The magic monopol

Arameh · Post by **Arameh** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 6:57 pm

for Taylor i would understand,11 is too young to be able to cast magic if you want to cast magic stop acting as 16 with your 11 old character and make a 16 yeard old character,thats my advice.For the Archmages,i personally dont like that,for example:the day magic came i didnt even know there were magic and i get carbonised by characters i had never seen before in 1 second.Magic is also really mean for fighters cause in one months when there will be half everone casting magic and warriors that cant learn magic resistance since there is no magic casting monsters for now will all be useless since even Salathe character get killed as easily as a complete newb by magic,and no real way to learn magic resistance,so everyone will be learning magic and most other jobs will go down and all,thats my advice.

Pendar · Post by **Pendar** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:07 pm

Magic is really hard to skill up, so i would be lucky if i could tickle you with magic for some months.
On the old server my character had no resistance and i could still stand inside an ice flame and kill many mages. It was only the very skilled ones that were extremely dangerous.
The mage who casted on you was propably as good or better than most mages will ever get to be

Brian

Moathia · Post by **Moathia** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:10 pm

It was Tyrus who belw him up.

Poots · Post by **Poots** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:28 pm

I'll just say that you should all calm down. about the thing with people like jeremy having to learn magick again, they can't just raise his skills to a master since that's what he's rping now can they? anyone can be a magick master before, just rp it. there were tons of people who did it and pretendeed they were really good. pretty soon you will all learn magick so stop complaining your not the top magick master any more. sorry to the gm's for al the complaints. although I am curious as to how strong peopple are with magick. I would hate for new magick people to kill all the warriors and take over, but I'm sure it will all work out.....eventually

Arameh · Post by **Arameh** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:29 pm

but also in crowded places peoples could cast attack spells on other and we wont know who casted them,can we know?

Poots · Post by **Poots** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:34 pm

I say we all sit back and see how it turns out

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:40 pm

It doesn't give Varshikar an advantage if there are more than one or two sources for this, but there is only one.

And I still don't see how this is so great for RP over other methods?

Pendar · Post by **Pendar** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:42 pm

Yes you know who casted a spell...
Magic is intially weak and as an old warrior there are about 4 ways to kill the best mage.
Easiest being three friends and you know one of you will live

Rinya · Post by **Rinya** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 7:43 pm

Arameh_ wrote:but also in crowded places peoples could cast attack spells on other and we wont know who casted them,can we know?

Actually, many spells now have "tracing lines," as I call them. Or at least that's how they are on the upcoming java client from what I see. For example, a mage casts a fireball spell at someone, in the middle of a group. Instead of just a fireball appearing on the victim (as how it was on the older clients), you will see the spell rush/fly out from the magic caster in a chain of smaller graphics until it hits the target area.

Reassured?

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:03 pm

Athian is intelligent and smart enough to learn book wise, but firstly they aren't even teaching him anything he doesn't know.

That is a good joke, Athian. The char athian has exactly average intelligence and just slightly above average willpower. he is NOT super smart, he is as smart and intelligent as the usual man. He is NOT smart enough to learn magic on his own without any help from others. If you play Athian as a more than smart character you are playing him out of the chars possibilitys.

The char athian has the magical abilitys of an average man with a bit stronger will than others.

Faladron · Post by **Faladron** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:03 pm

Fooser wrote:It doesn't give Varshikar an advantage if there are more than one or two sources for this, but there is only one.

Actualy, what would've spoken against a monopoly of Varshikar upon magic? That'd have sorted out the problem of Trollsbane being the center of attention and would've created a nice counterpart to the city of craftsmen and trade, a city of mages and scholary but no, instead we introduce a new academy of mages, which will most likely be settled up in or around Trollsbane, centering even more roleplay around this single city, with no alternatives to go.

Furthermore this academy will not prevent people from playing "Happy-go-lucky" sword wielding armored master smith cross-over tailors who think "Hey, I want to light my campfire without matches, therefore I have to become a magician now". It's solely the decision of every player himself how he plays his character, and I do believe the majority of this comunity would've been mature enough to handle a different start of magic in a way, that wouldn't turn everyone into an apprentice mage in the first days after the introduction of it.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:09 pm

Faladron, having Varshikar as the centre of magery is even worse than having a neutral guild as the centre. varshikar just teaches to its citizens, varshikar is not neutral. having it in varshikar would mean really to block for many chaars the chance to become a mage. and to be honest, varshikar has a bad reputation as a place for criminals and chars whose rp is a bit out of range. it would be no good place for the only magic resource.

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:22 pm

I actually like this system a lot. As many characters would simply have magic, they would roleplay horribly and abuse it. This way, those who need roleplay lessons can get them along with school of magic lessons. In the old system a big problem was everyone who wanted to know magic could be taught it for a reasonable fee, there was no roleplay involved where you had to prove your character was intelligent and responsible enough to learn them.
Granted, it would have been a bit better if the people involved with the new magic system had gone to certain characters who roleplay well and who say their characters are trying to solve the magic issue and thereby used existing characters to solve a problem instead of introducing new characters for this. But still, it seems enjoyable, I think it will be funny, Maliss, Garett, Isilwen, Athian etc in a classroom together. Hilarity will ensue no doubt, and cliques will be formed, and of course DRAMA.

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:27 pm

He is right.

Athian · Post by **Athian** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 9:40 pm

no it's Samantha and Athian, where true comedy is. perhaps another school or something like that also gm run but with different teachers and methods. what people really want here is choice, they feel that they don't have any choice, as i do as well and so it'd be nice to have a possible solution for that in the near future, or yes we can just wait it out for awhile and then quit school and start teaching other people. (and hope the super powerful archmages don't beat us up, for it).

Cliu Beothach · Post by **Cliu Beothach** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:24 pm

I enjoy this idea very much. This will atleast get things started up. Centralizing a skill will, as people already have said, create drama. It opens up vast amounts of oppurtunity for roleplay. The fact that they have branched out to so many classes (especially Theoretical magic) gives it more substance. It isn't just about the runes now, it is about background and theory, giving us knowledge to expand our roleplay and possibly find new ways.

Pocal · Post by **Pocal** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:49 pm

When I heard that magic was back I was exstatic, but upon realizing that it was monopolized, I was a little disheartened. The VMA has kept up the idea that its members can still do some magic/have the knowledge (Athian burning stuff, Jeremy asking for ppl to do magical research, etc) and it does hinder their RP of maintaining a little bit of magic or whatever.

But I do feel that the Academy, once it teaches enough students, can be on its way (or stay around, maybe PC run as an additional source of magic teaching) and for now is a great way to RP the re-introduction of magic.

Athian · Post by **Athian** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:51 pm

things VMA members could still do were always mere parlor tricks compared to the technical magic in the game so small in fact that they didn't really exist

. but Ath was never part of the VMA anyway.

Nop · Post by **Nop** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 11:49 pm

@Faladron:
There have been many reasons named in this topic not to join the academy but rather wait.
How do you conclude that just because you learned your spells in one place, you will stop thinking on your own?
Also, who said that the academy would teach ALL spells to all students? Did you ever think about it that there might still be rune combinations to be found that they don't teach or talk about for some reason?

What speaks against the VMA is obvious: As it is also used as a means to force people into citizenship, it is very good that it did not get the monopoly on runes. The magic academy at least is about magic, not politics.

@Taylor:
Let me rephrase it: "Every able character is admitted." I agree that those rejections have valid reason. Face it: You can't play a child character and demand all the privileges of an adult character. The game is too lenient on that already and the resul is bad enough with the fearless dragon-slaying children we have. In fact, I'd see much more sense in rejecting all child characters from the adult classes and have them apprentice themselves to a master first - once we have them again.

@Arameh
Of course, magic must be balanced against all other things in the game. You haven't seen a single player-cast spell yet, how can you make the conlusion it is unbalanced?
Oh, and brawling with a GM character tends to be unhealthy, with or without magic.

In the new client/server there are indications in combat as to who did what, so you can tell who cast a spell, shot a bow etc. No more mystery attacks.

Athian · Post by **Athian** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:11 am

yea Nop figured out our evil plan. i don't think people meant the VMA as an end all but they just meant other groups of teachers. basically we all have to sit through painfully redundant and rediclous lessons (come on sheep? what was that?). and then run the archmages of the isle for all there hard work and Dedication, though Mistress De Cyr can stay, i think she's far cooler then those two old men.

As to Taylor, who i agreed to teach how to be a warlock, and i don't want people to get me wrong here. I'ts not a process i would do over a short period of time. as to any child characters learning magic, you'll have to learn it second hand and it'll probably be just as difficult (via a good rp), but at least you won't have crabby old people putting you down.

and @ Arameh: i heard about the human candle incident. good thing it happened to you before i went and picked a fight with one of them.

Deinarious · Post by **Deinarious** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 5:14 am

I haven't been around as long as most of you, and this is the only active magick system I've known. Personally, it seems interesting.

However, I would like to know if Emily Thorowitz is capable of learning magick stat-wise. If not, would it be possible for me to re-create her? or would that be against the rules? I would like it to be told to me via a PM, so if there's any bad news only I would hear it.

Pocal · Post by **Pocal** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 5:45 am

Or, like everyone else, find out IG whether IG you can learn magic or not. Its not OOG info to be known whether a CHARACTER can learn magic. You should find out through ROLEPLAYING.

Deinarious · Post by **Deinarious** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:33 am

First of all, thank you for telling me that, but you don't have to yell. I'll find out ingame. Soon.

martin · Post by **martin** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 8:55 am

Is this just a joke or is this thread for real?

I mean... what are you complaining about next? That grass is green and water is blue? About swords having a blade?

Take it as it is. This is the way Illarion works. It's like that, period.

I saw not a single valid point speaking against this system. I see a lot of stupid comments, making me believe that people playing mages are usually not capable of understanding and playing roleplaying games, which disappoints me, because I tend to play mages myself.

Yes, there's a monopoly. There is a smithing monopoly for dwarves. Wow. Deal with it!

You see, if everything falls into your arms, it's not called roleplaying but novel writing. It is a game, and a game always makes it hard to achieve things, otherwise it wouldn't be a game. If you automatically win chess, would it be a game? No. It's difficult to win (dependend on your opponent). Would counterstrike be a game if you do nothing and win? No, it's called a violent movie then.

So, this might be a difficult situation for your character, PLAY WITH IT.

Martin, trying not to flame

Nalzaxx · Post by **Nalzaxx** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 11:36 am

Well, I for one would like to say a massive THANK YOU to you Martin aswell as the team that implemented it and the archmages who are willing to teach it, (I believe Brian is one of them)

I have long attempted (unsuccessfully) to create an island wide academy that focused on all areas of the magical system as Im sure Martin and Jeremy can testify.

Im eagerly looking forward to get Nalzaxx into the academy and start learning some things.

My only qwibble would be that you don't teach ENOUGH extra magical disciplines. I for one would like to see divination and transformation aswell as sympathetic magic like shamanism taught to some degree. But I understand the academy currently only has 3 teachers. So given the chance I would donate my efforts to teaching these (once I have achieved the correct grade)

So once again thankyou to the players and staff that have made my illarionite dream possible.

Tyrus · Post by **Tyrus** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 11:40 am

Nalzaxx wrote:(I believe Brian is one of them)

The archmages are all played by German players, who are able to speak both, German and English, so we can translate everything.

Oh: And check the academy message board. Nalzaxx was taken.

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:12 pm

martin wrote: Yes, there's a monopoly. There is a smithing monopoly for dwarves. Wow. Deal with it!

Is there?

martin wrote: Take it as it is. This is the way Illarion works. It's like that, period.

Yes, that's just the way it is. What need is there for testers then?

Galim · Post by **Galim** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:32 pm

I asked me the same o_O

martin · Post by **martin** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 3:08 pm

The testers are elements of what we call "out of character", the real world.

The magic is element of the in game world. You both mixed them up.

The in game world, the game world, call it as you want, is like it is. If trees were blue, well let them be blue and deal with it.
If dragons are tiny and ants were huge, well, then it's like that. Learn to deal with it.

Martin

Fooser · Post by **Fooser** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 3:12 pm

Yes, but RP methods, RP restrictions, and RP in general is in a way "tested" also