Natural Magic Room

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Post by Nalzaxx » Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:39 am

@ Kevin: Why must we always fall into the stereotype that mages are the weak weedy ones and fighters are the big muscle bound dolts that seem so intrinsic to the fantasy genre. Who cares if a mage maxes his parry and dodge, his stats will still be lacking in the fighting areas and his performance will reflect this.

The only reason fighter mages seem so strong is because they have spent the time and effort to train their fighting skills to such a degree. Of course they will beat pure fighters who have wonky stats and a quarter of the skill level.

@ Alex: They abuse certain bugs and glitches because, in all honestly, they have become such an integral part of the magic system. Every mage worth his salt knows them and will consider them when facing an opponent. Whole strategies and different tactics have developed around these flaws to such a degree that they may as well be a part of the system.

And lets just get one thing straight, fights are often won through (or lack thereof) player skill, as opposed to those extra few attributes or slightly yellower skills. Just because you choose to stand in one place and hack away at the same spot is not neccessarily a flaw in the system.

@ Saril: +1 to preserving your monopoly. I doubt you would have such a dismissive attitude if you did not have the luxuries you do.

@ GM's: For what it is worth, doubling all casting times would be much more ideal.

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Post by AlexRose » Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:41 am

Yeah I should summon walls round myself, ctrl click someone outside the walls and summon bees on them.

It's player skill.

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Post by Nalzaxx » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:01 am

AlexRose wrote:Yeah I should summon walls round myself, ctrl click someone outside the walls and summon bees on them.

It's player skill.
A player can always interrupt the spell before its completed.
They can run back outside of the mages range.
They can hide behind some solid cover.
They can throw molotovs.
If they already have them targetted they can even use a ranged weapon and hit them.

Or indeed they could attack first.

But ultimately, my point was that these types of bugs should be fixed, as per my original post, because they make mages very overpowered.

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Post by AlexRose » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:05 am

I was actually just giving an example of blatant bug abuse to prove a point, not a real tactic...

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Post by Nalzaxx » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:09 am

And I was giving examples of ways to deal with it, to prove mine.

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Post by AlexRose » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:11 am

The correct way to deal with it is !gm.

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:47 am

Doubling casting times is the exact oposite way of doing this better. It won't make the game more balanced, but it will make mages useless in any fight. Any mage not owning massive amethyst power and high dodge or parry wont be able anymore to ever face a single warrior, unimportant of that warriors skill. The casting time would be too long and any tried spell would be disrupted before you could even cast it half.
That counts also for fights against npc.

Just those who powergamed their melee skills aswell or who got atleast level 3 or 4 amethysts will be able to compete in a given fight. Aslong as the mage isnt secure behind some wall or river.

A better solution would be to weaken the spells for the average amount of skill. the true power should be reached with something of 90 % skill or higher. And then it should be weaker than now. I would say 1/3 weaker.

So someone with a skill of 60% wont be able to kill you off in 3 spells but more 5-7. And a true mastermage with high skill can do so with 4 spells. And that just if you possess really NO magic resistance. This isnt much concidering how damn hard it is to get the runes and to gain a 90 % skill. My highest magic skill is around 80 %, just as an example. And it is not Commotio ;). My second highest magic skill is probably around 60 %. Not every mage around got 98 % skill in all schools and in melee too. there are just very few like that.


A change which will punish weaker mages who hasnt powergamed their chars melee and such and which doesnt affect much the powergamed mages with high melee and alot of gems is not a usefull change. It will just destroy magic even more.


p.s. clicking someone through a wall is bad RP since you need eye contact for targeting a spell. So doing it through a wall by blind clicking is abusing the technic for your own gain. which is against the gamerules ;)

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Post by Nalzaxx » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:50 am

I suggest doubling the casting times as that allows for a single qwan or healing to be sneaked in between the slower monsters (trolls, ogres, concussion skeletons etc). But then if something fast is attacking you, then you rightly cannot annihilate them. I never thought the intention of mages was to be frontline fighters blasting away with spells as warriors stand next to them. If a warrior gets close, that should be the end for the mage. Yet if they keep their distance, as they should, they are still able to be incredibly damaging without rapid fire spamming of spells.

I really think that the statement, this will make mages useless, is completely exaggerated. Surely they will have their use severely limited when someone is next to them. But that is exactly how it should be. We want to encourage more tactical spell use, over constant spamming as quick as you can click. It also provides an emphasis on groups and gives fighters back their use, both as protectors and aggressors.

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Post by Mr. Cromwell » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:55 am

Shandariel el Lysanthrai wrote: That counts also for fights against npc.
*
...
NO MELEE MONSTER HAS GOT WITHIN 2 SQUARES OF A REAL MAGE FOR LIKE 2 YEARS.

Edit: Wasn't it you who broke material summoning spells through abuse anyway?

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Post by Retlak » Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:03 am

In my extensive experience with powergaming. I concurr, double casting times.

Mages will no longer be able to take a warrior that is standing next to them chopping off their limbs with extremely sharp weaponry.

Mages will still get to use spells quickly such as the famous 10 second paralysis, which with double casting times will only be 2 seconds - quick enough to use inebetween warrior strikes and escape even. The difference is that the mage won't be firing 5 qwan spells in that 10 seconds.

A mage should be someone who is smart and uses tactics. Not an idiot who run up to warriors, wait for 2 of their limbs to be cut off and then spam a load of explosions with a healing spell inbetween each move.

-Matt

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:41 am

NO MELEE MONSTER HAS GOT WITHIN 2 SQUARES OF A REAL MAGE FOR LIKE 2 YEARS.
Samantha is encountered by melee monsters regulary if those doesn't appear alone and if she hasn't far enough distance to them. I think with "real" mage you mean powergamed ubermages whose player hold inside knowledge about what does work best for a mage and what not.
Edit: Wasn't it you who broke material summoning spells through abuse anyway?
I was ONE of those, yes. But that is 100 % unimportant for this topic and nothing else then flaming. Thx.


I never thought the intention of mages was to be frontline fighters blasting away with spells as warriors stand next to them
How nice must it be to believe everything is so simple. Honestly, if it comes down to a fight. Who is the first one to be attacked? The warrior protecting you? No. Anyone will immediatelly run at you and start slashing. Having a warrior to protect you won't change much at that. They will simply walk around him and all he can do is pushing the attacker away. Sadly, any mage encountering a fight with another character WILL be attacked in melee. Be it alone or with others. Also, it is simply not possible and realistic to have always someone at your side when going ingame. Making mages to characters which will be easy prey without having friends always at your side will make them sucking pretty much since you are too dependent on others. It won't help the gameplay to make mages a character sort who NEEDS others or they won't ever survive. It will be more sense to balance magic and fighting in a way that it equals each other out.

Also...no mage can stay away from melee warriors without spells. The only possibilitys are the windblow and the teleport. Both take for a mage just enough time to be casted between two attacks. Doubling the casting time would make them taking too long so that any nondodged attack stops the casting

And again, I speak of normal mages. Not the ubermages with high skills, gems and all.


btw.
how comes that those who prefer a double casting time are belonging to those powergaming players who wont be influenced by such a change at all as much as any normal mage char player?
Honestly, with such a change the powergamed ubermages will get even more advantage over the normal mages while not having to fear much change through the double casting time thanks to equipment and skills. A double casting time will hit the normal and average mage, who didnt powergame enough, much much harder then those few others.

Again. Any change of magic which will focus on simple making spells weaker or taking longer will not balance anything out and it will not make it anything better. What we need is not such one sided influence on magic but mostly a good balance with melee and other areas.
Such balance would be also to make more "non battle spells". Most spells currently are meant for fighting or for doing harm. There are very few who doesnt focus on that. And those few are mostly...tricks to play around. This forces any mage to be concentrating on fighting...

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Post by Retlak » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:19 am

50% magic skill = maximum spell efficiency 90% probability lololololol

There goes that arguement.

-Matt

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:27 am

And that is exactly why i said that the difficulty of spells should be raised. Currently anyone with 50 % skill and wands can cast spells at maximum power. But this should be available just for a mage with 90 % skill. THAT has to be changed, and not the casting time. Did you even read my earlier post?

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Post by Nalzaxx » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:40 am

You response shows a very limited understanding of the way mages work ingame at the moment. My proposal is an attempt to curb the enormous power that "uberpowergamed" mages, like my own character, weild. You speak as if I hadn't ever played a mage let alone been using the magic system extensively for over a year in both PvP and PvE. A mage can stay away from other characters in a number of different ways. As I keep trying to stress there is more to this game than yellow skills and rune combinations. Of course they are going to go for the mages first. That's because mages are completely overpowered. Letting said mages stand next to people and blast away happily is NOT the solution. If you are obviously outmatched then perhaps...avoid the fight? Use some of that mage like wisdom and find another solution?

You sound like it should be your god given right to destroy everything without a moments notice.

We honestly do not need any more of an advantage over lesser mages. We can destroy them completely in under 5 seconds currently. Im proposing to increase that to at least 10 seconds and you are up in arms about it.

Furthermore my change requires some simple adjustment of numbers in scripts. It can probably be done in less time than it took you to write your response and requires just as little thought. It is a quick fix that will help to level the playing field before the true balancing begins with the introduction of the VBU. However as that seems to be at least a few more months away from maturation small tweaks can help tide us over.

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:58 am

Wrong. Your overpowered mage possess for sure enough amethysts and other skills so that he still will be overpowered after the change. For him there wouldnt change much.

But any normal mage will be pretty much f***.
You sound like it should be your god given right to destroy everything without a moments notice.
and since I want to be still able to blast anything I am telling you that lowering a spells strength and making a mage more balanced and equal with a warrior is the thing to do. Do you realize how unlogic that sounds? Mages ARE too overpowered currently. But doubling the casting times wont change that for the high end mages like yours. It will just make the average mage pretty useless. And it enforces them to powergame even more.

No. A mage and a warrior has to be balanced out to be equal. Nerfing a mage to make him helpless against any single warrior should he ever encounter them is not the right way to make this game more fun.

And doubling the casting time is for sure no small tweak...that is pretty much a big one. Samantha, as an example for an average mage of higher training, would need 3-4 seconds for a teleport spell after the change. Around the same time for a windblow. That won't make her less overpowered and equal to warriors, it will make her prey. since any double serinja using warrior will slash faster at her then she could cast.

It will make the game pretty much more fun to mageplayers like me if any warrior, even the low skilled ones, can easily kill their chars if they meet them. Right?

But yes...there are those obscure "other methods" to avoid being killed or even attacked. How could i forget <_<.


P.s.
I don't really want to argue with you...I simply don't want mages to be nerfed in a way which is very bad for average mages making them helpless in pvp. I want them to be balanced so that they have the same chances as warriors. Or atleast chances to survive them.

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Post by H.Banestone » Sun Jan 31, 2010 7:23 am

Guys, guys, don't think about this balancing deal from classes direction. That's way too simplistic and outright wrong. All cookie-cutter MMOs do this.
You don't try to balance mages to fighters and to archers, and especially not to monsters.
What you have to balance is usefulness long term. Every profession should have a unique ability that no other profession can do, like you have with crafts.

For example, a mage right now has many spells that accomplish teleportation, summons, distance skills that are not covered by armor resistances. Ability to blow people away with wind is also quite unique, it's like a distant push. And of course, ability to paralyze.

Now, fighters don't actually do anything unique, they are same as peasants with a higher attack rating. A mage can just as well pick up a stick and do what a fighter does, just with less damage. Fighters need something that nobody else can do, for example, maybe an ability to use landscape. Slice a tree in the way of an incoming spell to present an obstacle, or construct debris and barricades on forest terrains, which would reset the mage's targetting and drop them from the fighter, having to find him again. If swords and axes could be used this way, like hatchets, to fall trees and construct obstacles - it would allow making warriors into masters of the wild environment?

Thirdly, archers. Also, a profession that does not shine. Well, the most obvious suggestion is to increase archer's movement speed to allow kiting, and up their attack range to that more than the visible screen. This would allow sniping, although introduce more issues, like helplessness of targets, perhaps a direction of the arrow can be given in a text message. "An arrow strikes you from the north" or something like that. An even better idea is to allow archers to camouflage and become a tree or a rock, until they move.
Added comments after it.

Y'know, everyone joins this game and thinks magic is overpowered. When you actually get it you realise that, other than showing off your magic to people, magic doesn't actually enable you to do that much at all. It saves you money on portal books (which you'll probably end up paying back much more on on mana potions). It enables you to attack from a distance, although if someone gets close to you you're screwed. Other than that.. magic isn't really that useful to have other than for entertaining yourself.
Well Magic is sure as heck more useful than a sword. You know how much a sword allows you to do? Come up to things and ctrl click them, that's it. I keep wondering at some of the bizarre things the concept designers did. 1/5 of the blacksmithing menu is occupied with a wide variety of axes. I am still an apprentice blacksmith, and I already count 12 axes i can craft. Not a single one of them can cut a tree.
Only a specific hatchet. That makes no sense to me. Why not allow all bladed items to cut into wood? Some blades with have more efficiency and cut the tree faster, others will cut is slower due to balancing, like swords. But every axe should cut a tree. You can certainly chop wood with a halberd.

Alas, I doubt GMs even read any of this, as shown in example by Alsaya. If listening and talking to the community is a chore for the gamemaster, and they don't enjoy it, perhaps it's time for job transfer, or time to appoint community managers who would enjoy discussions and read through people's ideas.
If you guys want to boost the player population into area of where Ultima Online is, about 100-150 people turnaround daily, then issues of the community need to be addressed. Reading through the boards, I'm seeing a good number of people had simply quit this otherwise promising game in frustration at futility of user input?

And I agree with Matt/Retlak. Magic should be for tacticians, not for people who play brainless tanks in World of Warcraft.
I also think that jumping should work faster, currently it introduces a long delay, making all combat tactics pretty much unviable.
You cannot jump around your enemy and get at their back, because it takes too long.
To strike someone in the back you pretty much have to have a buddy.

@Shandariel:

Lowering damage and spell strength does not solve paralysis+blast instant kill problem. It just takes you a little longer to kill your paralyzed target. They are still helpless and still dying, just dying a little slower. And you know this.
Upping the casting times solves this problem and will force you to think up a more creative strategy, perhaps use of landscape.

You know why so many people want to nerf mages? Because you guys who play mages, don't share magic, you don't teach it. So people can't try them out and look at your side of the argument. You are showing a piece of white paper to a blind man and telling them it's better than a Picasso painting. What do you expect? It's one thing to treasure magic secrets ICly, but just the way you seem to treat magic like a treasure OOCly, and get so agitated, just makes people think you're simply shaking in your boots trying to pull the blanket your way. Trying to stay unique with a number of abilities the majority don't have, in a game which is unpopular and is mostly unknown on the internet, because of that very reason. It's like riding a pony in the backyard of your house with your little sister watching you, and telling yourself you're the Alexander The Great.

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Post by Kevin Lightdot » Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:38 am

Nalzaxx wrote:@ Kevin: Why must we always fall into the stereotype that mages are the weak weedy ones and fighters are the big muscle bound dolts that seem so intrinsic to the fantasy genre. Who cares if a mage maxes his parry and dodge, his stats will still be lacking in the fighting areas and his performance will reflect this.

The only reason fighter mages seem so strong is because they have spent the time and effort to train their fighting skills to such a degree. Of course they will beat pure fighters who have wonky stats and a quarter of the skill level.
You have a point, but that's why I figured 50% would do.

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:47 am

You know why so many people want to nerf mages? Because you guys who play mages, don't share magic, you don't teach it.
I would teach magic but sadly i can't. Well...not very well. I dont have the skills to teach some of the better runes. I need to powergame first to be able to teach them.

and honestly...I don't use paralyze. I am not good enough in it and it costs me too much mana. Also...before i went into my break paralyze got changed. any spell hitting someone paralyzed freed him from it. I wonder why that got redone. Would it be again like that it wouldnt be such a big problem

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Post by H.Banestone » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:38 am

Agreed.
But then paralyze would need a spell cooldown. So you could not go paralyze-fire-step-paralyze-fire-step.

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Post by Pellandria » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:42 am

I should start a "nerf the druids"topic just to see how the druids will react on this.

Anyway all I have to say to that that magic is not really any overpowered skill anyway, you need to learn magic for a good rl year...and that is if you just play normally and shove in a training session now and than ~and~ you have a teacher who regularly gives you lessons, a figther can be pg'ed in about well maybe a month is what I heard last...to even get all runes you allready need around 3 months for mages, if you powergamed enough skill to get the newer runes that is.

As it stands now a mage is jsut as usefull as his equipment, and that equipment allready costs more than any figther will spend on his equipment...2 serinjahs and a suit of armor aren't even as expensiv as one icebird..or wand..or mastermage robe, furthermore a figther is able to kill things off continously with a greater income than any mage, who will first be stuck with killing small time monster till they might be able to hunt reds. But aside from that there aren't really mages who can live over a figther attacking them, I just saw it a few times that a figther was allready in close combat, when a mage could turn the tides in the last minute, basicly a mage in close combat is death, not to mention that the new "burnout syndrom" burns away mana like nothing as soon as you cast fast and don't take any breaks.

Soo is the mage overpowered...no, the time learning, the equipment and everything else should allow him to just destroy any singlefigther who is stupid enough to take on a mage alone and unless a mage gets more spells with a varity of effects, after all we just got "stop movement, damage focused on a tile , direct damage and little damage over time" I don't see how we could nerf that even more.
Now taking in consideration how much a druid can make I think its fair to say that mages are probably the most useless of the magic crafts, allready the sketched out priest system gives a priest more power than a mage has, so we should make the Mage a damage dealer, how the devs seem to intend him anyway, so gimme that 1 minute cast time "I kill you all suckers" spell...

Ohh and concerning those Mages who train parry and dogde...kill their stats please...thats just annoying as hell.

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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:49 am

Agreed.
But then paralyze would need a spell cooldown. So you could not go paralyze-fire-step-paralyze-fire-step.
Not with weaker attack spells. Also, a paralyze spell costs quite some mana. So casting paralyze, attack spell, paralyze, will burn you out of mana pretty soon. and should damage spells be made weaker it will give the warrior quite a equal chance since there will be enough time between a damage spell and a paralyze to attack. concidering the mage doesnt have trained dodge skill. Like some of the current ubermages.

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Post by Juliana D'cheyne » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:18 pm

Well, I have learned some interesting things reading this thread. A mage can fight without getting hit by a monster at least once :oops: (..and have barely gotten away when spells don't work due to being hit back), of course am not good with mage skills like some either :wink: . Not ever into the 'fighting" aspect with my mage anyway, it would be very nice if they could do something useful besides heal or gate and I hope healing isn't removed. Playing a mage as weak except for magic, it wouldn't bother me if all fighting skill is removed as long as a mage can protect themselves from hits (like the wall). Apparently fast reflexes are needed to actually be able to fight much with a mage?

Ultimately, it seems to me the "mage overpowered" philosophy may be due to 1. bugs mentioned in the system which may be solved with the VBU 2. how fast the reflexes are of the PO .. allowing more time between spells seems to be an answer possibly? 3. Mages who due to stats are suppose not to compete with fighters ... still don't but DO have some fighter ability...possibly giving a max of 50% as Kevin suggested would be helpful, yet if a script was in place to not allow magic a certain time after steel is used would this also be an alternative? Weakening or nerfing the spells yet again seems to me the wrong answer as mages already require so much ig time to even achieve the runes...and much more to PG them. It always seemed like a conundrum to me that roleplay was considered important for a mage char yet the PG requirements were more then most other chars....at least IMO.

As an aside... with mages having some fighter stats, isn't it likely to imagine some fighters with magic resis?

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Post by Llama » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:59 pm

Juliana D'cheyne wrote:As an aside... with mages having some fighter stats, isn't it likely to imagine some fighters with magic resis?
To gain magic resistance you have to SERIOUSLY powergame it.

By powergame I mean "Do something illogical which will increase your skill"

Monsters attack too powerfully, so need to have a way to stay alive long enough for them not to kill you. So you either get a mage buddy to stay healing you, or you block them off in some way, go out, get hit, heal, go back in.

or you get a mage buddy to stay casting on you.

However, magic resistance also counts for HEALS. So a fighter with magic resistance can't get mage healed in combat = dead.

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Post by Retlak » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:07 pm

However, magic resistance also counts for HEALS. So a fighter with magic resistance can't get mage healed in combat = dead.
This is completely false.

-Matt

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Post by Llama » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:10 pm

Retlak wrote:
However, magic resistance also counts for HEALS. So a fighter with magic resistance can't get mage healed in combat = dead.
This is completely false.

-Matt
Oh? Good, lets go PG then!

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Post by Velisai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:35 pm

1. A fighter maybe can be skilled up in about a month, but I know of only 3 players who ever did that. My own is still in training since my join date and I'm one of the most active players here (and know very well how to PG certain skills as fast as possible).

2. Equipment cost:
What's a drow armor with helmet and sword worth? About 6 gold coins? 10? Does it even have a price? If we talk best possible equipment, fighters are the more expensive choice and 99,9% will never even see that kind of items, while every mage seems to have an elemental wand, icebird and all the other stuff apart from archmage rings.

3. Druids:
Alchemy is quite powerful, but the difference is that a mage can cast practically constantly, while a druid needs to spend hours in the wilderness, mostly alone, to find the herbs for one of the high-end potions. There's also no guarantee that the herbs you find are any good or that you find them at all. Then each kind of herb has it's own season in which it grows, so you can't just go and look for what you need anytime you need it, but often have to wait several real life weeks.
Also each potion costs at least 125 copper, not counting time invested and herbs used.

Even for common herbs and the easiest potions, preparing them is a major pain in the ass and you have to do it over and over no end in sight, while a mage once skilled, can use spells anytime he wishes and doesn't need to invest anything at all into them, but a short while of mana regeneration. (Try drag-click-hold-drag-click-click/drag 100 times in a row knowing you'll have to do it again in a few days and for the rest of your char's life and then tell me again you're tired of PGing magic skills.)
And since we mostly talk about killing ability here, how many times have you seen a druid blow someone up with explosives? Those have an AoE by the way and can never be used at close range at all, at least as far as I know.

As for "skilling" an alchemist char, to unlock all his abilities you need to PG library research to a pretty high level, min. 75% then sacrifice an ungodly number of skill levels in randomly chosen skills again for the knowledge. You can get along with only a part of the high-end recipes, but if you want every of them to the last, you might even end up forgetting half of your vocabulary, not to mention your runes and other skills.

And when that's done, you need to actually think, because alchemists aren't handed recipes in an instantly usable form, but need to find out on their own how to get a certain combination of essences by mixing herbs and also how to do it efficiently. For some that's interesting, for some not. I personally like it that way.

So in conclusion:
Each class has its own drawbacks in my opinion and mages should be rare and should own a fighter 1 on 1 in most cases as it is now. Hating and fearing mages is good for RP, as their high potential for power is one of the things, that make them interesting. If anyone could learn the runes on their own, which would then be as useless as archery, this class would die out completely.
I just as much hate to hear mage players whining about how useless or PG intensive their class is though, because the same can be said of fighters and alchemists as well, if you only see the negative sides.

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Post by AlexRose » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:40 pm

Drow stuff is uncraftable and undroppable so of course that's expensive. It's expensive because it's rare.

If we had drow spawns that dropped drow weapons ig it would no longer be expensive.

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Post by Velisai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:13 pm

AlexRose wrote:Drow stuff is uncraftable and undroppable so of course that's expensive. It's expensive because it's rare.

If we had drow spawns that dropped drow weapons ig it would no longer be expensive.
Stating widely known facts is so enlightening.

You missed the point, which was that rare equipment for fighters, generally is less available and more expensive than rare mage equipment.
It isn't only drow things, but also magical broadswords, magical dwarven axes and some of the fire weapons. Also magical weapons are not repairable and even if you get your hands on them, they will break much sooner than a mage's wand for example.

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Post by Juliana D'cheyne » Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:24 pm

Having a fighter, mage and druid char *g* I can definitely say a fighter is easier to train. Fighters don't need special equipment to function like mages.... not loosing all your mana on one spell and waiting for it to build. I also agree druids/alchemy is a lot of PGing and takes copper and lots of time to make even one potion ...so the "overpowered" alchemist is non-existent unless rich and ig forever.

(edited for spelling *g* )
Last edited by Juliana D'cheyne on Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Illarion e.V.: Support Member
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Post by Shandariel el Lysanthrai » Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:32 pm

Quote:
However, magic resistance also counts for HEALS. So a fighter with magic resistance can't get mage healed in combat = dead.

This is completely false.

-Matt
Your "completly false" is completly false. With my other char my magic resistance got raised through healing spells casted by a friendly mage. This means healing IS affecting the magic resistance aswell. Just not if you cast it on yourself. But when other mages cast it on you.
Of course that doesnt matter if you got 60 - 80 % magic resistance and the mage casting has 90% or more in the magic school with healing spells. He is strong enough then to still cast on you

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