The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:48 pm

The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Some time ago a brilliant character revealed a possible lead lore secret or it was the mad jabberings of a dwarf with not enough vitamin D. The dwarf spoke of another element, one hidden power that was essentially the antithesis to the five. The Dark or Void element. In a grand scheme chaos fits into the natural order by making it cyclical instead of ehrm 'static'.

A very common theme in Illarion (and in many high fantasy settings) is that Evil cannot truly be eradicated, it simply or really not so simply changes form or it lingers.

One reason I'm making this suggestion is that in the Ars Magicka proposal I noticed a very distinct continuity error. There is a lack of summoning magic and transformation. Transformation is not as important however it can very easily fall into an illusion category, but summoning? I don't think it's appropriate to -take- summoning from magic. There are books ingame that pertain to mages or wizards summoning elementals, the Archmage himself has an imp, liches summon undead armies etc.

I see tremendous potential with this idea and I hope this is a good starting point to discuss it, I really would like to see some darker aspects of the lore to be a bit more fleshed out. I'm also of a very high opinion that you should not have to be a priest of Moshran or Cherga to summon skeletons.

🤓
Last edited by Charlotte-ate-wilbur on Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:43 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Wed Nov 28, 2018 4:04 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Some more ideas-

Transformation/Illusion: The ability to make you or someone else look like a specific race or monster race. (There are some major issues which may not make this possible. Many monster races do not have a running animation which causes them to look like they are floating instead)

Summoning- To call upon forces from beyond the bounds of our realm. Coming from places of chaos or death there could be elementals, imps, demon beasts, skeletons and all kinds of things one can call to their aid. There should be a chance the spellcaster's will fails to control the creature setting it to attack anyone like a normal monster.

Blood magic- I would love some input from players who practice/have practiced this ingame. I could only think of an effect that would sacrifice a portion of your own health to replenish mana (according to game lore blood acts as a life force energy akin to mana). Perhaps a blood curse could increase monster aggression range toward a certain char for a period of time or they may have to get the curse lifted by a priest/priestess. Ideas flow... help me out!

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:07 am

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Nothing? Helloo

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Post by Drugar Stonesmasher » Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:02 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Hi

well, i dont think - from the description - that Cherga priests would be much interested in summoning or raising undead.

To the contrary they should have some magic specially effective against undead.
and maybe a spell to recall someone who has just entered chergas realm to their spot (instead of the cross).


but i hav'nt given too much thought to the magic system, as i suppose that there is a concept and work being done.

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:18 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

The Ars Magicka entails the plans or basic concept for the planned magic system. The plans show that users of Arcane magic will no longer be able to summon undead or creatures but users of Divine powers will be, which in my opinion is odd for many reasons. One of my main concerns here is continuity, there are books and spell casters currently ingame that show Arcane magic and summoning undeads and books that tell of summoning elementals. Also I think having a 'forbidden' form of magic to be a nice touch to rp, there could be academic debates in Runewick, witch hunts in Cadomyr, nobody caring in Galmair cus money.

https://illarion.org/~estralis/Ars_magica_v2.10.pdf

^I refer to page 28, keep in mind I am aware that this is very early and nothing is even coded yet nor are graphics made, I just hope to get this proposal considered during this time when it's under conception.

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Post by Lia » Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Necromancy is considered by many magicians a forbidden, or proscribed, magic.

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Post by Karrock » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:43 am

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

To the idea of antithesis substation as six element. In Warhammer you had one what made of people mutants. In Illarion we had Jeff who made contract with evil powers and became undead.
I see no reason to code this when only a veeeeeeeery few players would use this mechanic. Want to become mutant or undead? Rp this.
Anyway gms should reward those who play such rp constantly.

Same with summoning undeads. I think this exists in ars magicka,

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Sun Feb 17, 2019 10:10 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

I feel like no one who commented read anything I posted.

@ the above comment, Yes summoning undead is indeed in the Ars Magicka proposal however it proposes that Priests/Templars will have the option to use this ability, not mages. Which going back to my first post here is essentially the reason behind this proposal.

In the history of Illarion it has always been Necromancers and mages who have in interest in summoning monsters to control, never has a Priest tried to create a golem or control an Imp!!!

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Post by Karrock » Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:46 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

The gems business forces people to be kind to the members of other towns in hope of exchanging gems. The reason behind this is to force people to rp. But I think it's made in hopeless way. In my opinion only two gems of each town should be needed to make a set. This would give possibilities to make a conflicts in the game.
I must point when Mas is in the game (this criticized period of a time when people mostly kill monsters) we have the highest online. The same would be with a wars or any other conflicts.

My propose is to make only two gems needed to make a set. And add one more gem so we could have 8. Like an amber.

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Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:25 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

While I appreciate the input, please make a new proposal for that as it really doesn't have anything to do with my original proposal.

In this proposal I am addressing the changing the game's history and lore as per Estralis' Ars Magicka concept. I wanted to address my concerns and proposal before the Ars Magicka was ever implemented. I'm explaining for the third time that Estralis proposes to Take away, cut out, remove,Summoning for mages and he proposes to give the ability to summon undead to priests/templars

According to the Ars Magicka there will be five magic skills each based on the elements of the Five, however there is a hidden antithesis to the five that HAS been used ingame and the concept really fits a high fantasy setting where evil cannot truly be destroyed (objectively good and evil really don't exist) but it lingers and corrupts. What I propose is to finally implement some variety to the game and at the same time fill a certain void that we have around the darker aspects of the game's lore. I feel that removing summoning from mages is a bad decision as the very games history tells of mages summoning things they can't control or things they very much did control. For instance the dead marshes are the remains of an undead army the Archmage raised during the time of the Witch King to stop Galmair's advances through the marsh.

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Post by Lavinia » Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:51 am

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Summoning for mages would be nice. I'd like to summon my own golem to point my artificing profession. Sadly I read somewhere that in the plans only druids will have the skill of a summoning. Sad.

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Post by Jupiter » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:04 pm

Re: The sixth element 'Dark' or 'Void'

Hello,

putting all the questions of lore interpretation aside, the proposal to add a summon ability to mages is a rather simple one. There is speaking nothing against it at first glance. A possible approach including all three magic classes would be:

mages summons/create constructs, i.e. things without a soul (such as golems or skeletons);
priests summon things of divine origin, stuff with souls (e.g. minor demon; or the souls of a hero of Malachin);
druids can summon/call animals

This idea will be evaluated, and lead to an adjustment of Ars Magicka in case the staff finds it to be a helpful change.

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