Illarion.org

The hassle is this argument. Their will be no need for a good rped reason that everyone is trying to come up with.

Technically speaking, all of our time in every little moment we spend on Illarion is a waste of time. It actually takes up time from lives we are *supposed* to be living, but not to mention the fact that..... why is it a waste if things such as the individual cities aren't actually there to build up to something ultimate?

The settlements of Trollsbane, Varshikar, and Greenbriar are there because of present-time RP. There is really no larger scheme RP that is requiring us to have these settlements. They're present-time RP just as walking down the virtual street, seeing virtual character friends, and virtually waving are in the RP world, only just a bit lengthened.

Schmick-schmacking new towns up after the server wipe doesn't seem any different from how we would have schmick-schmacked more towns up on pre-server-wipe time eventually anyway.

Glaze over the OOC interferences. Come on. You all can do it. It's the same concept: If you are truly a good roleplayer, then you will still RP your char as some other character's Bestest Buddy in the Whole Damn World if that's the way they've always been -- Even if you are seriously ready to hold a gun up to his player's head and fire.

You can do it. It's a lot of OOC, but you can do it.

Actually, I didn't say that it is too late to change "anything;" more like, it's too late to change the map around completely without a serious risk to the map editors' collective mental health.

I don't mind if you change everything, as long as you can come up with an excuse for the reason why the map remains with cities placed roughly where they were before.

I personally don't want to play my old characters, at least not as though all things remain the same. If we restarted history, I might be interested in replaying an old character from his beginnings, but I doubt that is the plan that you will go with.

Like I've already said, however, the choice is yours. Wether you make that choice collectively or individually, is also your choice. One warning: if you don't make a choice collectively and in mass, yet the most of you believe there should be some explanation for what's missing, the choice might be taken out of your hands.

Make your choice, and fast, while you still can.

Aegohl

I still suggest a time lapse of 10 years. I think it would work out well for a new generation of characters where as the old will still exist but the sons and daughters of these persons and new prominant figures can rise from the ashes. The ten year period can be filled in quite easily through flashbacks and the such. Everyone can devise what their characters have done during that time for those who want to keep their old ones. But remember, even the best in these times wear down and wilt while new ones come to political power and the such.

Either way, I figure this is better than a massive case of amnesia from a traumatic event. Life continued on as it had so we do not have to figure out why the buildings and cities still exist in perfect condition when these dark forces came in and forced everyone to evacuate.

So the time lapse is still what I would like to see. What are all of your opinions on this?

Grunith

i wanna keep what i have going. ill start a poll.

i agree with a time lapse... i think it might be a good idea

That's what i said before. Lets have a poll and make an official dicision.

Also, is there and actual date set for the new server? I'm sure we'd all like to know in advance.

Please please please do not make a poll. I hate strife, and I think it would cause a lot of players to quit if there is a set decision. (Like the thing where old players are no longer in play etcetera). Haven't the GMs stated it many times, decide yourself? There is no harm in that.
Please?

Read what aegohl said, we have to have an agreement of the players.
I would make a poll but dont know how ..

look the entire amnesia thing is easily enough sorted out, as stated we have all lost name dat before now. Just make a point of getting your name used about time. When you meet some one you know in the forrest quick chat and oh its you I didnt recognise you for a moment. Just play over the slight difficulty of not knowing people in a few days you will have your strong social network back. The ones you have only passed the time of day with it is possible you have forgoten there names any way.
If we come to something official I will go along with it, How ever as a newer played with a character only coming into his own now. Both in my rp of him and the plots and groups with in illarion. I would be sad to see him or the plots go.
Even starting fresh wont clean things up that much unless we kill off all old characters. As people still have people they enjoy rping with, So even we pretened a new start Pendar would still be drawn to spend his time with caitlin and others. So we either kill off all characters, or continue as normal and put up with a few days confusion.
Both work, and neither are going to please everyone.
just as i see it
Brian

Aegohl wrote:Like I've already said, however, the choice is yours. Wether you make that choice collectively or individually, is also your choice. One warning: if you don't make a choice collectively and in mass, yet the most of you believe there should be some explanation for what's missing, the choice might be taken out of your hands.

'nuff said.

To not have a poll is to make a dicision.
I suggest a poll with two option in it.

Option 1: Players decide if they what to continue there character as they were, or just make new ones.
Option 2: History starts from the beggings. We are all first settlers here.

Not everyone can be happy, but a least this way the majority are.

As said, they can't be the first settlers. The cities cannot be removed. If you come up with an explanation of how those buildings are there, well, that is up to you.

At first, the staff had come to a decision that we would leave it up to all of you individually, but that has been argued against by quite a few of you. You want a collective explanation, and so, what I am saying is: Make that decision, or else it may be taken out of your hands.

That being said, I don't think a poll is the solution, because that doesn't include honest debate, questioning, or even that much thought--merely a kneejerk reaction that we've been taught to click on radio buttons and hit enter.

Aegohl

Unless you spent lots of time getting your skills up and little to nothing else, then you could consider this character wipe a disadvantage.

But you had fun in the past, and it won't be wasted. I mean, I played Mario when I was around 7 years old and don't have it anymore, so would I consider the time I spent playing the game a waste of time? No, you get something from anything, even after it's gone.

So stop crying people. Continue your fun.

Jeremy Gems Willowbrook wrote: The Island is already inhabited. It has 3 towns on it already.

The survivors move in and take over. The fact that the map is similar to the old one can be ignored. RP that you do not remember it. RP that it looks different to the old Island.
Since the map is new people will go exploring as if it was new anyway.
After a period of adjustment the old storylines can be continued if people want to. And if the characters involved are still around.
I never said the memory loss had to be total. The extent would be up to the individual. Skills, etc. are forgotten. Background, friends, history could be remembered. It would be up to the PO to decide how much or little the character remembers, or if the memory loss is permanent.
Example : Jeremy could remember names and faces...but not be able to match them up. But he remembers the personalities of the people. So when they meet he will put names and faces back together. He would also remember everything that happened in the past (old storylines and his own background) and that he was a mage and ran the VMA. Whether or not he chooses to go along those lines again would be up to him.


I dont like the idea of a big time lapse. Jeremy is supposed to be young. Plus a big time lapse is a lot of history to try to fill in. Everyone will come up with their own idea and stories...many of which could contradict.

We could just carry on as if nothing had happened. Ignore the fact that the map has changed. Ignore the fact that lots of old characters have left. Ignore the fact that nobody has any skills that they used to have.

As said, they can't be the first settlers. The cities cannot be removed. If you come up with an explanation of how those buildings are there, well, that is up to you.

Well, we can say that we have already quickly began to develop the island. I think that is simple enough.
What i mean is, that on the first day that the new server is up, it is not day one for the settlers. But just very early on for them.

Losing all my characters skills and items? Sure, why not. I can get new ones.

Losing such things as the knoweldge of the terrain and peoples names? Sure. It can be explained away and I can get it back.

Losing all my characters' friends and enemies? Bad, but I can enjoy RPing being in a new land, totally friendless.

Losing my characters personality? Very very bad. Enough to make me kick the playing-Illarion-obsessively-with-every-moment-of-my-free-time habit, quite probably. Not enough to make me quit, but enough to make me scale down to a 'once a week or so' type of character. The standard argument is 'you can make a new character with the same personality'. Sadly this is false, at least for me. My characters are defined by nurture, as is most peoples to various degrees. They have been shaped by everything that has happened to them. Anyone who has not been through the same experiences is fundamentally different. I understand that for some people's way of RPing this is different, that nature is enough, but I hope those people can understand us who enjoy watching their characters personalities develop. A memory wipe = a personality loss, and that would be irreplaceable.

Why do those in favour of a fresh start mind a suggestion, such as Jeremy's, that allows people to start fresh if they want, or continue if they don't?

Why would you have to lose your personallity? You can even have a new char altogether and still use the same personality. Even if it is decided that we start history all over again, i'm sure most of you will find the characters you rp'd with before and rp similarily like you did before.

Suggestions like these would not even have to be played out in the game, if we can all agree on them.

Idea #1) Inspired by Dyluck on the other thread, I thought his idea was particularily good among the ones I've read so far. Climactic end conflict carried out against a villain like Drahken Vorkalion (so we could finally take that chump seriously, har). Post-wipe situation, characters that are continued have suffered from the final conflict, that explains their skill-loss.

Idea #2) Climactic end battle between player character fractions, resulting in the same post-wipe situation as Idea #1. Might however require some Deus Ex Machinas for the political figures to pull off the mayhem smoothly before the wipe.

Idea #3) Plague, catastrophe, calamity; something hits the folk of the island so that the characters being continued have an explanation why they've lost their name.dat's, skills, ego, whatever. I like #3 the least, it sounds like a Deus Ex Machina itself.

Idea #4) A timestretch we agree on that is left open in between pre-wipe and post-wipe settings. Apparently some people might not like their characters having gotten older. Also arguable is what will have happened in the time stretch leading to contradictions, but if I look at existing characters' background, this wouldn't be anything new (e.g. players simply inventing locations that are not in canon with Moonsilver and GMs). Nevertheless, I still like this idea because it was cried over oftenly in the past that the elves have no real advantage over the other races, except for their longevity (which naturally, has never come into effect). In any time-stretch from 10-100 years, the elves would still look pretty much the same, but characters from the other races would either grow venerable or downright die. And this would finally be your chance for some literary justice, long-ear-players! But seriously, even a timestretch of 1-10 years wouldn't hurt. It would help explain the map changes smoothly, old characters gone missing, things like additions from a new client down the lane, many new characters making appearances, or people playing children born from existing characters.

Right now I'm leaning towards #2 and #4 mostly.

I like idea number 1. We haven't seen Drahken in how long? He needs to get his lazy butt in gear.

Agreed Cain. Back in the Blackstone days, some people would say "yeah I fought Drahken, and he was weak because he was good at magic." A few inches from the face of evil's Right Hand, and not only did you stay there, but you swung at him? What brand of marijuana have you been smokin' chief?

If nothing else, we can simply create new characters, and say they "found" this island, already complete with edifices. The "newbies" can also say the last civilized people disappeared mysteriously, and that's that.

Something similar happened to an America colony some centuries back, I think. People discovered it, but the original inhabitants were nowhere to be found...they seemed to have just vanished.

Not everything that people don't know about is deserving of a reasonable explanation. This story hole could lead to some quests involving the "mysterious past."

Not everything that people don't know about is deserving of a reasonable explanation. This story hole could lead to some quests involving the "mysterious past."

Best idea yet, especially from some certain unsolved quests that could continue on from this old island to the other land (unless I wasnt around when they were solved).

I don't mind giving characters a chance to keep their old, if this is the decision I plan to keep one or two. I like this idea very much Bloodhearte.

I still think the easiest thing would be to start all over on a clean slate.

Also, when is this all actually going to happen? What date?

Basically this comes down to two overall decisions, not including rp.


1) Players either can continue with their characters as if they lost their skills and forgot the name-face connection, which is explainable by rp, or they can start with a new character (NOT an old one starting over).

2) A conformed decision on whether you start over with current characters or make new ones, or a mandatory timelapse, basically choice two being something that everyone must do or it can mess things up.


I personally prefer choice one, and don't see why, if you are willing to delete your character's history, that you can't make a similar new character.

From there we need rp, and from there details of thr rp, but this decision needs to be made first.

Why would you have to lose your personallity? You can even have a new char altogether and still use the same personality. Even if it is decided that we start history all over again, i'm sure most of you will find the characters you rp'd with before and rp similarily like you did before.

Because the way my character reacts to something is always for a reason, and a lot of those reasons are because of things that happened in the game to them. So, if they lose there memory they will change. A new arrival on a strange island would never react in the same way as my character does now to certain other characters. I couldn't RP similarly with the same people either, because it would be simple repetition. If I make a character like my current one and meet a character like someone elses old one we will react exactly the same as we did the first time we met. Which would just be repeating the same things. But then that would be strange, because as players we would just be going through the motions. Hmm.. I'm not being clear.

*me takes a deep breath and thinks for a moment*

Basically what I am saying is that the reason why I really, really enjoy this game is the build up, and subtle slow change, of the reactions between characters. For many players these inter-character relationships have built up and evolved over many years. To throw them away, when it is avoidable, seems crazy. I have only been playing for a couple of months, but I will never have as much time as I did when I first started playing, so I won't be able to put down the roots of such relationships with another, totally fresh character. I had no fears of the character wipe because it only affected everything apart from the inter-character reactions until people started talking about a totally fresh start instead of, bring them over if you want, or start again if you want. But I am only one player, I'm not suggesting that this view is more important than any other. Having said that I've yet to meet someone actually playing the game that hasn't said that they will take at least a single character with them, if they are allowed to.

You still don't have to throw your personallities away. Every char rp's that they have some background, before they even played. Things that would have changed your how your character acts could be rped as already happening in the past. Unless you are starting a character from the early stages of childhood.

Why was the "just say nothing happened" ever thrown out? As Jeremy said "just RP you don't remeber it" well you can just "rp that the island remained the same size" I've allways kindof thought it was supposed to be bigger anyway, to explain that forests are next to deserts and such.

I think the "epic Battle" seems like the best plan, if you dont want to play just have him A)Die fighting or b (mainly for hobbits and non fighters) just say "I cannot live with a war, blah blah blah, I'm leaving" and Bam! your char is gone.

I actually dont think its that much of a hastle to #i again.

the biggest problem with #i is NO ONE wil lrecognize each other so you need to find out who is who. But even then, there are ways.

See what I dont think some people are realizing is we could start over with a Clean slate and still keep our old characters personalties and past alive, I know that EVERYONE had some kind of rp for their char before they came to the isle. " Kincent lived here then Cloud Deathrider showed up now then he lived here here and here" "My Hobbit was on his way to see family and his boat crashed"

We could go back to that, and still have new characters and every, We could even make our characters have the exact same out come, but with different events leading to that or you could have different the same events but delt with in a different way ending with a different out come.

Clean Slate, Old Characters, Old Personalties, New chances for character devlopment


So far the ideas I like the best are

Mine stated in this post, Bloodhearte's, and the time frame leap idea that has been said a few times. (Not in any real order)

I don't care for a clean slate. I want to keep the current rp. The only way i won't do that is if a definite you can't is put into place. And if that happens Illareion will become a once in a while game for me.