Fischschwärme

Here you can make and discuss suggestions to improve the game. / Hier kannst du Vorschläge einreichen und diskutieren um das Spiel zu verbessern.

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GolfLima
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Fischschwärme

Post by GolfLima »

Erst einmal ein großes Danke für die schönen neuen Graphiken.


Könnte man die Fischschwärme ein wenig "gerechter" verteilen?

Runewick hat ca. 20 sichere Angelplätze (nach der Brücke im sicheren Gebiet)
Cadomyr hat ca. 7 sichere Angelplätze (innerhalb der Stadt)
Galmair hat 0 sichere Angelplätze (bis jetzt habe ich jedenfalls noch keinen gefunden)
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Rincewind
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Rincewind »

Das ist bestimmt Absicht, Golf. Dafür gibts in Cadomyr zb keinen Acker.
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Achae Eanstray
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Achae Eanstray »

I believe Galmair has 2-3 safe places but you have to cut down a tree to get to it, the area is blocked by rocks also so it would be nice if the rocks are removed.. but still not that many places (if I am reading the translator correctly on the proposal that is). How about adding another further north of the bridge in that safe area?

As an added thought regarding the fishing and roleplay.. it would be nice to have the shoal give maybe less fish but last longer and big enough for two players to be able to talk and fish?
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GolfLima
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by GolfLima »

Ich hatte da mehr "Newbies" im Hinterkopf, die sich am Anfang meist durch geräucherten Fisch ernähren.
Dies ist jetzt in Galmair nicht mehr möglich, was den Anfang ein wenig schwerer als nötig macht.
Außerdem hat Runewick auch Äcker und Unmengen Angelplätze.

@Achae:
the places you have in mind could be reached by "unfriendly dwarfs" // the fishing places in Cadomyr and Runewick are SAVE places
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Jupiter
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Jupiter »

http://illarion.org/community/forums/vi ... =6&t=37458

Fischen ist ausdrücklich kein Handwerk von Galmair.
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Uhuru
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Uhuru »

Actually better to live on bread rolls. They give a constitution boost and that is something Hannah teaches noobs that first arrive in Galmair. However, it is practically impossible to level up cooking skills by making bread rolls if not impossible. It needs to be kick started with the smoking of fish. So, having access to fishing is helpful. I understand that isn't a desired skill in Galmair, but I do think we need to at least have access, even if it is a ways out as a sort of compromise. Like the spot Uffe is suggesting, which is near the iron mine on the island behind the building. This way it isn't going to be easy access and people have to work hard to get to and from the fishing spots and then back to town to the depot.

This will at least make fishing an option, but not a desireable one in Galmair.
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Jupiter
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Jupiter »

Smoking ham, cooking sausages, baking bread rolls and brewing cider are also things that beginners can make.

If the lack of fish make is "practically impossible to level up cooking skills", than there is an other problem. Namely that you cannot learn properly from the goods I listed. However, I am not sure if the lack of the best way to get the first 20 skill points is necessairly implying that it is impossible to get cooking started.
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GolfLima
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by GolfLima »


* in Cadomyr & Runewick kann sich ein Anfänger ohne den sicheren Bereich zu verlassen ernähren <--> in Galmair ist dies nicht möglich
1) das macht es einem Anfänger ungleich schwerer in Galmair zu beginnen (oder die alteingesessenen Galmaijaner helfen permaent freundlich aus)
2) in Runewick ist es, wenn ich mich nicht gar zu sehr irre sogar möglich ein Meister des Kochens & Backens (Fischer, Kräutersucher & Holzfäller gehen auch) sowie zumindest ein Geselle des Schreiner- & des Schneiderhandwerkes zu werden ohne jemals das sichere Gebiet verlassen zu müssen. (Du kannst in Galmair das Meisterlevel des Steinbrenners erreichen wenn Du jemand findest der Dich mit Nahrung versorgt)

:arrow: aber ich wollte keine große Diskussion auslösen, es fiel mir nur einfach auf - mein Char. wird versuchen den in Galmair beginnenden Neulingen soweit es geht zu helfen


in Cadomyr and Runewick a "Newbie" is able to live and gather food without leaving the "save" area <--> in Galmair this is not possible
1) so in my opinion it is more difficult to start at Galmair than in Runewick or Cadomyr
2) if i remember right you could reach the Level of a master of cooking and baking (fishing, collecting herbs and woodcutting is also possible) and a medium level of carpentry and tailoring without leaving the save area of Runewick once (you could reach the master of brickmaking at Galmair without leaving the town if you find someone who gives you food)

:arrow: but i wont initiate a big discussion, was only noticed by me - my char will try to help "Newbies" as good as he can
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Jupiter
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Jupiter »

That is an other topic, GolfLima (actually even more than one).
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Uhuru
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Uhuru »

Jupiter wrote:Smoking ham, cooking sausages, baking bread rolls and brewing cider are also things that beginners can make.

If the lack of fish make is "practically impossible to level up cooking skills", than there is an other problem. Namely that you cannot learn properly from the goods I listed. However, I am not sure if the lack of the best way to get the first 20 skill points is necessairly implying that it is impossible to get cooking started.
I did write up the bread roll learning issue as my baker character didn't want to learn to cook over a fire and certainly didn't want to smoke fish, but had no options. She learned nothing from baking bread rolls. Still doesn't.
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Alrik »

First of all, I understand you as a player. Leaving fruits aside,smoking fishes is one of the simplest ways to feed your character and one of the cheapest.

But....

After all, the idea of the primary and secondary crafts of the three citys was to encourage trading between citys and players and the specialization of the citys. No craft availible in all of the three towns without trading a little bit at least.

Otherwise, wheres my mine, my furnace my anvil and my gem grinder at Runewick beyond the guard? At least for some goods of Runewicks primary crafts (Carpentry, tailoring) you will need ingots and grinded gems. Not at the beginning but at a certain point. And as far as I understood this, a primary craft should be possible without leaving the safe zones of a city to much. Of the city where it is a primary craft. So, if I want to craft some bows or shields, I need grinded gems an metall bars. If I want to craft nails and pins (one of the first items you learn in carpentry), I will even need a smithed good - nails.

After this we would have a mine with: Silver, Iron, Coal and all sorts of Gems inside Runewick. I will need an furnace (turn Iron into ingots), an anvil (turn iron ingots into nails) and a gem grinder (turn raw gems into grinded gems).

But as good as this would sound for a player of Runewick, why the hell I should leave Runewick to get a new heavy armor or to get a new sword? Through this example I will just need a hammer and could do blacksmithing in a town where it is neither primary nor secondary craft. Why I should travel to Galmair or Cadomyr where it is one of the crafts of these citys and buy this things there if I could craft or buy them much cheaper at home?

Just ridiculous, even if it were much easier for new players in Runewick if they find all they need for blacksmithing there.

And after all, for the city of wealth, are trouts and salmons that expensive that the citizens couldn´t afford them through trading if fish is needed this hard?
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GolfLima
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by GolfLima »

@Alrik:

seems you did not understand what i try to say.

1) Galmarian´s need to leave the "save area" to gather food and most of the materials
2) Runewicker´s DO NOT NEED to leave the "save area" to gather such things
if you choose one of the primary crafts of the town
Mr.Oldie
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Mr.Oldie »

may be another item namely roasted fruit/ smoked fruit can be created.
this item should've the same value in hunger as the smoken fish. i guess this would solve the problem.
Just a suggestion..
Alrik
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Alrik »

I did understand you Jerem. But after all fishing is no craft of Galmair - so you can´t have this in the safe area. As you can´t get things for a craft which isn´t supported by your town in any other town.

For example: At Galmair with primary craft smithing, you could reach the Malachite Mine easily and the Blackhole my via the tunnel without bigger problems. So you could gather most of the materials without really big problems.

Same counts for carpentry in Runewick. You do have the forrest right before the doorstep and materials could be collected easily.

So we have fishing which is no craft of Galmair. Couldn´t be done there without big efford (if it is possible at all).

Equal like goldsmithing of Runewick. No materials could be collected in the safe zone and as much some would like it to collect them there - not possible and it shouldn´t be possible.

Thats the point.

And after all - cooking is a craft of Galmair, so your Character could get food in Galmair without travelling, trading or buying a license. So he wouldn´t starve. Where´s the problem? The only one could be that it isn´t so simple anymore like before and you would have to do some work on the field first.
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GolfLima
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by GolfLima »


1) for Jerem this is NOT a problem, i was thinking on "Newbies"
2) there is a real danger at Galmair ressource grounds (outside the town) - fields, trees and Blackhole mine (angry dogs, wolfes, Slime, (dont know if the problem with gynk spiders at Galmair still exist), other enemies and Malachitmine (seldom but sometimes there are agressive dwarfs) - there is NO danger for the fields and some kind of trees at Runewick
3) Runewick has no mines (coal, silver, gold, copper, iron, stones) <--> Galmair has no cows, sheeps, honey (bees)
4) the point is there is a real danger for "Newbies" at Galmair that doesnt exist at Runewick
5) not sure if you need some food for roasting at the beginning when trying to learn cooking - if yes, you "cant" start learning that craft at Galmair

:arrow:
possible solution:
* some cherry and/or apple trees in the town of Galmair (not outside) - so a "Newbie" could stay save at his first steps
* a small field in town - so a "Newbie" could stay save at his first steps
* ome ore two save fish grounds (i know fishing isnt a craft of Galmair)
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Jupiter
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Jupiter »

That discussion is about fishes.

With the current distribution of crafts, Galamair won't get any. Simple as that.

The staff will discuss the distribution of crafts on a broad scale, but not temporary and small messing around.
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Ufedhin
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Ufedhin »

For myself i am quite happy the way things are ,there is also plenty of food available inside Galmairs safe area ,mushrooms,blackberries,strawberries and grapes for example.
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Lennier »

In case that in Galmair basic food is rare too much (Ufedihn ready listed different kinds of basic food that can be found in Galmair), the inhabitants could think about to change this within the setting of their town... What do you think about a little plantation/garden of apples, cherries, wine grapes etc.?


Auf Deutsch: Was hindert die Galmairs daran innerhalb des Settings die vorhandenen Ressourcen zu kultivieren und neu zu ordnen? Planzen/Ersetzen von Apfelbäumen, Weinstöcken, Büschen mit Beeren etc... Oder ein Pilzkeller in den Katakomben?
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Uhuru »

It is my understanding that Cadomyr is the main fishing town. Yet my alt, with level 6 at fishing, can fish out all the near shoals in no time at all. It is making me wonder how someone like a lizardfolk, with high level skills and needing large quantities of fish to survive at a high caloric task, such as mining, is surviving. If you look around Cadomyr, there are not many shoals available. Not compared to before, when we could fish anywhere non-stop until a character had as much fish as s/he wanted.

With that said, this may start a whole new profession of fishermen. The need for fish may increase drastically. However, I do believe the number of shoals in Cadomyr should be increased ever so slightly. They just seem to be too few, especially at only 20 fish per shoal.

I would be interested to hear a lizard's point of view on this. Thanks!
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Quinasa »

Uhuru wrote:It is my understanding that Cadomyr is the main fishing town. Yet my alt, with level 6 at fishing, can fish out all the near shoals in no time at all. It is making me wonder how someone like a lizardfolk, with high level skills and needing large quantities of fish to survive at a high caloric task, such as mining, is surviving. If you look around Cadomyr, there are not many shoals available. Not compared to before, when we could fish anywhere non-stop until a character had as much fish as s/he wanted.

With that said, this may start a whole new profession of fishermen. The need for fish may increase drastically. However, I do believe the number of shoals in Cadomyr should be increased ever so slightly. They just seem to be too few, especially at only 20 fish per shoal.

I would be interested to hear a lizard's point of view on this. Thanks!
My lizard eats fish exclusively, and while raw fish gives no stat bonuses and fills very little of the food bar, I keep her consistent in her diet. I have not begun cooking fish, as there are other skills I would rather work on than cooking at the moment. There aren't many shoals for fishing inside the city of Cadomyr, not for the current lizard population, when you get 20 fish per shoal and they don't respawn very quickly.

Now on another character I have attempted to level cooking, and I began with bread rolls (as they are the only option when I stand at the oven), and after making 270 of them over the course of three days I received no cooking level at all. That might be a problem.
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Evie »

Quinasa wrote:

Now on another character I have attempted to level cooking, and I began with bread rolls (as they are the only option when I stand at the oven), and after making 270 of them over the course of three days I received no cooking level at all. That might be a problem.
That is something sister has had issues with too, leveling a cook making bread rolls, she says it doesnt seem to work.
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Mr.Oldie »

you can trying the cooking pot/ Barrels. there might be options that can be used to lvl up there.
a temperary solution if just leveling up is the objective.
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Uhuru
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Uhuru »

Mr.Oldie wrote:you can trying the cooking pot/ Barrels. there might be options that can be used to lvl up there.
a temperary solution if just leveling up is the objective.
You can, yes, but difficult to do if you are RPing a baker. My elfess did nothing but burn breadrolls if you recall and she didn't learn a darn thing. Made a new character and she learned fine on breadrolls. So I don't understand it at all. Not a bit. My theory is that the gods are fickle! That's my story and I'm sticking to it. :D Or... or... Nargun was messing with my head!
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Re: Fischschwärme

Post by Manron »

Golf, das is so nicht ganz richtig, du kannst in Galmair den Acker benutzen den Cadomyr nicht hat, also einfach getreide oder dergleichen kaufen und los gehts ;) ist alles im sicheren bereich :D
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