What happened to the Forum Rock'n Roll?

Everything about Illarion that fits nowhere else. / Alles über Illarion was inhaltlich in kein anderes Board passt.

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Pyrrho
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Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 10:28 pm
Location: <+Bloodraven>shut the smile up

Post by Pyrrho »

Just stop pretending like it was not the case and that , when the game design of the world has actually been done by the players. Yes, the staff are very much guilty of giving the players this freedom; however if you think the child is a bastard, then you should take into account that like with most freedoms, there is one who gives the freedom and other who makes what he wants with it. The decentralized nature of the island is the fault of the playerbase itself, period.
The players designed the new map to have points of interest all across, from one end to the other? If you want to give the players freedom, why not just make the map as big as possible then? Why not let non-guilds build their own houses?
If there was no interest on behalf of the players in these various groups, if there was no interest on behalf of the players to spend considerable amounts of their time and effort in creating these story-telling and roleplay settings, then this would not have been done.
Sure, people have taken advantage of a larger map, why not? If the option is there, you might as well use it. And yes, being able to build/own land does add something to the game. However, most of the places I've been to are usually empty. It appears you have to be "in the know" to find a place to RP. I can't imagine how hard it must be to not ever having played, jump into the game. Its daunting for old players, its probably more daunting for new.
But anyway, it seems to me that you're not really interested in a world in which to RP with other players, but rather a small graphical lounge or chatroom where you can hang around and be entertained by others. I'm sorry, but your constant attitude towards making any effort on your own behalf, even if that includes walking a minute or two to another player (because realistically, walking around is fast in this game and portals take you to all the important locations anyway). What seems to be good game design to you is simply to force all characters to be at the same location by removing any choice or alternatives. That may very well have its merits in bringing players together, but may fail at creating an interesting world.
Actually, walking from one city to another (adjacent) takes a good ten minutes or so, and thats if you know where you are going. Then when you get there, you walk around a barren city and move on to the next. Most of the players I meet are usually crafting or collecting supplies, they do RP yes, but they still have a goal in mind. I am okay with this, because I understand the craft system needs you to do this. I've also noted that the travel system requires money, money which requires and investment, too much of an investment for such little gains. So now you have to spend more than 10 minutes to get funds to buy a book to travel to an empty city when you could've just wasted your ten minutes walking there. Note that many of these new additions to the worlds are off limits. Most of these exciting buildings I find that may have people in them are locked. The world was just as interesting in the old client as it is now. Groups still functioned, power still changed, and events still happened. This could still work with a more condensed approach and have wilds/land to build outside.

I've also been arguing that if you dont invest a large amount of time into the system, the game is a virtual chatroom, which I am against. Not only that, even if you use it as a graphical IRC, you still have to put forth effort and at times get no reward.

I'm not arguing for a smaller world in the sense of less sights, just less travel time. Now, not only that, as I have read many of the guilds are going inactive. So, when they did prosper and did use the function of the large map, this would be fine. It seems like now the size of the map is a detriment, especially to new players who dont really know whats going on.

The point is, that there's no anti-gravity which by force pulls the players away from the center and tosses them in the far corners of the island.
Yes there is, certain materials are only available in certain places. This alone forces players to venture out to different places on the island.
If the individual settings created by others are more interesting than the prospect of finding quick RP (which could be done by players simply going, by agreement, to the same spot to look for it) then the whole premise of your argument
The thing you seem to miss is that the roleplay in Illarion has (thus far) been about freedom of the players to roleplay and shape the world
You can shape a world smaller than the one we have.
Are there too many settings too far apart (or alternatively, too few players)? Yes. Who is to blame for that? Players.
It is not the players totally. In the first case, the new map pretty much had areas of interest in all corners with vast stretches, the damage was already done and not by the players. In the other case, players losing interest is not their fault.
Other way around, it would be people like you suffocating the storylines and RP of others by forcing them into the same lounge and preventing them from shaping the world (or alternatively, keeping the world dull and stagnant, as opposed to dull and changing Wink). Anyway, the thing with freedom is that you're free to do your own thing.
As we've stated before, you can't please everyone. You can also find a balance, and it certainly isn't struck at this moment.
You are completely within your powers to try and find the best remedy for the situation. Smile
What do you think I am doing right now?


EDIT: I would also like to stress, while I think the map is too large at the moment, it is the least of what I think is wrong with the current game.
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Arvemor
Posts: 599
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:36 pm

Post by Arvemor »

Since these posts are all over the place...(blames and contradicting opinions-hey what can you expect, we're human!) is it possible we can put some numbers to this stuff...a poll or something on the topic of "What is your biggest problem with Illarion!?"
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Estralis Seborian
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Post by Estralis Seborian »

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Arvemor
Posts: 599
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:36 pm

Post by Arvemor »

Woo, someone listened to me!



:P
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Miklorius
Posts: 963
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 3:10 pm
Location: Germany

Post by Miklorius »

If I read Estralis' bug collection thread, you can get the impression that the whole game is broken. So maybe it would be a good idea to fix some things piece by piece and not always in "very big updates" which usually break the game more in the first time. And maybe piss off even more players which wouldn't be any good to our small and IMO also divided player base: the longtime/older players and "new" ones which seem not interesting that much in RP (or the forums, to come back to topic). I hope the VBU will bring Illarion back on its own course or at least on one you can identify - "Echt-Rollenspiel", WoW-Clone, PG-Grindgame...?
Keikan Hiru
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Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2003 5:46 pm

Post by Keikan Hiru »

We already had exhausting explainations why this is going to be wrapped up in one big update instead of several smaller ones:

In short: Too many interdependencies of all parts involved, which makes it impossible to implement one thing without the other.
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