Magical gem system (Changes)

Here you can make and discuss suggestions to improve the game. / Hier kannst du Vorschläge einreichen und diskutieren um das Spiel zu verbessern.

Moderator: Developers

User avatar
Achae Eanstray
Posts: 4300
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 7:03 am
Location: A field of dandelions
Contact:

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Achae Eanstray »

I am not fond of subtracting from a character in the game but making gems consumable could be an addition for those with little.. though a subtraction for those with a lot.

It may also prevent the power house character that can kill every other in game with PvP . It would definitely be interesting and unpredictable.


PS I would much prefer Dantagon's idea of repair...only affect gems and nothing else.... then the way it is now.
User avatar
Dantagon Marescot
Posts: 1948
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 8:38 am
Location: Illarion Public Library

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Dantagon Marescot »

Estralis Seborian wrote:I see at least one more option: Make magical gems consumables.
I like this option, a lot. Perhaps every repair to the armor brings down the set power by a percent or two. Maybe five if extremely unlucky?

Another thought that was suggested to me, do we really need 9 or 10 levels of magic gems? Could we decrease it to 5 or 6 and increase the power per set? This seems a lot more obtainable for pretty much anyone.
User avatar
Q-wert
Posts: 1089
Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 10:13 am
Contact:

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Q-wert »

One could also side-step the problem and introduce more or more easily available counters to excessively gemmed characters.

Right now we do have in this regard:
  • Staff-Magic completely ignores gem bonuses of its targets. (In fact, a correctly built, equipped and skilled mage is the most powerful thing in the game right now - in PvP 'and' PvE. No matter how many gems used by the counterpart compared to or pitted against.)
  • A monster emitting an area of effect completely negating gem bonuses.
If we are at proposals: I propose the aura of the monster to be made available for everyone through potions or/and the artifact creation system.
User avatar
Charlotte-ate-wilbur
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur »

I would propose adding more uses for the gems with a couple of those uses being a consumable. For powerful potions or one time use artifacts. We could have more hidden places on the map like the Bjolmur altar which require gems.

There's ALOT of options. The key is to add more content instead of taking it away

ps: For those who are disheartened by the gap between older chars, you can hunt maps or gather for extra gems or you can seek out people who would give gems for work or apprenticeships, or maybe someone would give gems for loyalty which seems to be nonexistent in a world of knights and dragons.
User avatar
GolfLima
Posts: 1472
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:06 pm
Location: hier und dort

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by GolfLima »

Charlotte-ate-wilbur wrote:ps: For those who are disheartened by the gap between older chars, you can hunt maps or gather for extra gems or you can seek out people who would give gems for work or apprenticeships, or maybe someone would give gems for loyalty which seems to be nonexistent in a world of knights and dragons
:arrow: "old charakters" could have between 2.000 - 3.000 magical gems, may be more (calculatet down to lvl.1)
User avatar
Charlotte-ate-wilbur
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur »

So? Some of the biggest maps I heard give up to 4 latent gems. From gathering for a few hours I can get 1 sometimes 2 latents a day.

To catch up to people who have much more playtime would take some determination, but it's not impossible, who says you can't get some friends to help you work for gems? Or do some hard work for them for another character?

I really think adding a few valuable consumable options is a great idea for a 'gem sink' or maybe we can figure out a way to fairly lose them in pvp? There's alot to consider.
User avatar
Karrock
Posts: 515
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Karrock »

GolfLima wrote:
Charlotte-ate-wilbur wrote:ps: For those who are disheartened by the gap between older chars, you can hunt maps or gather for extra gems or you can seek out people who would give gems for work or apprenticeships, or maybe someone would give gems for loyalty which seems to be nonexistent in a world of knights and dragons
:arrow: "old charakters" could have between 2.000 - 3.000 magical gems, may be more (calculatet down to lvl.1)
GolfLima is right and this sum doesn't stop and still grows.

I told in the other topic why almost no one will find apprentice/servant/squire/slave etc. for a long term seeking between new players. Only very old players who want to experience something new are interested to play such a chars. Those chars created to rp-jobs are very specifical and this can't be fundament for predicting anything.
So? Some of the biggest maps I heard give up to 4 latent gems. From gathering for a few hours I can get 1 sometimes 2 latents a day.
2 latents? Then after about after almost 3 years every day working several hours in game you can reach the sum of gems those players have now, but in that moment they will have more than now. This is neverending race.
Last edited by Karrock on Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Charlotte-ate-wilbur
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur »

Karrock wrote:
GolfLima wrote:
Charlotte-ate-wilbur wrote:ps: For those who are disheartened by the gap between older chars, you can hunt maps or gather for extra gems or you can seek out people who would give gems for work or apprenticeships, or maybe someone would give gems for loyalty which seems to be nonexistent in a world of knights and dragons
:arrow: "old charakters" could have between 2.000 - 3.000 magical gems, may be more (calculatet down to lvl.1)
GolfLima is right and this sum doesn't stop and still grows.

I told in the other topic why almost no one will find apprentice/servant/squire/slave etc. for a long term seeking between new players. Only very old players who want to experience something new are interested to play such a chars. Those chars created to rp-jobs are very specifical and this can't be fundament for predicting anything.
So? Some of the biggest maps I heard give up to 4 latent gems. From gathering for a few hours I can get 1 sometimes 2 latents a day.
2 latents? Than after about after almost 3 years every day working several hours in game you can reach the sum of gems those players have now, but in that moment they will have more than now. This is neverending race.
Which is why we need more uses for the gems as well as having two to three valuable consumable options. As well as a way that this power dynamic can change such as pvp loss.

Edit: I repeat, for a game developer the goal should be to add content instead of taking it away think big and openly, possibilities are always endless.
User avatar
Karrock
Posts: 515
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Karrock »

maybe we can figure out a way to fairly lose them in pvp? There's alot to consider.
You never reach best of the best targeting them. Only way in this could be pking before weak or average chars. This will frustrate those players much, maybe they will quit. After taking their gems you can kill those best of the best. Almost all of them are "good" chars. Tell me from who except a very few "bad" chars they can get gems?

But about consuming gems I have not made any opinion now, so I don't want to rate this idea now. Please wait several days I must analyze this.

EDIT: Anyway I'm oppositive to idea for losing any items except money after PK. Especially special items or magical gems, because these stuff is not easy to get back. Other items in games are thousands and they could drop after PK randomly. Completing lost items after PK wasting time of the player. Getting magical gems after pk will be reason why do this even if this is not needed. Most fights now even between enemies don't need to end by last hit and sending to the cross. I don't know why this should be pushed to do this every time.
User avatar
Karrock
Posts: 515
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Karrock »

On last sunday on chat was short discussion of the possibilities how magic gems can be consumable. There were made by some players prelimenary proposals like: simplyfing finding treasures, using them in alchemy or other crafts, using in items which enable have disguise (char is showned mechanically as someone or even removed from online list), hiring npcs, access to special places, changing attitude of npcs (like better gain on selling/buying from vendors, difference in their speech to the character), using in repairing. Part of players has opinion that instead of removing existing stuff in game is better to change how and for what them are used. Other proposal was to decrease amount of their levels (to not collect them forever) or decrease/change/adjust their power.

I have considered my own opinion. Changing magic gems to being consumable, but still based on mechanics usage won't change much. People still will get mechanical bonus by using them (especially if them would be used in items, potions etc.), just in different way. Important I think is keep interesting reason to play after "endgame" and magical gems or other tool should be used to give old characters reasons to play without creating them mechanically uber-characters.

In my own opinion current best solution that save magical gems in game is decrease their levels or make them consumable, but with no change in the way of their use. I think there is no need to change their usage because effect will be same (in different way). Defect of first part of this proposal is within that when character gets all main skills on 100 and all sets of gems he gets nothing new after "endgame". Similar when character uses all magical gems and must wait for new ones after weekly income. If he can't use all, because he has still thousands in depot , situation will be same like now. Waiting for new gems after using all old will just remind something like "free potions". Nothing special to attract people after "endgame".

I would suggest to invent new ways to attract people after "endgame", better than magical gems.
User avatar
Katharina Brightrim
Cadomyr
Posts: 956
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 8:13 pm
Location: Göttingen

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Katharina Brightrim »

Can you elaborate on what is this "endgame" for you? Cause I don't think Illarion is a game you can play through or something like that.
User avatar
Charlotte-ate-wilbur
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Charlotte-ate-wilbur »

A better way of saying it imo is "how can we keep people interested in improving their character after they have their desired skill sets." I too think this is important. Illarion is really lacking in content, it's bad enough we can hardly customize what equipment we wear as there is a meta for leveled equipment which I dislike. I feel we need more equipment so people can really describe their characters. As well as legendary items and special quests that award crafting recipes etc.For instance everyone wants to make drow stuff but it seems they just want a perk or the ability to just do it. Why not put in some difficult quests, the reward being crafting recipes not available through plainly leveling up.

Illa has none of that.
User avatar
Karrock
Posts: 515
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: Magical gem system (Changes)

Post by Karrock »

Katharina Ross wrote:Can you elaborate on what is this "endgame" for you? Cause I don't think Illarion is a game you can play through or something like that.
Character got all needed skills, best equipment, built house or settlement (now this doesn't exist), collected big amount money, killed strongest monsters, made hardest items, discovered all map. Reached all set goals what game as computer program can offers. This does not include rp between characters or other things that can't be coded as ingame mechanics.
Locked