Illarion.org

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:06 am**

Jason Felarion wrote:
Estralis Seborian wrote: 9. Rücksichtnahme
Es ist nicht erlaubt, nicht-jugendfreie Handlungen auszuspielen. Dies schließt Pornographie, sehr grobe/sexistische/beleidigende Sprache und übertriebene, blutrünstige oder verstörende Gewalttaten mit ein.

10. Player killing
Der Kampf Charakter gegen Charakter ist ausdrücklich erlaubt und ist als Bestandteil des kooperativen Rollenspiels zu sehen.
Sind Kämpfe, somit Gewalttaten laut Definition für "unbeteiligte Beteiligte" nicht immer verstörend?
Widerspruch!

"Verstörende Gewalttaten" wären Dinge wie Kopf ab und im Hals buddeln oder Ohr ab und es aufessen, ich denke, man kann sich da was darunter vorstellen.

@the other questions (especially the cyber-question):
Yes, wait until the staff is back, most are on the RL-meeting

Until then try around a little and you will see what feedback you get if one of the remaining GMs (me for example) is watching .
I think I can ensure you that you won't be banned immediately..

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:06 am**

It is veeeeery simple:

It is just forbidden to play it on the serer (and forum of course

) So you can play your p0rn via MSN/IRC etc.

It is still an IG happening but not on the server.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:13 am**

Zak wrote: I think I can ensure you that you won't be banned immediately..

Yeah, only after the general climax-ation.

*j0kes.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:19 am**

Jupiter wrote::roll: It is veeeeery simple:

It is just forbidden to play it on the serer (and forum of course :P ) So you can play your p0rn via MSN/IRC etc.

It is still an IG happening but not on the server.

while i do like this idea it does make it impossible for me to interupt them... i get great joy from spewing my " though shalt not engage in this with out marrage!" garbage.. and besides... what?? they would stand the in silence for a hour??

i say " in the WOODS it's all goods! in town gets a frown!"

any who now i shall sit and wait for gm responses to clarify some specifics on thes new rules..

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:22 am**

Zak wrote: "Verstörende Gewalttaten" wären Dinge wie Kopf ab und im Hals buddeln oder Ohr ab und es aufessen, ich denke, man kann sich da was darunter vorstellen.

dann wär dat ja schonmal geklärt. *thumbs up*

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:31 am**

I agree with Jewls.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:47 am**

The Returner wrote:
Estralis Seborian wrote: 2. Gamemaster
If a GM asks you for informations, you cannot refuse to testify.
The gamemaster should prove he/she is a gamemaster before asking for information. This rule could be used by anyone to gain any kind of knowledge if they say I AM A GAMEMASTER YOU HAVE TO GIVE ME _______

There are three ways of contacting players (I use only those actually):
- we send you a message IG that only you can read (it is distinguishable from the things being said by other normal chars as Faladron described it)
- we teleport you to the GM-castle (that should convince you as no other chars are simply given that power)
- or we send a PM via the Forum but then you can just check whether the Account the PM came from has this little "Gamemaster" on its profile

So..yes, as Faladron pointed out. It is hard to be tricked by someone pretending to be GM if you look closely.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:52 am**

I have been approached by a GM that simply used OOC to speak to me. I had to suggest that it might be better to send a PM actually and the GM chose not to. If it happened once to me, chances are....

And to restate the necessity of clarifying the "no pornography" rule... If it's not clear, the players will get hysterical. As you can see. I think it's best if it's spelled out plainly.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:00 am**

I basically agree with Julius.

The greatest appeal of the game comes from the freedom of roleplaying and not from the technical side. I find it somewhat ironic, that as the game progresses technically the staff sees it necessary to start limiting the freedom of roleplaying..

In a game where "pvp is explicitly allowed", one must really roll eyes at the moral justification to be outraged or concerned about "textual sinning". It is not a sanctuary. It's a game where you can kill people. As long as the normal consent of players involved is present (as in general with the cooperative roleplay) and the roleplay itself doesn't disturb other people, I am astonished by the mere notion that someone is upset enough to suggest banning such actions. Rather uptight, really.

If the staff has too much time on it's collective hands to start monitoring player behaviour to the point of "you can kiss, but not with tongue", then I humbly suggest you start actively running quests instead of playing nannies.

Thank you.

PS.

Furthermore, the phrasing of the rules is still rather ambiguous. The room for interpretation basically gives a green light to the staff member with the tightest and most uncomortable lederhosens to throw her weight around at will.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:04 am**

Retlak wrote:Strong language = the F*** word and the C*** word. I assume you can still go around saying "shit" in times of need.

That's pretty much right.
It includes all words or ways of insults that might make the Player behind the char feel uncomfortable (c***-sucker, nerd and other modern things, etc).
Let the insults sound ..uhm..old-style or intelligent instead of just cursing and tossing around bad words. I am no natural english-speaker but I think you all know how to express anger and dislike without sounding like a primitive (orcs are allowed to say more blunt things, yes).

I have been approached by a GM that simply used OOC to speak to me. I had to suggest that it might be better to send a PM actually and the GM chose not to. If it happened once to me, chances are....

You are always free to ask for something that proves the identity. If the person who pretends to be GM does not prove it, log out and send a PM to someone whom you know to be a GM for sure but always note down the Char-ID.

And to restate the necessity of clarifying the "no pornography" rule... If it's not clear, the players will get hysterical. As you can see. I think it's best if it's spelled out plainly.

Oh well, to keep the panic low then I say you all can just do whatever you used to do until all the staffies are back.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:11 am**

Make Illa 18+ and BRING BACK SEX

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:38 am**

Really... Really really? I thought the cybering thing was a no duh. You go hide in a place and use whisper #me's. Cussing, well, I'd avoid the f-word and the c word, but really? We aren't in kindergarten, language is language.

I don't mind keeping things PG-13 ig when out in public, but really... The rp in this game has slowly been going down hill, do you have to go and make it worse?

I joined Illarion because I had the freedom to practically do anything, not so true in other games. I understand that this isn't a democracy, but a dictatorship. But unlike a dictatorship in a country, we can leave. Are you intending to start listening to your people yet or is this just gonna get worse?

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:19 am**

Couples unite! Fight the prudeness of the staff!

Ps: Ayla, meet me ig

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:08 am**

Sundo Raca wrote:I think people are getting a little too worked up. Lets wait for a gm to address the questions before this topic becomes a spamy mess.

/signed

Is it possible to lock the thread currently until the staff is back and someone could answer the open questions?

I really don't want to see this turning into a spam thread or flamewar...

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:19 am**

Ylara Dervan wrote:Is it possible to lock the thread currently until the staff is back and someone could answer the open questions?

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:22 am**

ok...To lock a thread is much less work than answer all this questions and is done in some minutes.
They might have the possibility to do so.

Believe me, I was aware what I was writing.

And btw: it was only sugestion...

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:23 am**

well, concerning the cybering thingy - as i'm a little old fashioned (meaning that i prefer real persons and not inflated rubber or electrons), i have never "played out" a sexual act in a game.
but where are the borderlines between "cybering" and a "little erotic tension" during roleplay?
what is offending (and to whom)?
bad language - apart from modern "effing male-chicken intakers" and the like, where is the border?
somebody mentioned, orcs might be allowed to be more direct. well should be barbarians and mercenaries be allowed to be more direct as well?
and the other way round, should elfes and mages (as being highly educated chars) be banned for saying a simple "Shit!"?
some of us POs would be able, to make their chars curse in perfectly medieval terms. (and our forefathers have been pretty insultive too, more so, than modern man commonly knows from history schoolbooks. i just want to call to mind the famous Götz von Berlichingen)
so who will decide, if an insult was "fitting" in the Illa world, or if it was too modern?

a wise man wrote some thousand years ago, "never make a law, you will not be able to uphold completely."

i think the rules, as given here, will not further the game.

korm

ps: and if there are rumours about a massacre in the nordmark, don't blame the temple.
it will be just me, killing off all the nieces and nephews of my mainchar...

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:00 pm**

I already answered the language thing.

Terms like "shit" and all others that can be at least considered slightly medieval or "old" are totally allowed.
Of course a randomly cursing elf could be considered bad RP but that is the choice of the player. (Barbarians curse, too, yes and so do people hitting their thumb with a hammer or someone who has just a cramp in the buttock but I am not going to list up all those examples now, sorry)

What we don't want is..*repeats*

...insults that might make the Player behind the char feel uncomfortable (c***-sucker, nerd and other modern things, etc).

Char1: Hello!
Char2: F*** off, dude, your momma sucks d***s
Char1: ((*sob*))

Concerning your question "who" will decide what can be considered "fitting":
There are people who are more sensitive than others and people who are tougher but there should be a common base of understanding on that.
If someone say "smile off" most immediately think "Oh, that is a Newbie", if somebody instead says "Get lost, bugger!" you rather think it is a grumpyly rped char wanting his peace.
(And in case that a player feels horribly insulted you can always clear up things with a short OOC-note or PM)

Now... don't be too worried just because there are some new rules, your questions are welcomed of course but don't be panic/ironic or annoyed, that is just not helping.
Until everything unclear was explained/corrected by the staff you can play on as you always did (stated that somewhere above already).

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:00 pm**

Although some new rules are still a bit vague (resp. some of the explanations here should be implemented in the rules pages), it is not that much limiting:

It is not allowed to play scenes, not suitable for minors on Illarion. This covers pornography, very strong/sexual/offensive language, and very strong/gore/disturbing violence.

I guess Illa is still meant for 16+, so there is enough space for your RP. So just no hardcore f**king or torture splattering - but who wants that anyway?!

In e.g. German TV you can show a lot of nudity and say a lot of insults during afternoon (!), which is in the USA impossible.

PS: The rule that two own characters are forbidden to know (= hearing from) each other, is a bit unrealistic.

PPS: I also think that the PG-capping is good, but does not really fit to the actual skilling mechanisms IG.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:29 pm**

Miklorius wrote:
It is not allowed to play scenes, not suitable for minors on Illarion. This covers pornography, very strong/sexual/offensive language, and very strong/gore/disturbing violence.
I guess Illa is still meant for 16+, so there is enough space for your RP. So just no hardcore f**king or torture splattering - but who wants that anyway?!
You would be surprised.. but yes, there might be exceptions on what kinds of cyber are allowed (I don't promise anything though)

PS: The rule that two own characters are forbidden to know (= hearing from) each other, is a bit unrealistic.
"Know" like knowing each other personally. You can be told about your one char while you are on with another but you should not claim that those two chars of yours talked and also you should not advertise your crafter with your fighter.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:45 pm**

PS: The rule that two own characters are forbidden to know (= hearing from) each other, is a bit unrealistic.
"Know" like knowing each other personally. You can be told about your one char while you are on with another but you should not claim that those two chars of yours talked and also you should not advertise your crafter with your fighter.

*exception for GM chars. Aye?

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:25 pm**

Taeryon Silverlight wrote:I appreciate those rules, but please tell me:

Why is a warrior allowed to run around in the crypt for hours and hours, slashing monsters while a mage may not rp to sit at the shore and throw fireballs out to the ocean?

There is no other way then to use spells stupidly often to gain skill. You can't achieve anything as a mage enginewise without powergaming.

THIS ^.

I sent a PM to a GM and they never answered.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:50 pm**

Fooser wrote:Make Illa 18+ and BRING BACK SEX

if you want to cyber, do it in aim, where everyone else is a 50 year old man pretending to be a 18 year old woman or a 12 year old boy pretending to be a 18 year old man.

MMORPG's are not brothels. Honestly, do you feel a need to cyber between hobbits, elfs, and....good lord, orcs and dwarves?

Keep it away pls.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 2:57 pm**

WHATS WRONG WITH ORC SEX????

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:09 pm**

maybe, it's viewed as sodomitic?

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:40 pm**

pharse wrote:
PS: The rule that two own characters are forbidden to know (= hearing from) each other, is a bit unrealistic.
"Know" like knowing each other personally. You can be told about your one char while you are on with another but you should not claim that those two chars of yours talked and also you should not advertise your crafter with your fighter.
*exception for GM chars. Aye?

Dunno what you mean, be more precise.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:20 pm**

Like...quests and such.

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:28 pm**

Uhm..well..if a GM allows you to log on two chars at once due to a quest I guess that is allowed, yes..but that usually does not happen that often (it is the GM who logs on several chars mostly).

And if you choose to join a Quest with one char you shouldn't join it with another one of yours, at least that is my opinion.

Still not exactly sure how your point fits to my explanation of the rule but maybe one of my statements was a satisfying answer

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:50 pm**

let me give an example

most people who speek english and hang around in trollsbane know Olive

therefore if i have another char who hangs around in trollsbane they would have to be severely mentally retarded to not know olive's existance. but according to the rules AS WRITTEN that is exactly what is expected

Posted: **Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:56 pm**

Well, then I it will be changed a little to point it out properly as soon as someone with access to the homepage is available again.

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