing loin cloths!

Daelyn wrote:IMO we want MORE humans and less of the other races.. If you decide you wanna play your human char as a pygmy, fine by me, but do you really need new graphics to do it?:P

Edit: Everyone (including myself) complains that the nonhuman races are not played correctly, but is there really a good description of the behaviour of these races anywhere? If not, it might be a good idea to invest some time in making one...

You dont really need new graphics, which is why i said scrap it later in the thread, lol. It would be cool though.

Well, noone's stoping you then, the plot you suggested sounded nice to me;)

Ive discussed this with some people who are interested, and although Caelum sounds like a good spot, i doubt people would agree to it being used..

So is there a gm willing to help out with a small camp on the eastern shores?

I do like the plot. I think Kallahorn is always free for the taking!

okay, please refrain from OOC usage of that name.

Kthx

only thing i would add is that if the players want this plot thread thatthey should slowly make it happen by making characters who would then band together with very similar backgrounds, like recon scouts that then build a camp and use itto recruit and launch an attack and so forth. this way tere is almost no need for any GM involvement at all except for actual map edition much later on when there is clearly enough support for the plot line

sorry for spelling i'm half asleep

Sundo Raca wrote:Ive discussed this with some people who are interested, and although Caelum sounds like a good spot, i doubt people would agree to it being used..

lolol damn straight.

Zzyathis is a logical starting point. No-one lives there, and technically, that guild is 'inactive', and according to Lennier's Building Rules, can be taken over by an 'Active Guild' to be used as a home.

However, IMHO, a remote place like Zzyathis, Kallahorn or even Caelum is a poor choice.

If a 'tribe' invades, it means they have already scouted, and must invade a place they can take and then defend. A place with tools and resources the tribe needs to continue their conquest. A Beach or empty 'Palace' is not where a real invasion would survive.

Strategically, there is only one 'logical' invasion point which is defensable, has resources and tools, as well as a low 'unarmed' population. Tol Vanima. The Tribe could conquer that village with ease, and then Isolate the whole 'Island' at the Dock.

I would suggest Greenbriar, a close second choice, but there's that thing called Caelum on the same Island. Plus, it doesn't have a mine-useless for warriors needing weapons!

TrollsBane, Varshikar and Silverbrand are not options as there are too many high skilled fighters there to warrant a successful first attack.

I don't really care what people think, but a swift conquest of Tol Vanima is the only 'logical' starting point for a band of invading warriors. Their 'wealth' of tools and resources (Everything is there!!!) is exactly what an invading Army would need to begin conquest on a hostile continent. They invade, secure the Island, build up and recruit, then expand when they are ready.

It's the only "Strategic" choice.

Nordmark. When all German players there are asleep. That is a strategic choice.

No seriously. The idea of an isolated island would work without those damn teleporters. Perhaps we could destroy or disable them?

There are lots of different human subtypes in the background descriptions. Have fun with those.
They are rarely played at all even(an example, and almost the only one, is the Northmark which is Norodaj humans), so there's no need for even more.

Well, all towns have them, so yes, it would have to be destroyed or even just 'blocked, whuch could be done by an invading tribe.

Also, the Dock would need to be blocked. Ideally with a lockable gate, so the tribe could conduct raids and such on their terms. Also logical for an army to do.

However, with some mages able to cast 'teleport spells anywhere, That couldn't be defended against. That's the only way Good guys could get in to attack. So then the Group just hides and not RP any battles until they build up. Or we could set up a 'rule' of no attacks or travel to their encampment for 2 RL Months to give them time to build up.

Build up a camp on sirani isles, noone would notice the preparations .

Damien wrote:There are lots of different human subtypes in the background descriptions. Have fun with those.
They are rarely played at all even(an example, and almost the only one, is the Northmark which is Norodaj humans), so there's no need for even more.

The thing is.. i like the idea of these people being completely unknown previously, like the mongol invasion where you get a complete clash of cultures which have never met before.

Invading tol vanima would be cool, but i thought people might get upset if we suddenly grabbed an established place. I prefer the idea of arriving with no prior knowledge of the isle, and gradually exploring/assesing the local capablities.

Chester, they are an organised war party, not a tribe dude