Illarion.org

I know this is something that has been discussed a lot in the past, but I'm really interested in seeing how illarions current players rate profiles. Please know anything I say here is NOT an attack on anyone, there's a reason I'm not giving out names, which should be fairly obvious. For the purposes of this, all characters and players will be referred to as "He"

I opened a few profiles, and three stood out to me. (Non mine by the way, just so that you guys know this is not some way of me fuming because you're all not rating me high enough )

One was from someone I've never seen or heard of in game or the forums. The rating he has is, or rather was, was 1. Now, he had a pretty good picture, a description (not very detailed) that described the picture and I single line of background info. Not much, but something. For me that earns a 3, so I voted that.

Next, a player that many, many people know and love. Personally, I don't like the player or any of his characters, however, because of the thoughts I was having at the time, I decided to rate the profile fairly.. It had a six, so you'd a assume it was a good profile. But no, all I saw was a picture, who, admittedly, looked exactly like the characters in game description. HOWEVER, there was no profile description, or background. I gave it a 2, because at least the picture looked like the character.

Finally, another player I've met. The first thing I noticed was a rating of five for a player I knew writes wonderfully. I thought perhaps his profile was incomplete, and proceeded to look through everything.
I could why the profile might not deserve a ten, as the picture certainly did not depict the character. It was, in fact, simply an emblem which I've come to know the character to be associated with.
There were three paragraphs of descriptive text, obviously having nothing to do with the picture save the emblem being visible on the character, BUT, the text was very well written, perfect grammar, perfect structure. There was nothing in the description that made the character seem out of the ordinary or unrealistic. As far I know, usually we appreciate this, thus so far I wanted to give this person at least 5, just as everyone else had done.
Finally, I moved on to the characters fluff, this did not consist of any paragraphs, but was rather written in a memory format, generally, I dislike this kind of background, but tried to keep an open mind. After reading through this background, I saw it to simply be a more detailed version of what I had heard from the character himself in game (A good thing, in my opinion). Just as the description, this was very well written. I ended up giving this person a well deserved (Once again, my opinion) eight.

So I'm just wondering how you all rate profiles? And what profile injustices have you seen lately?

If it is a profile no one else hat rated on, I give it a ten. If someone else has rated it already, it gets a zero.

I have not rated Zehshirr yet , but i remember the picture and writing. Ill give him a good rating as i rememer it being a goodone

An interesting question in my eyes is why there are little to no ratings above 6/10. Do people get envious of each other over profile ratings? Do people do it like me and "opt out" to rate someone else, simply giving a zero for the heck of it? The second interesting thing I noticed is that whenever you assign a new profile a 10/10, the second vote will drive that down enormously. Crown envy anyone?

MyNameHere wrote:An interesting question in my eyes is why there are little to no ratings above 6/10. Do people get envious of each other over profile ratings? Do people do it like me and "opt out" to rate someone else, simply giving a zero for the heck of it? The second interesting thing I noticed is that whenever you assign a new profile a 10/10, the second vote will drive that down enormously. Crown envy everyone?

Fixed that for you

On a serious note, that does actually seem to be what happens. People get annoyed that their ratings are so low that they rate others down. Heck, I know I did that in my first few weeks, but I'm trying to rectify it.

I think a few people rate up or down depending not on the profile but on other factors such as: liking/disliking player, roleplay, or maybe even just deciding what the total vote should be and voting up or down accordingly. Actually, I don't think the profile rating has much to do with intended which I presume is simply as the words states "profile rating"

If I rate a profile at all, and sometimes do, sometimes don't, sometimes I also read it in google translator...I like to rate before I roleplay with the char in game or know the player usually.

Picture=1-2 because I think a picture is easier then writing a description or story.
Description=1-6 or possibly more if the story is also in this.
Story=2-9 depending on interest, correct spelling, obviously knowing the history of the race,island etc.

I rate a 10 if by reading this story and looking at the profile I have an interest in meeting this char in game.

rakust dorenstkzul wrote:Nothing to see here, just an example of a flawless profile.

Mai gawd. 10/10 <3

Just my two cents....

Profile rating to me seems a bit funky. I've come across profiles which I thought were outstanding and had under 5. Other profiles that were a bit less detailed, maybe a picture and a few lines get 1-3's.

When I am reading someone's profile, there is one thing I consider, and that is: Does the profile match the character?

When I rate a profile (And some may think this is wrong) I don't just rate what I am reading or the picture. I also taken into account how well the character matches the description. Which means I don't rate someone until I meet them in game, which I personally think is the best way to get a honest rating. Even if I don't like you and your character, and the profile is written beautifully, I'm not going to let any personal feeling come between that. Because that's like pissing on someone's hard work just because they have an ugly face.

I never liked profile ratings, I never rate any profile.

These ratings are interesting, it's not important to have a top rating, but a bad rating makes me think I need to improve the character profile description.
But it would be much nicer if you'd get some hints what others think you could/should improve, like constructive criticism for example.

By the way, do how many of you rate every profile on the list?
And how many or just characters that you've met ingame like Leon wrote he does?
I must admitd I rarely rate any profile at all.

I rate any profile I see. Except ones in german.

I start with a 10/10 for every profile and deduct one point for everything I don't like (short/no history, short/no descritption, bad/unfitting char pic, no german/english version, grammar, spelling... etc)
Normally I end up with a rating two points higher than the one the profile has *shrugs*

Leon Demelii wrote:...Because that's like pissing on someone's hard work just because they have an ugly face.

That's my problem right there hehe

I was considering running my profiles through google translate but i dont think it is a wise idea considering google track record of translating Mantis issues for me

I rate any profile I can understand. As for how I rate them. I rated all but one of mine a 5 and then I look to other folks and go up or down.. I'm not usually even awake right now BTW, but I had a bad headache last eve. I went to be early and have risen early also. I do try my best to remember not every one (especially me) Has good grammar or spelling. some of us write our profiles in a hurry. i remember being upset when i had to rewrite Whisper and Darius's profiles. i think there was a profile cleaning or something?? annny who! some of us get in a hurry some of us take our time. i do, however, Like to go back every so often and look at my profiles and read them and see what changes i want to make. For Example Whispers profile is crap compared to the original. With that in mind i make changes here and there as i can. I take this in to mind when i read other folks profiles and rate them as to:

- does the profile make me want to learn more about the character?
- does the character strike me as unique or just another : knight, bandit, war hero, etc.

incidentally i haven't gotten round to reading Drathe's profile but i do love the RP.

( you can see i'm not getting along with my shift key right now so.. yeah sorry))

Robert_Thwaite wrote:
I was considering running my profiles through google translate but i dont think it is a wise idea considering google track record of translating Mantis issues for me

Tried that with just one char...never understood what exactly was so funny about the char description but decided a very bad idea since the description was not meant to be funny.

There are usually some very nice people though willing to help you translate the description into German. Even some that know both languages can use some help with basic char description i.e. sometimes the English words are a little "off" where you can tell that English is not the first language...I ignore the difference when grading a profile, but for others that are a little OCD and want it perfect it may also help to ask someone with English the first language.

Hi!


Maybe someone have a good idea to make the rating sys fairer.....
Actually a zero destroyed the best rating...., I think this is not really fair...


Did you have a Idea? Then please use The Mantis



Cheers
Skamato

Remove it. That'll solve the issues.

I've noticed some people just have a chip on their shoulder and seem to get a kick out of giving a profile a 1/10 that clearly does'nt deserve that if it has a good picture and an alright discription.

I hope these certain individuals are not GCSEs test markers or own a company and have many employees who they like to just sack because it makes them feel powerful.

I have always gave profiles a good mark or average. I go on a good picture choice and a discription so i can get a mental image in my head also a good storyline so i can understand the character.

If the person has none of these i simply will not mark it . i will not give them a 1/10 as i expect they are probly working on doing it. to give someone a low mark even after they have made an effort is simply arseholish

YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE! SHAME ON YOU!

So...
After much deliberation we are looking at ways to change the profile rating and any ideas and suggestions would be most appreciated.

One idea that came to mind would be the equivalent of Facebooks "Like" button and your "Rating" would be based on the number of "Likes" you have received so if, for example, your profile received 27 "Likes" then your profile rating would be 27.

There would be 2 options in play. Either "Like" the profile or don't vote, this way nobody can downvote a character that they dislike (either IC or OOC) and there is still some player input into the profile rating system.

Seeing as most players have a forum account named after their character you could always take the time to help the PO by PMing them and offering advice which would be a win-win situation.
The player will be able to make the most of their profile and everyone else has a nice interesting story to read.

Also just to give my input on how i vote on the current system.

I look for a clear description that is detailed and to the point.
One example is here: http://illarion.org/community/us_charpr ... d=704bc083
I gave this an 8, the description, as i said, is clear and to the point. It is quite simply... A description.
There are none of the characters thoughts and feelings and it doesn't put ideas into the readers head with grand claims and assumptions.
Even without the picture i feel i could "see" this character through the description alone

I can visualise the character (who i have never actually met ingame) so that if i was to meet her i'd understand what i was looking at (colour of scales, does she walk with a limp? is there a particularly hard raspiness to her voice? Any visible markings?)

The story is also very clear and indepth. It is not something that i will know as a character but if she was to explain it to me ingame it would be understood much easier.

The reason i never gave it a higher score was that it was hard to read because the story was a single block of text.
If it was broken up into paragraphs making it easier to read i most likely would have scored it a 9 or 10.

This example isn't meant to criticise the PO or the character but it was merely an example of what i personally look for and the character just happened to be online at the time of me writing this.

Robert_Thwaite wrote:Also just to give my input on how i vote on the current system.

I look for a clear description that is detailed and to the point.
One example is here: http://illarion.org/community/us_charpr ... d=704bc083
I gave this an 8, the description, as i said, is clear and to the point. It is quite simply... A description.
There are none of the characters thoughts and feelings and it doesn't put ideas into the readers head with grand claims and assumptions.
Even without the picture i feel i could "see" this character through the description alone

I can visualise the character (who i have never actually met ingame) so that if i was to meet her i'd understand what i was looking at (colour of scales, does she walk with a limp? is there a particularly hard raspiness to her voice? Any visible markings?)

The story is also very clear and indepth. It is not something that i will know as a character but if she was to explain it to me ingame it would be understood much easier.

The reason i never gave it a higher score was that it was hard to read because the story was a single block of text.
If it was broken up into paragraphs making it easier to read i most likely would have scored it a 9 or 10.

This example isn't meant to criticise the PO or the character but it was merely an example of what i personally look for and the character just happened to be online at the time of me writing this.

Am I pretty!?!?!

heheheheheeee.....

Of course you are.
Can't keep my eyes off you!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGFToiLtXro

The Four Seasons FTW!!!!!

Robert_Thwaite wrote:So...
After much deliberation we are looking at ways to change the profile rating and any ideas and suggestions would be most appreciated.

I have a few ideas that could go along with the Like button idea. I do like the "Like or don't vote" options as it keeps things pretty positive. However, I would not tie the number of Likes into a rating. Simply list the number of Likes.

How about also allowing a user to put a comment on the profile, or put a link to PM the profile's owner on the forum? I do believe that the easier it is to actually make a comment to the profile's owner, the more people who will make comments. I am sure that there will be some people who simply leave hateful comments that are in no way constructive, but something like that is likely to happen in any case.

For the comments, I would suggest only allowing one comment per user account per profile and make the comments only visible to the profile's owner. You might also want to only allow a user account to leave comments and Like a profile if they have an active character on the server. The comments should be fairly short, maybe 250 characters, just enough to let the profile's owner know in general what they are doing right or wrong. A user should also be able to delete their own comments on a profile.

Giving users the ability to leave comments on profiles would work best, I think, if there was some way to link a forum account to the website/game account.

Otherwise, I do believe it would be a good idea as an option when creating/editing a profile for the user to enter a vaild forum name for people to contact if they want to comment on the profile. On the public side of the profile there might be a "Leave a Comment" button which is actually a link to PM the profile's owner on the forum. Alternately, there could be a small box somewhere on the profile that simply displays the forum name that the profile's owner would like people to contact for comments.

I am not entirely sure whether it would be a good idea to publicly list the number of Likes on a profile. Maybe the total number of Likes should only be displayed to the profile's owner. That way, profile viewers are not distracted by other users' opinions of the profile being viewed, so the viewer can make up their own mind whether they Like the profile or not.

Grokk wrote:Remove it. That'll solve the issues.

QFT

I love the char description page and the rating is fun, it encourages people to do a good job. I especially liked it when I Mark was a 7 and not a 6 though, but 59 votes woo! Who has the most votes anyways?

I agree with Mariam saying:
"These ratings are interesting, it's not important to have a top rating, but a bad rating makes me think I need to improve the character profile description."

A like or dislike button, which the option to send contstructive criticism to the PO, either via a linked system to the forums, or by some other message system

MarkStrongarm wrote:Who has the most votes anyways?

Don't know, but Djironnyma has the most votes I've seen so far.

rakust dorenstkzul wrote:A like or dislike button, which the option to send contstructive criticism to the PO, either via a linked system to the forums, or by some other message system

In future we will be looking at linking the forum accounts with character accounts so this could well be possible. Not for some time yet though...

I'll keep everyone updated about this in a seperate thread