Dropping int?

[Nitram]

The stats you need in Illarion are not really made to be played.

All attributes are needed, since they are used in magic, fighting and crafting. There is no attribute without use.
But if you really play your stats, all character of one "kind" would be very similar. All fighters would be of average or lower intelligence, nearly without any spiritual power and without any willpower and this way easy to convince. That would be a state I consider as boring.
The same thing for mages. They would be extremly intelligent, have a impressive spiritual power and a willpower that it is close to impossible to convince them on anything they do not believe. Good so far. But then we have perception. All mages would be blind as moles. And their low constitution would cause that they are sick all time. Not to forget the dexterity. They would have a shaking hand all time. I doubt that they could eat without spilling the meal. And that is all needed that they are actually can cast anything.

Nitram

[Keunthus]

So, therefore I am at disadvantage because I chose to select stats that would fit my character? You should really write that somewhere, "stats are not to be roleplayed"... Could I change my stats? I mean, why have any essence at all if it is not meant to be roleplayed? Then all warriors should have 3 essence, right?

[Keunthus]

So, then why is this sticky? http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... php?t=9047

I feel like I've been decieved...

Made my warrior weaker than most other warriors because I thought that the stats were to be played... Again, I'd like to change a few stats, please.

[Nitram]

Attribute changes are possible, within the limits that there is no change of more then 2 points on each attribute and no attribut is raised over 16 and below 5.
Also such a attribut change is only possible once per character. You may contact a gm of your choice by pm to talk about the attribut change.

Nitram

[Estralis Seborian]

By the way - define "disadvantage". A character without maxed attributes has the big plus that he can have more than one profession. Furthermore, when everybody plays the big hero super invincible uber fighter, wouldn't that be lame? Owning monsters gets lame in the long run, you know. Playing an interesting role, with weaknesses and faults is much more promising IMO.

One thing to add: When you drop e.g. ESS and WIL, do not moan when the "omg overpowered, nerf plz"-mages treat you like cannonfodder...

[Salathe]

well... it seems to me that you shouldnt play stats you dont have... If your str is 3 dont roleplay being very strong. If your int is 3 dont roleplay being a professor, etc...

but at the same time, dont be completely confined to the stats you chose

[Keunthus]

Perhaps I'm overreacting. Still, how much weaker in melee combat will a character with 16 Strength, Constitution and 12 Agility be compared to a character with 19 Strength, 18 Constitution and 18 Agility? Will the difference be big, or is it just a slight difference?

It still seems weird that we don't roleplay the stats... So with my new goblin, I should give him 3 intelligence since I don't plan to gain any skills with him? Eventhough I'll play him as fairly clever.

[AlexRose]

Perhaps I'm overreacting. Still, how much weaker in melee combat will a character with 16 Strength, Constitution and 12 Agility be compared to a character with 19 Strength, 18 Constitution and 18 Agility? Will the difference be big, or is it just a slight difference?

It still seems weird that we don't roleplay the stats... So with my new goblin, I should give him 3 intelligence since I don't plan to gain any skills with him? Eventhough I'll play him as fairly clever.

Massive difference. Absolutely huge.

[Athian]

Word of advice. You should think carefully before deciding to max every stat you believe pretains to fighting.

There are fighter characters who have huge advantages for having unusual stats, like high intelligence, at which they're tactic's skill and overall learning rate are much much faster then the common warrior.

High essence is another rarely used stat. Fighters with higher essence take less magical damage, which in the long run is a lot more effective then most people imagine.

In the case of mages, they'd do well to leave themselves some extra agility or constitution (which rarely happens) and make themselves even a few seconds more difficult to kill

In the long run it's always skills that matter most anyway. You don't need to (and never likely will) be able to beat every person on the isle even if you max all your fighting stats. Being creative however can have some unexpected advantages.

[Keunthus]

Massive difference. Absolutely huge.

You wouldn't think I'd recognize sarcasm when I see it? Think again.

So, anyone, how much different would it make?

Athian, I don't really want to remake the character, but it's comforting to hear, 'cause I didn't drop any stat under 6. I might not be a mage slayer, but I won't die from a single spell... I hope.

[Athian]

Massive difference. Absolutely huge.

You wouldn't think I'd recognize sarcasm when I see it? Think again.

So, anyone, how much different would it make?

Athian, I don't really want to remake the character, but it's comforting to hear, 'cause I didn't drop any stat under 6. I might not be a mage slayer, but I won't die from a single spell... I hope.

Try roleplaying rather then worrying about who you can and can't beat and maybe you'll find it's less of a problem then you think.

And that wasn't sarcasm, it is a massive difference. But who cares

[AlexRose]

It wasn't sarcasm, I'm sorry you jump to these conclusions in your ignorance.

[Keunthus]

Okay, so the difference is huge.

Should I remake my character from scratch, losing all equipment and skills (Dunno, around 30-50 slashing and parry perhaps) to max str and con, or should I shrug it off because skills are more important anyway?

[Pellandria]

Why do you care anyway?

If you are out to make a char just to kill everybody else , than this game is the wrong one for you anyway.

Just take the Warlock chars we currently have, they suck in figthing and magic at the current systems.
They will never be able to fight with good weapons(atleast not if the wanna drop their magic ) and they can't cast all spells, no matter how high their skill is, so they are more or less f*cked up in both ways, still people play them.

So stop asking yourself if you shoul remake your char and try to simply play the game.

[Hu'greu]

you can do a lot more if you RP reason to do them as well.

Some of the most power character or at least two years ago were made simply by ceremonies to the blood god.

[Keunthus]

If I wouldn't be able to fight and win, I wouldn't be able to play my character at all. I thought that the stats weren't that important, however, I might have been wrong. If the difference between high and very high str and con is huge, then it might be better to remake the character than to train it only to still be inferior to everyone. I do not plan to be able to kill everyone else, however, to play a succesful town guard and knight I would have to be able to fight, don't you agree?

Hu'greu, huh, what do you mean?

[Athian]

Why do you care anyway?

If you are out to make a char just to kill everybody else , than this game is the wrong one for you anyway.

Just take the Warlock chars we currently have, they suck in fighting and magic at the current systems.
They will never be able to fight with good weapons(atleast not if the wanna drop their magic ) and they can't cast all spells, no matter how high their skill is, so they are more or less f*cked up in both ways, still people play them.

So stop asking yourself if you shoul remake your char and try to simply play the game.

Pfft speak for yourself. My warlock doesn't suck, and I'd say the other few are far from sucking. Probably you just haven't high enough skills. You generally just can't expect to do both at once. (i mean who uses those silly over 65 percent spells anyway? aside from making portals they're all basically useless junk).


A.You can either cast your full range of magic using no armor and weapons (which can range from 50%-65% of spells, For Commotio which is a warlock favorite your only lacking about four spells, most of which you will never use in a battle. But generally you have all the business end of the spells in all catagories)

B.Use your full range of fighting (based on your skills you'll top out around being able to take on a few demon skeletion's, but generally bout half as good as a fighter)

C.use both at the same time which bascially means you limit both your spells and your fighting ability for the ability of being able to heal and attack at a range, based on your food/mana bar.

As to Pellandria's statement. She's being overly harsh as usual. I agree to the point that you shouldn't base you entire illarion experience on PvP or even PvNPC. No matter if your character is a super fighter or super mage it's best not to mold them sheerly on that aspect. In the end any player can make any character type and with enough dedication (pging) can skill them enough to be 'dangerous'. The only difference between your super warrior and the next guys is the characters unqiue history and background.

That aspect is IMHO 100 times more important then any stat combination. The game is based on RP after all. try not to become another faceless hack and slash hound, or you'll find yourself quickly bored in the end.

[Keunthus]

Personally, I don't even like fighting. Illarion is fun because of the roleplaying, not because of the fighting. If I can solve a conflict by words instead of action, I will do it. Nevertheless, if my character would lose every fight, he wouldn't be able to do his job as a town guard. Thus, I'm worried that I've crippled him. If most villains walk around with maxed stats, it will be even harder for me. However, perhaps having 19 strength and 18 constitution isn't that common? Hard for me to say.

Personally, I'd be glad if the fighting system in Illarion was removed. In some ways, playing a warrior would be harder, actually, very much harder. In other ways, it would be easier. No need to train, at all. Or that the fighting system was made more random. Anyway, that's not the point of this thread.

I still find it strange that I am allowed to make a character with 3 int and play him like a character with 14 int...

[Hu'greu]

yeah I dont agree with people doing that but there is no way for use to check and its really up to the gm which are doing this in their free time so I dont expect them to go looking at everyone character and seeing if they are playing it like their stats.

I have an kinda all around character... you will find safty in number I guess if your worried about the evil character killing you. plus you might have some cool RP go on if you go out mining with some people or whatever.

[Athian]

Personally, I don't even like fighting. Illarion is fun because of the roleplaying, not because of the fighting. If I can solve a conflict by words instead of action, I will do it. Nevertheless, if my character would lose every fight, he wouldn't be able to do his job as a town guard. Thus, I'm worried that I've crippled him. If most villains walk around with maxed stats, it will be even harder for me. However, perhaps having 19 strength and 18 constitution isn't that common? Hard for me to say.

Personally, I'd be glad if the fighting system in Illarion was removed. In some ways, playing a warrior would be harder, actually, very much harder. In other ways, it would be easier. No need to train, at all. Or that the fighting system was made more random. Anyway, that's not the point of this thread.

I still find it strange that I am allowed to make a character with 3 int and play him like a character with 14 int...

IF the game were just about your personal whims maybe the fighting system would be removed. But then we'd lose half our players undoubtedly. Not every great fighter int he game has 19 or 18 in all there stats. if you know what your doing you can have an excellent fighter with only about 9-10 constitution or example.

Secondly, what all this town guard must pwn everything nonsense? Firstly, i have a character in the guard who only have one stat at 18 and it is neither strength nor constitution, and he is an excellent fighter. which goes to show you that for the most part maxed stats aren't needed. And there are plenty of characters that probably only have 14-15 tops in there fighting stats and are still quite powerful. Your way to hung up on fighting stats and saying you would rather not have a fighting system is basically like saying 'IF i can't win then i don't want to play that way.'

as to your last comment it isn't strange at all, technical stats only describe technical aspects of the game, such as fighting, crafting and otherwise. while it's better to play a slow learning character it doesn't mean you must play a character stupidly. Generally it suffices that low intelligence characters don't quickly grasps concepts outside of basic life skills and take a much longer time to learn extra skills (which is also technically true considering that intel will effect your skill cap).

Personally, (and take no offense) Making a brutish character for the reasons of 'i don't want to lose if I'm in the guard' is nonsense. There are players who'll kill you no matter how strong you think you are anyway. They might be mages, or warriors of your own strength or even weaker warriors with better skills, they might even win sheerly by the fact that there armor is better then yours, they might just poison you to death in any event.

You're not going to win every fight no matter what your stats are so stop getting hung up on this idea. make your maxed character if you'd like, your going to encounter problems with some part of the fighting system no matter what stats you have.

[Konrad Knox]

Don't drop intelligence unless you plan to drop strength.
Dex and Perc come hand in hand.
Int and Str come hand in hand.

[Keunthus]

Ah, okay, Athian, I was under the impression that most people maxed str and con. If that isn't the case, I'm not at a huge disadvantage.

Not liking the fighting system isn't because I don't like losing. Rather, I don't like training, and besides, the fights are boring as they are at the moment.

Also, what do you mean with "If you know what you're doing"? I don't think I do, heh, what should I know?

About town guards having to be good warriors. I did not come up with it. The mentality of some players seem to be that in order to play a knight, or a town guard, one must be able to fight. I can see why people would think that. Also, there could be a fighting system, but one better than the one we have now. I realise that those with bad connection (they still excist in 2008?) might object to having a fighting system that depends on the skills of the player. Well, at the moment, we have a fighting system which depends on how long you have fought undead in the graveyard... Anyway.