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Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:00 pm
by Q-wert
LucyP wrote:I don't understand something. I get that some people are unhappy about how magical gems are distributed or found. But why do they not trade what they do have with others when asked? My character has been struggling for months, in game months to try and find anyone to trade with. Today, at the fair, finally someone is willing to trade for one latent. Only one. At this rate it will take many years to get a set together. And all she wants is a set of limited stones. This is beyond frustrating and, for a fighter character, about to make her swim off to other shores.
I don't think it is that gems aren't being found or given at tax time, is it that people just refuse to trade? Why are the stones of your own town so important to hold onto?
The reason why no one wishes to trade theirs for Galmarian ones is simple. There are a lot of Galmarian stones produced in total, due to the recent shift of population towards Galmair (which happened for reasons this thread might explain). While the gem output is somewhat equal for all towns per person (even a little higher for the non-Galmarians, I dare say), there are way more Galmarian stones on the market than those of the other settlements.
In the end that is just one of the balancing features to encourage playing in underpopulated towns.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:17 pm
by LucyP
People not willing to trade is stagnating the game. Frustrating to players. Going to be a big issue if it is not already.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:20 pm
by GolfLima
Erstens: Galmair scheint seit einiger Zeit einen recht großen Ausstoß an mag. Steinen zu haben
First: seems that Galmair has a big output of magical gems
Zweitens: es werden eine Menge an magischen Obsidianen beim Bergbau gefunden
Second: there will be found a lot of magical obsidians when mining
damit wird man nur schwer jemand finden, der diese Steine zum Tausch benötigt
so you will hardly find somebody who needs this kind of stones
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:33 pm
by Matron
Galmairians could just donate to other towns to increase their gem-output.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:49 pm
by LucyP
As posted in another thread, nearly no magical stones found while gathering wood (one found in learning 67 levels). Is it different or are there just so many more stones gathered compared to wood?
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:39 am
by CJK
LucyP wrote:As posted in another thread, nearly no magical stones found while gathering wood (one found in learning 67 levels). Is it different or are there just so many more stones gathered compared to wood?
All magical gems have a 0.025% (1/4000) drop rate when gathering. It's the same as pure elements.
Also, for those that don't know which crafts drop what:
Egg gathering: Obsidian
Honey gathering: Emerald
Milking: Topaz
Farming: Ruby
Fruit gathering: Ruby
Mining: Obsidian
Sand digging: Topaz
Clay digging: Amethyst
Herb gathering: Sapphire
Fishing: Sapphire
Woolcutting: Amethyst
Woodcutting: Emerald (Thanks Caswir for pointing out this one. I overlooked it.)
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:31 am
by Alyssa El'anir
ltgmkay wrote:
Milking: Topaz
That's... Disturbing.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:15 am
by GolfLima
ltgmkay wrote:Woolcutting: Amethyst
has this changed?
last time i got an magical gem it was an emerald
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:48 am
by Caswir
Woodcutting is emerald
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 5:19 pm
by CJK
GolfLima wrote:ltgmkay wrote:Woolcutting: Amethyst
has this changed?
last time i got an magical gem it was an emerald
I just pulled it straight from the scripts. Not sure if this is the way it had been or not.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 6:51 pm
by Mephistopheles
Metagaming, they trade with friends to make each others groups or organizations stronger. Not everyone does this, but that is how a lot of gem trading is worked out.
Try events like trainings and such. People are usually willing to trade then.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:12 pm
by LucyP
Mephistopheles wrote:Metagaming, they trade with friends to make each others groups or organizations stronger. Not everyone does this, but that is how a lot of gem trading is worked out.
Try events like trainings and such. People are usually willing to trade then.
aka: game stagnation, leading to new POs not being happy because new characters can't succeed at a reasonable pace or at all. As I said, it isn't even like Qoa is looking for large magic gems, just level 2. It's ridiculous. Truly. Everyone says they don't need what she has and nobody cares about Qoa's needs.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:16 pm
by Fooser
That's the reality we live in when a tiny portion of players control a large portion of game functionality.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:18 pm
by LucyP
Fooser wrote:That's the reality we live in when a tiny portion of players control a large portion of game functionality.
And does this go back to number of player issue or is there a way to fix this problem?
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:20 pm
by Q-wert
Pro tip regarding gems: Change Settlements
Suddenly there will be way more people wanting to trade with you than you have gems for. Although your character preferring trade with those close to her will be shunned as metagaming by some American clique elitists. I myself consider it rather in character to be careful who to arm with powerful magical stones, so maybe befriending some foreigners might be a good first step if changing Realm is too extreme?
I know I am repeating myself, but: As of now, there are simply too few Cadomyrian and Runewickian stones to go around, due to a population imbalance caused by a number of reasons discussed in this thread. In the end the complained result is the intended balancing mechanism of the gem system: Those playing in underpopulated settlements are rewarded.
Pro tip regarding game functionality: Become a developer.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:40 pm
by CJK
Q-wert wrote:
Pro tip regarding game functionality: Become a developer.
There's always space for more volunteers!
Also, seriously, if people ever feel "in the dark" about the actual mechanics of game functionality and feel like more experienced players or people who "can read scripts" have an unfair advantage over them, shoot me a PM. I'm always very happy to explain anything I can about the system.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:51 pm
by Fooser
LucyP wrote:Fooser wrote:That's the reality we live in when a tiny portion of players control a large portion of game functionality.
And does this go back to number of player issue or is there a way to fix this problem?
Also consider that not too long ago they added gem socketing to armor which increased demand while supply remained the same. Gemming went from 1 slot to 7 slots overnight. That makes this a period of hording and could take some time to balance out.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:00 pm
by Mephistopheles
^indeed
My char prefers to get charismatic people to do the trading for him, it doesn't get much but it takes time to get gem sets, I've had my char for over a year to gather the amount he has now, even passing on sets to closely knit chars involved with mine. Also he's deemed as an unsavory type to the people he needs to trade with, so trading through a middleman is kind of necessary.
Building a new illarion char to meet your end goal takes time no matter what the destination is. Be it warrior or craftter or in between.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:48 pm
by Jupiter
The gem system was designed to keep you busy for forever. That is intended. Just wait until some crazy lizard donates again 1000 gold coins in Cadomyr or when tne Runewickians have a secret big donation month (It's secret, so shhh). Then you will have chances to trade. Don't judge this after some weeks. Month, years are the more appropriate time span.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:23 pm
by LucyP
So is obtaining a level 2 gem set after 5 in game months of trying unrealistic for a new character? Having only 2 of the stones, those of her city, is very demotivating. Ready to stop playing all together.
And what does this say to Illarion's chances to build it's player base?
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:49 pm
by Evie
For the record, Galmair is not the most populated because of Developer favoritism it is because of how the town is run. The other two towns are controlled by small select groups. Most Galmarians actually moved from one or the other two towns because of political , in-game and in-character reasons.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:14 pm
by CJK
LucyP wrote:So is obtaining a level 2 gem set after 5 in game months of trying unrealistic for a new character? Having only 2 of the stones, those of her city, is very demotivating. Ready to stop playing all together.
And what does this say to Illarion's chances to build it's player base?
What is Qoa's rank in Galmair? Also, does she have what seems to be a significant amount of gold?
The tax system will give out very few gems if you are low in rank and/or have very little money to be taxed. This prevented my main from ever really acquiring a lot of gems just because I wasn't interested in the ranks.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:29 pm
by Fooser
Proposals to try to alleviate perceived issues:
-Lower the amount of faction needed for each rank by a mild amount
-Have a percentage chance (33%?) that a person can get a gem color not of their town each tax day
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:47 pm
by LucyP
ltgmkay wrote:LucyP wrote:So is obtaining a level 2 gem set after 5 in game months of trying unrealistic for a new character? Having only 2 of the stones, those of her city, is very demotivating. Ready to stop playing all together.
And what does this say to Illarion's chances to build it's player base?
What is Qoa's rank in Galmair? Also, does she have what seems to be a significant amount of gold?
The tax system will give out very few gems if you are low in rank and/or have very little money to be taxed. This prevented my main from ever really acquiring a lot of gems just because I wasn't interested in the ranks.
Don't see how it matters. Not her own town's gems she needs and she can't find anyone to trade her own town's gems with to get the others. This is the issue I have been trying to discuss here.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:51 pm
by LucyP
Fooser wrote:Proposals to try to alleviate perceived issues:
-Lower the amount of faction needed for each rank by a mild amount
-Have a percentage chance (33%?) that a person can get a gem color not of their town each tax day
I don't see rank as being an issue.
I was thinking the magical gem NPCs could just trade gem for gem. Perhaps even limit the number of trades allowed per month or something. But some form of incentive is needed to help our newer POs as right now, it is just too dang much work and, quite frankly, not worth the effort. If a few are going to hold all the power and control of some gems, which are needed, with no way for everyone to access, then there is no way to play. End of game.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 11:53 pm
by Fooser
LucyP wrote:Fooser wrote:Proposals to try to alleviate perceived issues:
-Lower the amount of faction needed for each rank by a mild amount
-Have a percentage chance (33%?) that a person can get a gem color not of their town each tax day
I don't see rank as being an issue.
I was thinking the magical gem NPCs could just trade gem for gem. Perhaps even limit the number of trades allowed per month or something. But some form of incentive is needed to help our newer POs as right now, it is just too dang much work and, quite frankly, not worth the effort. If a few are going to hold all the power and control of some gems, which are needed, with no way for everyone to access, then there is no way to play. End of game.
The two would have to be done together. More rank = more gem output. Then there'd be a chance added on top of that for them to be of a different type than just the usual 2 of a certain town.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 12:07 am
by CJK
- Nobody needs gems to do anything. They just give a boost to your weapons and armor. The weapon boost isn't even very big at all. Until higher levels, these probably will make no difference for Qoa. I ran my main, Jon, for months before completing a gem set. It was fine.
- The purpose of splitting gems up is to balance towns and to encourage trade. What has Qoa done to attempt to trade these gems? Forum threads? Seeking out crafters who don't need theirs and might trade them for gold? Attending meeting days in Cado/Runewick and asking to trade?
- Letting players exchange gems with an NPC kind of kills the balance. It actually would make Galmair OP.
- If Galmair gems have a high market quantity and Runewick gems have a very low one, then the Runewick gems are inherently more valuable by supply and demand. You can't try to trade at a 1:1 ratio there, so you need more of your own town's gems to get what you want. Which would require gold and rank.
- Changing major parts of important game mechanics (gem distribution is a big deal) to suit temporary in game situations is not really worth developer time. We would have to keep adjusting these things all the time, and ultimately may never address the underlying issue. Also, people only have so much time to give.
Re: Galmair is op: A Rant on Developer Favouritism
Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 12:11 am
by Vern Kron
LucyP wrote:Fooser wrote:Proposals to try to alleviate perceived issues:
-Lower the amount of faction needed for each rank by a mild amount
-Have a percentage chance (33%?) that a person can get a gem color not of their town each tax day
I don't see rank as being an issue.
I was thinking the magical gem NPCs could just trade gem for gem. Perhaps even limit the number of trades allowed per month or something. But some form of incentive is needed to help our newer POs as right now, it is just too dang much work and, quite frankly, not worth the effort. If a few are going to hold all the power and control of some gems, which are needed, with no way for everyone to access, then there is no way to play. End of game.
As it currently stands, you actually don't need gems in any way to play the game. Like, at all. Gems are 'bonus'. I am not currently aware of Qoa's status when it comes to fighting skills, or defensive skills, but unless she is slated for high end combat skills and attributes, the endeavor still won't make her the top of the class. Gems are more of an important deal when your character has reached a point that they cannot progress in other ways.
If you want to make your characters goal to have a full set of rank 2 gems, that is fine. Realize that this is not something that will be done in a matter of weeks. And I know you are making the claim that 'my character has been around for IG months' but in reality that isn't much time at all. In comparison, the skill system is about the same as most mmo's although they require sheer time IG rather than the typical grinding one may expect. The fighting equipment in game, if we are honest, most people can get to the point that they have access to most end-tier goods, within their first few days of playing. They become friendly with the right person, and the job is done. Should it be that way? No. But is it? Yes.
Gems are the way in which power differences occur. When you start out, you don't get many gems. If you don't actively work to improve your rank in the town, you do not get as many gems. If you don't have much money to go into the taxes, you don't get many gems.
Gems are not only a bonus to your equipment, but to an extent, it can also be shown how involved and dedicated that character has been and the connections made. I have played for a year in the new game: I have come across ONE, count it, ONE magical ruby. However, other gems are more plentiful for my character. Your character simply does not have the resources, or time, or the rank, to have gathered these bonus points yet. As you move through the game, more opportunities arise.
People generally trade with characters they trust and think 'if I give this person a gem, will this come back to haunt me later?' If that answer is yes, for any reason, then they will be rejected in the trade offer.