Open discussion about Slavery

Misjbar · Post by **Misjbar** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 4:59 pm

Calenleia wrote:Schade das man sich nicht die Mühe macht zweisprachig zu agieren...
ZUmindest der Auktuionator hätte das tun dürfen!
Nicht alle sprechen die neue Sprache... und um zu übersetzen ist leider dann zu viel los, wenn man selbst teilnimmt...

CAL

It would be nice if such happenings could be both languages... I would loved, if the slavetradler would have spoken both....
not everyone speaks the new language....
And there was to much trouble to translate fluently

CAL

Hmm...My german is not good enough for this hun. I will try next time though! ^_^

Avalyon el'Hattarr · Post by **Avalyon el'Hattarr** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:04 pm

Samantha Meryadeles wrote:And samantha holds not anymore much power. the magic system got tweaked that much that any good trained warrior can kill her alone if he is close to her. happened before with Verdazar and others. the times when mages could wipe out two or more warriors single handed is over. now they even have much problems against a single warrior.

You don't even know how true this is.

The Returner · Post by **The Returner** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:21 pm

The Returner wrote:
Congratulations, you're the first I admonish.
I'd said often enough: No personal attacks!

Arien
<---

Can my dot be a green dot, or a purple dot, or maybe a fuschia dot? please please please

Post by **Nitram** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:25 pm

The Returner wrote:Can my dot be a green dot, or a purple dot, or maybe a fuschia dot? please please please

No.

Tinuva Geogroda · Post by **Tinuva Geogroda** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:25 pm

The Returner wrote:
The Returner wrote:
Congratulations, you're the first I admonish.
I'd said often enough: No personal attacks!

Arien
<---

Can my dot be a green dot, or a purple dot, or maybe a fuschia dot? please please please

not to play for GM, but to not get a 2nd dot you better stay on topic =/

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:40 pm

Sounds like Samantha was sabotaging in game events

Korm Kormsen · Post by **Korm Kormsen** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:44 pm

i have a question:

do they have slaves in salkamaeria? or do they have laws against slavery?

concerning the trollsbane laws:
in RL in the times with slavery, existed laws against kidnapping too. aparently slavery and kidnapping weren't viewed as the same thing.

concerning the actions of magistrate Meriadeles:
normally magistrates judge. and they do so, after they got a denunciation/accusation, not on their own whims.
and they don't "police" themselves.

Patrick,

if the stance against slavery is a personal idea of your char, your char abused her powers, by going against something, that is not prohibited by law.

Lahela · Post by **Lahela** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:47 pm

It is not quiet a personal idea of Samantha. It is handled like this for ages now in Illarion. Now and than someone tries to introduce slaves and most chars are against it. It is an unwritten rule...

Samantha Meryadeles · Post by **Samantha Meryadeles** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:54 pm

Slavery is kidnapping. you hunt peoples, catch them, and sell them for profit away. you do the same with slavery AND kidnapping. she could also have added blackmailing since they threatened threm with forcer to do something against their will. means, allowing to sell themself away.

Calenleia · Post by **Calenleia** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:08 pm

Fooser wrote:Sounds like Samantha was sabotaging in game events

She wasn't- she was reacting fine... like she allways is... just having the towns rules in her mind. And she did nothing... she was really calm!

Korm Kormsen · Post by **Korm Kormsen** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:10 pm

Slavery is kidnapping. you hunt peoples, catch them, and sell them for profit away. you do the same with slavery AND kidnapping. she could also have added blackmailing since they threatened threm with forcer to do something against their will. means, allowing to sell themself away.

that sounds too modern to me.

in times of legal slavery there were a lot of ways to become a slave:
1) being sold by your chieftain (who was absolute lord over death and life of his people)
2) being sold by your parents into slavery.
3) being a prisoner of war, and sold into slavery.
4) being sentenced to slavery by law for ones debts.
5) being sentenced to slavery by law for crimes.
6) being born into slavery.

don't think too narrow minded. just because the northamerican slavery based on race was the last one to vanish, it was not the most common type of slavery.

think a little bit about the possibilities:
instead of clouding criminals, or putting them to jail (to be freed instantly),
caught criminals could be sentenced to temporal slavery instead of perma-death.
that would create interesting RP!
the POs, that play criminals normally should be to be expected to play difficult slaves.

Samantha Meryadeles · Post by **Samantha Meryadeles** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:28 pm

Samantha is a salkamaerian, and salkamaer has strict laws against slavery. she would never make someone a slave, nor allow slavery. it is simply her background. salkamaer is a country with modern laws. somewhat an utopia.

Keikan Hiru · Post by **Keikan Hiru** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:41 pm

One could argue about if Gobiath is already part of the Salkamaerian Empire.

Korm Kormsen · Post by **Korm Kormsen** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 7:12 pm

salkamaer is a country with modern laws. somewhat an utopia.

thank you for teaching me!

tomorrow will be the second day that i know, that i'm playing in a SF - setting.

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:21 pm

Samantha Meryadeles wrote: it wouldn't have happened like this wouldn't the market occured on trollsbane territory. but since it did so it was samanthas duty to react and do something against it. with all her power. i even broke my characters concept with not using force against the slavetraders, and i did bad roleplay with this. since it simply doesnt fit samantha. and it angers me that i had to step away from her roleplay and her concept.

Now remind me why Samantha was made an 'Archmage' by the GM's?

If power corrupts, like Samantha finally has shown, maybe more 'Archmages' need to be made to counteract this. Especially since the Magic system lacks many good teachers of late.

For the sake of Game play, Mage creation and just common sense....
CAN WE PLEASE GET SOME MORE MAGE TEACHERS MADE!!!!!

Samantha has enjoyed too much of the Magic Monopoly for too long in my opinion. The Magic system is slow, frustrating and honestly.....Doesn't really exist except by some to "Smile" with people when they wish as they wish with almost no consequences.

I view Samantha's actions as appaling, but consistent with what the players have been complaining about, and THE REASON no-one likes Trollsbane anymore. It's Samantha's private estate. I'm kind of glad it happened in front of a GM this time. Now maybe we can get something done about her abuse of power.

Samantha Meryadeles · Post by **Samantha Meryadeles** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:35 pm

Do you even realize what nonsense you are writing there? do you missed the many peoples who said her reaction was fitting her role and also a salkamaerian? you said it is a sign of corruption through powers that samantha would have used her magic to stop slavetraders selling slaves into slavery on trollsbane land? god...listen to yourself.

Also, there were 4 other mages attending the whole scene. that much to your "monopoly". you have no clue about what you are writing., no knowledge, no facts. you just make assumptions and attacks onto my person.

There was no abuse of power...damn it...use youzr brain. She is the magistrate and as such she stopped slavers selling slaves on trollsbane land. And be sure that a salkamaerian would nevver accept or tolerate something like that. please don't speak about things about which you know nothing.

No archmage would stop her fighting against slavers. Lor-Angur even accepts no mages from Albar who haven't cut their connections to Albar itself. Do you realize that many freed slaves fought for Lor-Angur and got taught there, in freedom? Lor-Angur is AGAINST slavery. and Lor-Angur is from where the archmages come.

Avalyon el'Hattarr · Post by **Avalyon el'Hattarr** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:25 pm

If the slave is their main char, trust me they will play it.. That or they'll perma kill it. Problem solved

NirAntae · Post by **NirAntae** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:39 pm

I'm bringing this quote over from the 'whose RP did you like' thread, because the discussion does not belong there.

Avalyon el'Hattarr wrote:I have to agree with patric on this one. When slavers come to a land where they know that slavery is forbitten, they can't just expect to be greeted with flowers

A land where slavery is forbidden? Says who? Where does it say, anywhere, that slavery is forbidden on Gobiath? If they had been *in* Salkameria, yes, you'd be quite right. But just because Samantha is from Salkameria, does not mean that slavery is forbidden on Gobiath.

And just my own two cents... not all 'slave owners' are evil. And not all slaves are captured/forced into slavery.

And as for

The only question: Would anybody like to play a Slave for quite a while? Wink

I might, if given enough incentive (as in, RP quality, not just intending to use my char for free labor

) to delete an inactive char.

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:48 pm

Samantha Meryadeles wrote:Do you even realize what nonsense you are writing there? do you missed the many peoples who said her reaction was fitting her role and also a salkamaerian?

There is nothing in the Forums or the Main website about Salkmeria. Where are you getting all this info about it?

Samantha Meryadeles wrote:you said it is a sign of corruption through powers that samantha would have used her magic to stop slavetraders selling slaves into slavery on trollsbane land? god...listen to yourself.

It is a sign of Corruption that Samantha used her powers as "Magistrate" which is akin to a "Judge" and "Legislator" to enforce Laws, a power clearly assigned to the Captain of the Guard.

You, yourself also said that you defied her own "RP" to do this.

Samantha Meryadeles wrote: Also, there were 4 other mages attending the whole scene. that much to your "monopoly". you have no clue about what you are writing., no knowledge, no facts. you just make assumptions and attacks onto my person.

The Monopoly I spoke of is the fact that you were granted all the powers of an Archmage. GRANTED. What did you have to do for them? Nothing.
Every character I have made has had nothing 'Granted' to them. Dusty even, has had to work for everything he has. Every ore of coal, every log of wood, every pile of sand was earned through time and sweat.

I don't see why you love to Lord your powers over others when you've done nothing for them. You say you 'teach' but they are 'hand-picked' students. Quite different from real 'teaching'.

On the other hand, I love to teach what I have learned to anyone, and feel it is an honor to pass it on.

Samantha Meryadeles wrote: There was no abuse of power...damn it...use youzr brain. She is the magistrate and as such she stopped slavers selling slaves on trollsbane land. And be sure that a salkamaerian would nevver accept or tolerate something like that. please don't speak about things about which you know nothing.

I know nothing? As a Magistrate, I have seen Samantha do damn little to serve the people of Trollsbane other than reinforce her own power and wealth and reward her cronies.
Dusty on the other hand (and even Kurga to a lesser extent) gave all to their people. To this day, Dusty owns no house, no wealth, no power. He has given fortunes to the people he served.
That is service. That is what I know. It is enough.

Samantha Meryadeles wrote: No archmage would stop her fighting against slavers. Lor-Angur even accepts no mages from Albar who haven't cut their connections to Albar itself. Do you realize that many freed slaves fought for Lor-Angur and got taught there, in freedom? Lor-Angur is AGAINST slavery. and Lor-Angur is from where the archmages come.

Again, I wonder how much Lor-Angur really plays in this game, and how much is just make-believe. I could pretend to be from "Land of whatever" and be a Lord of "Whatever", but it doesn't change the fact that Samantha is just putting on the show that she wants everyone to see.

We may agree to disagree, but personally, I long for the Day when Samantha is 'forced' to retire. She has ruined more gameplay than she has ever helped, and Illa has lost many good players because of it.

Just my opinion.

Azuros · Post by **Azuros** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:50 pm

Lightfolk (Salkamaerian) live in towns, villages and castles. The place of origin of the Salkamaerian way of life is the old city of Salkamar, which is also the origin of the common language and writing system.
The Salkamaerian way of life implies respect, honor, and loyalty. It is a noble one. All Salkamaerian children learn reading and writing. Slavery is forbidden by law and a military education is offered to all members of poorer families for free. The Salkamaerian kings and nobles are understood to be representatives of the people and are often wise and good regents. Cities are ruled by male or female lords (males and females have equal rights among Salkamaerians). The Salkamaerian culture is open to strangers, without prejudice.
Salkamaerian poets, bards and philosophers are well known among the world, as are Salkamaerian paladins, who fight for their honorable virtues and for humanity in general. Zhambra, Oldra, Sirani, Elara and Malachín are the most supported gods in Salkamaerian towns.

there

Edit: http://moonsilver.de/english/history/magie.htm
this is for Lor Angur information

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:54 pm

That's not nearly enough info about Salkmeria to justify Samantha's actions in my opinion. Sorry, nice try.

I don't consider Moonsilver's realm as part of Illa, just an extension of it made by a fan. Fooser could write anything he wanted in his "Ultimate Illarion" site. It doesn't make it 'real'.

Samantha Meryadeles · Post by **Samantha Meryadeles** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:56 pm

The rest of information can be found in the magic academy library, means their forum, and through damiens word. the one writing the background.

again, you write just nonsense. i cant take you serious. you don't think about the stuff you write, and especially you dont gather informations. theres nothing true behind that all. it is simply lied. dissapointing from you

and Fooser hasnt written moonsilver. one of the "co founder" of illarion did...god...you really know nothing, but have to write about everything. moonsilver is the official background page. everything there is true

Azuros · Post by **Azuros** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:57 pm

I thought there was more, I'll check the Academy board ^^

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:00 pm

Again Patric, you fail to answer the real questions.

Again, you dodge the topics with excuses and deception.

As a Player, I detest Samantha. Sorry, just the way I feel for all the reason I have already stated.

Samantha Meryadeles · Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:01 pm

There is nothing to answer. you simply wrote alot of untrue stuff and lies. i dont have to answer onto lies and stuff that holds no truth. sorry. come back once you have facts, and not just untrue assumptions.

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:05 pm

Samantha Meryadeles wrote:There is nothing to answer. you simply wrote alot of untrue stuff and lies. i dont have to answer onto lies and stuff that holds no truth. sorry. come back once you have facts, and not just untrue assumptions.

No, you don't have to answer anything. Your actions speak volumes, as today's incident has shown.

I, and many others have watched you abuse Samantha's powers time and again for more than a year. I don't say anything that isn't true.

Most people can think for themselves.

Samantha Meryadeles · Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:06 pm

Any proof or example for when she abused her powers. and please explain which powers you mean, her powers as a magistrate or as a mage.

and you better dont speak anymore about abusing and earning something ingame. we all know that you are one of the worsed powergamers ever in this game

Juniper Onyx · Post by **Juniper Onyx** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:10 pm

Samantha Meryadeles wrote:Any proof or example for when she abused her powers. and please explain which powers you mean, her powers as a magistrate or as a mage.

Tell you what, since this is now getting off topic, I'll do some research, pull some incidents, and create a "Rant" topic. How about that.

It'll take some time.

Samantha Meryadeles · Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:11 pm

Sure. and i will show you why every example of you is nonsense and without truth behind it.

Korm Kormsen · Post by **Korm Kormsen** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:21 pm

juniper,

just leave it be.
you two are flaming. i am not against a little bit of flaming, if i could see, that it moves something.
but one can't move closed systems.

(by a closed system i mean something like: the char is allmighty, because the player knows it all; the player knows it all, by the experience to play an allmighty char - period or repetition )

greeting,korm