An apology

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:04 am

Yes it is no joke, I really will apologise and shall be totally serious this time.

1. Unneeded OOC and assumptions.

As the character Gerron Defreny was walking past my character Jeran Malvok and I had made assumptions about him being pushed, I got sort of angry about my new evil character about to get owned by an assumingly pushed character so I argued with PO gerron ooc until he convinced me that his character wasn’t pushed. Then I simply had my character Jeran make a few snide comments and run away.

For that I am sorry, I really did act on an impulsion and did not think of the consequences of my actions, now I understand why it was bad and I for sure will not do it again if I am ever unbanned.

2. Acting immature with a GM instead of behaving seriously.

This occurred the day after I had made it clear to PO gerron I would not be telling him the names of the people who told me he was playing Gerron, however I also made it clear I would set them straight and for them not to tell anyone else. However whilst training Jeran again I was teleported to the GM castle by some unknown guy I originally assumed was PO Gerron however it seems it wasn’t him and instead was Vilarion. Well, I took him serious the first few minutes until I let it sink in that I was being questioned a second time for things I have already explained, however it seemed that I had froze my account or something so I logged out and while waiting for the server to come back I thought of what to do. It seemed to be a good idea to log back in and make a joke out of it, assuming the Gm had a sense of humor at all it would be well played ( I was thinking of Gm’s like Aegohl, Japheth, or even Loralyn who would have such a sense of humor for theatrics and would maybe spank my hand for not taking them seriously but would never ban me permanently). I checked the server online list with my mind set what I would do and found the server hadn’t frozen and maybe it was just lag.

From there I started mess with him by acting if I still was in my character while it obviously was a totally OOC situation. Instead of just answering the simple questions asked, I tried to be funny by acting as if my character was being tortured, making Vilarion loses his time with me and it probably did make him angry, it is understandable.

It was not smart of me and I am aware of it now, I have no idea why I did act this way but I swear that now I am regretting it deeply. I really did not think this whole thing would go as far is it has gone, I was only wanting to have fun even though that is hardly a good enough reason to forgive my doings.

3. Posting the logs on the forum and acting like an asshole

After getting told I would be banned for my wrong doings, at the end of the ‘talk’ with Vilarion, I have gotten really pissed. I didn’t think of my actions and as such I have posted the logs with Vilarion on the forums, which is not allowed unless all players within the logs agreed.

For that I also am ashamed, this was also something that shown immaturity and that I obviously didn’t think before doing, I as well learned of that and would not do this again.

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The only thing I want is to play the game again. This time, since it has involved a permanent ban, It REALLY did give me a lesson I will not forget soon. The other bans I did not take too seriously since those were temporary, sadly enough they did not do what they were meant to do to me, give me a lesson and not do such things again.

I have ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder), and I think this is why I am sometimes doing rash unthoughtful things. I know this cannot excuse all my doings, but to let you know I recently started talking pills against it, so that such things do not happen once more. I am saying again, I am dearly sorry for all that I done and if you ever unban me again I swear I will do my best not to break any rules and to be respectful with the staff members, which are making this game possible. If this whole thing was meant to give me a lesson, then it worked and I thank you for that, if it wasn’t please I am asking you to understand me, a simple player who wants to play illa like anyone else and will surely remember this thing.

- Sam

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:15 pm

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

-

Article 10.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

-

Mr. Cromwell · Post by **Mr. Cromwell** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:21 pm

I doubt that Illarion-Community has signed those.

WickedEwok · Post by **WickedEwok** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:33 pm

Keikan Hiru wrote:Private server, private board.
You basicly don't even have human rights here, if we don't want to.

Thorvald · Post by **Thorvald** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:56 pm

I wonder why it is so hard for a part of our community to keep at least a single thread free of spam-like/useless/off topic posts. Especially when it is a serious one like this.

Is this one of the forced 'public humiliation' thing to get yourself unbanned?

No, it is not.

If the rest of you feels like discussing the matter of apologising publically then open a new thread.

Markous · Post by **Markous** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:35 pm

Watch the spam, guys.

Oh, and thank you for your words, Sam.

Nalzaxx · Post by **Nalzaxx** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:21 pm

Yeah. We may need putting back in place rather harshly sometimes, but we all learn and it would be a shame to loose a member of the community.

Siegfried Schtauffen · Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:56 pm

What harm is there to letting him back? He apologized.

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:58 pm

Siegfried Schtauffen wrote:What harm is there to letting him back? He apologized.

Its called pride....

Siegfried Schtauffen · Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:02 pm

Hadrian_Abela wrote:
Siegfried Schtauffen wrote:What harm is there to letting him back? He apologized.
Its called pride....

Pride on a multiplayer online RPG? What value does that have?

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:05 pm

Gms are also humans.

If you take a decision, and you fall back on it, it apparently shows weakness.

Its called pride.

Lance Thunnigan · Post by **Lance Thunnigan** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:09 pm

Hadrian_Abela wrote:Gms are also humans.

If you take a decision, and you fall back on it, it apparently shows weakness.

Its called pride.

My way of thinking exactly.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:14 pm

This is a very hard decision, since the player had several last chances already. The staff may take long for that.

Urilen Quanasuard · Post by **Urilen Quanasuard** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:16 pm

Lance Thunnigan wrote:
Hadrian_Abela wrote:Gms are also humans.

If you take a decision, and you fall back on it, it apparently shows weakness.

Its called pride.
My way of thinking exactly.

You're talking like a Samurai. He said "Sorry". He apparently just wanted to stop the fighting. I don't see any "Pride loss" in that.

Lance Thunnigan · Post by **Lance Thunnigan** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:20 pm

Urilen Quanasuard wrote:
Lance Thunnigan wrote:
Hadrian_Abela wrote:Gms are also humans.

If you take a decision, and you fall back on it, it apparently shows weakness.

Its called pride.
My way of thinking exactly.
You're talking like a Samurai. He said "Sorry". He apparently just wanted to stop the fighting. I don't see any "Pride loss" in that.

The point is, as Damien said, he's had many chances before.
Also, the view behind the 'pride' is to not fall back on your word. It makes you look like a pushover.

The Returner · Post by **The Returner** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:54 pm

Damien wrote:This is a very hard decision, since the player had several last chances already. The staff may take long for that.

I don't see it so hard, he had his chances already, he fucked them up, he now pays the price.

Grant · Post by **Grant** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 7:00 pm

Stop being black people. Remember what you are, white! The man apolagised, he even said himself he really has learnt his lesson from this perm ban, How cruel can you be?

At the end of the day, Think to yourselves, you guys your fighting are just like you! sitting behind the screen, typing words, they cannot describe emotion! They cannot resemble joking, or smiling, This man is sorry! And he means it! not the words my bretheren!

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:55 pm

The problem is that he has been sorry already some time ago, when he had his "really, really last chance", and still didnt stick to the agreements that were made back then. Since he seemingly had improved, the staff agreed not to do anything when he left this agreement aside.
Try to see it only logical. If a person having had a very, very last chance, was overgoing its conditions and was not kicked because of staff tolerance mainly, and then again causes trouble, a person being known for often playing at the border of rules, then not taking a GM for serious, and afterwards breaking rules openly - could the staff still be taken for serious if he lets that player get away with it ?
It is not a simple incident this time, but a chain of things. The discussions in the staff are still being done.

Poots · Post by **Poots** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:14 pm

Damien wrote:The problem is that he has been sorry already some time ago, when he had his "really, really last chance", and still didnt stick to the agreements that were made back then. Since he seemingly had improved, the staff agreed not to do anything when he left this agreement aside.
Try to see it only logical. If a person having had a very, very last chance, was overgoing its conditions and was not kicked because of staff tolerance mainly, and then again causes trouble, a person being known for often playing at the border of rules, then not taking a GM for serious, and afterwards breaking rules openly - could the staff still be taken for serious if he lets that player get away with it ?
It is not a simple incident this time, but a chain of things. The discussions in the staff are still being done.

That is a very good point. I can't remember what he did in the past, so I can't comment much on it. Stephen was given chances and he still messed up. But I still feel that he made only a minor offense. I think powergaming is much worse than anything he was accused of doing here. If he were to create another major offense, I think the punishment would be fit. Besides it's been a while since the last thing I remember him getting yelled at for, A year I think (I think)

And by the way, it's human to screw up, this goes for Stephen and the GM's. It's not impossible for the GM's to make a bad descision, and it is certainly not "weakness" to admit it.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:52 pm

Poots, he has somewhat "fooled" the staff before, when he had his "verys last chance".
This time it was a major thing because he lied to a GM about ingame matters, the second major thing is that he revealed a GM's player char identity. Both are direct rule breakings. So no minor problem here.
You should know the rules before posting on such a matter

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:54 pm

What ingame matter did I lie about?

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:57 pm

That's not for discussing here, but think about the talk with Sideon, about names and stuff. That also just adds up. Well, let's wait for the staff decision.

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:04 pm

No no, im the player and im comfortable with talking about it here. I do not think I ever lied to a gm about ingame events, (sideon is not a gm he is a dev and regardless i did not lie to him about ingame events either). I told him I would not tell him and that I did not know who told me who played Gerron.

Now if the charge is changed from lieing to refuses to tell a GM what they want to know, then you have something against me.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:12 pm

The other thing alone is already enough. There's nothing to discuss here.
You should have used your wits to think before you did that nonsense, pal. Now all that can be done is to wait for the decision for what comes out of it.

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:16 pm

And neither nitram nor sideon are gms, so how am I breaking a rule that concerns gms when no gm was involved?

Lance Thunnigan · Post by **Lance Thunnigan** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:16 pm

Garett Gwenour wrote:And neither nitram nor sideon are gms, so how am I breaking a rule that concerns gms when no gm was involved?

Erm, last time I knew Nitters was a GM.

Mr. Cromwell · Post by **Mr. Cromwell** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:17 pm

@Garret
It's the same thing, really. Now stfu, you aren't scoring any points for yourself with that.

Garett Gwenour · Post by **Garett Gwenour** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:21 pm

we have 7 GM(s) in total, these are their names.
Latharan, lianis, markous, thorvald, arien keikan, loralyn

If I read the rules and it tells me to respect a GM's secret characters I may do so. However there is nothing in the rules involving keeping a dev's characters secret (i would assume largely because until recently they have not done questing things )

However by simple written down game rules, I broke none.

Lance Thunnigan · Post by **Lance Thunnigan** » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:22 pm

Devs are GMs too. Basically all staff have GM accounts.

Caldrion Sternenglanz · Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:25 pm

uhm, garret:

I dont know much, but do you contradict with your posts after your apology your apology?