Race/Armor benefits

Everything about Illarion that fits nowhere else. / Alles über Illarion was inhaltlich in kein anderes Board passt.

Moderators: Gamemasters, Community Managers

Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:39 am

Post by bdgdkay » Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:21 pm

Race/Armor benefits

Im not sure if this has been implemented, or if it will be in the future, but i was wondering if it would be possible that a certain races armor has special benefits for certain races.

For example, Dwarven state armor be just as good for the dwarves as elven silversteel to the elves. This would get rid of the dwarves running around in silversteel and such.

Also, possibly implement some more kinds of race armors, like orcen, halfling, lizard, etc. So that they can have the same benefits as everyone else.

Dont know.. just thought is might be a good idea?

Discuss

Posts: 77
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:19 pm
Location: Varshikar

Post by Roland Tafar » Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:36 pm

Ich kann nicht erkennen, dass die vorgeschlagenen Änderungen Spielspaß oder das RP fördern.
Von daher halte ich sie für entbehrlich, bis eine vollständige Überarbeitung z. B. des Kampfsystems in Angriff genommen wird.

Developer
Posts: 7638
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 9:51 am

Post by Nitram » Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:40 pm

There was this idea but since we hardly have the possiblity to include new items and we do not have racial fixed items for each race, that idea will be not implemented. In case that ever changes, it will be done maybe.

Nitram

Developer
Posts: 12205
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2004 9:14 pm
Location: Sir Postalot

Post by Estralis Seborian » Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:17 pm

One might add that in future, the "everyone wields dual serinjah and is clad in silversteel"-problem will be solved. Various fighting stances and armor combinations will be useful, depending on the situation. A swift assasine with dual daggers in leather armor can pose a threat to a plate mailed hammer wielding (halfling) tank.

Racial items were proposed before, but until now, I think we should more or less rely on RP skills of players and just provide the options without restricting the game too much.

Posts: 641
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2008 10:42 pm
Location: Club Prententious

Post by Sssari » Sat Jan 31, 2009 12:13 am

Estralis Seborian wrote:One might add that in future, the "everyone wields dual serinjah and is clad in silversteel"-problem will be solved. Various fighting stances and armor combinations will be useful, depending on the situation. A swift assasine with dual daggers in leather armor can pose a threat to a plate mailed hammer wielding (halfling) tank.

Racial items were proposed before, but until now, I think we should more or less rely on RP skills of players and just provide the options without restricting the game too much.
Bout time :wink: , I can't wait to hear more about what you have plan.

Posts: 405
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:14 pm
Location: Just right here

Post by Rekarafi » Sat Jan 31, 2009 12:29 am

Mal ne Frage nebenbei, die auch mit dem Thema zu tun hat.
Nimmt man z.B. ne Elben-Silberstahl Rüstung, kann die nur von Elben gefertigt werden oder sind auch Zwerge dazu in der Lage?
Ersteres fänd ich besser, da wäre es wirklich mal wichtig auch unter anderen Rassen Dinge zu Schmieden, nich ein Zwerg macht Rüstungen aus aller Welt.
Somit muss wer, der in eine Silberstahlrüstung reinschlüpfen will, einen Elben dafür fragen.
Sollte somit rassenspezifische Schmiedeausrüstung geben, aber auch Dinge, die jeder schmieden kann (kurzschwert ect)
Wenns das schon gibt reicht ne kurze Notiz :D
~danke im Vorraus~

Posts: 986
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 3:57 pm
Location: http://www.acrobatis-pyrum.de.vu

Post by Kranek » Sat Jan 31, 2009 1:05 am

@Rekafari:
Problem wäre folgendes: Wenn nur Elben so eine schmieden können...wo kriegt man dann einen Elbischen Schmiedemeister her? Die sind zu dünn gesäht dafür...
Außerdem: Wenn schon denn schon, also spezifische Schmiedewaren für jede Rasse. Nur hätten wir dafür nich genug Items...

Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:39 am

Post by bdgdkay » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:37 am

I thought about what you said, Esty, about how the assassin could beat the heavy armorred tank. The problem is right now, what can beat the assassin then?

In order to balance out the fighting system completely, you need to make it into a rock paper scissors style of game.
-Make it so that the assassin can beat the tank
-the tank can beat fighting style Q
-Fighting style Q can beat the assassin.

If that is how it becomes, then at one point everyone might be an assassin, but then someone gets the idea to be fighting style Q, and people start changing to that when they see hwo good it is, but then someone else tries being the 'tank', and starts winning that way, and people start fighting like that, only to be found they can be beat by the assassin again. Therefore, each person would start choosing their own fightin style, in hopes that the next person they come across wouldnt be the one that can beat the.

Discuss

Posts: 487
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2008 3:23 pm
Location: Conflict inc.

Post by Sundo Raca » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:42 am

I dont think a system like this has any real value. It certainly wouldnt improve the game for me, and sounds like a waste of time/energy.

Illarion is good at creating a diverse roleplaying environment, not complex fighting systems. Keep it that way. :P

Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:39 am

Post by bdgdkay » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:47 am

yes... but each person who chooses to be a warrior choosing the exact same thing isnt quiet a diverse roleplay environment. You might say that to make it more diverse, each person should take it upon themselves to use other fighting styles, but who in their right mind is going to go out and use different techniques that they know are going to make them lose for the sake of roleplay?

Posts: 487
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2008 3:23 pm
Location: Conflict inc.

Post by Sundo Raca » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:51 am

Because not every fight has to be engined, my friend.

edit: and anyway, you can rp different styles of fighting, with personal traits within the engined format.

Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:39 am

Post by bdgdkay » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:54 am

But, have you ever tried out roleplaying an invasion of demons? Also, if any larger fight ever would occur, it would get very confusing with dozens of long #me's filling the screen. Yes, Roleplayed fights are important, and ive got to say, some of the most satisfying have been when i rped that fight with you at elizas, But in all practicality, there are plenty of needs for engine based fights

Posts: 1961
Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 1:41 am
Location: My religion is better then the one Alex taunts you to join! Update: Alex secretly worships me.

Post by Julius » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:56 am

Endorsed by Jewls.

Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:23 am

Post by Salhari » Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:21 am

bdgdkay wrote:
In order to balance out the fighting system completely, you need to make it into a rock paper scissors style of game.
-Make it so that the assassin can beat the tank
-the tank can beat fighting style Q
-Fighting style Q can beat the assassin.
this, i like.

Posts: 1961
Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 1:41 am
Location: My religion is better then the one Alex taunts you to join! Update: Alex secretly worships me.

Post by Julius » Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:39 am

If the assassin can beat the Tank and the tank can beat Mister Q, how the hell would Q be able to beat the Assassin? :(

Posts: 1139
Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 2:52 pm
Location: Ich warte auf NIX

Post by Faladron » Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:42 am

Julius wrote:If the assassin can beat the Tank and the tank can beat Mister Q, how the hell would Q be able to beat the Assassin? :(
rock-paper-scissors

Posts: 1961
Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 1:41 am
Location: My religion is better then the one Alex taunts you to join! Update: Alex secretly worships me.

Post by Julius » Sat Jan 31, 2009 5:07 am

Rocks are usually in a outside environment. If a piece of paper is placed on top of a rock, due to it's thin nature, the wind will blow it away. Try it sometime.

Posts: 619
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 6:45 pm

Post by Evan Ross » Sat Jan 31, 2009 5:15 am

PO Julius makes a fair point.

Posts: 405
Joined: Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:14 pm
Location: Just right here

Post by Rekarafi » Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:15 am

Kranek wrote:@Rekafari:
Problem wäre folgendes: Wenn nur Elben so eine schmieden können...wo kriegt man dann einen Elbischen Schmiedemeister her? Die sind zu dünn gesäht dafür...
Außerdem: Wenn schon denn schon, also spezifische Schmiedewaren für jede Rasse. Nur hätten wir dafür nich genug Items...
Nunja, das ists ja was ich meine, man sollte mehr dieser items erstellen.
Dinge, die jeder schmeiden kann, gibts genug.
Aber Dinge wie "Zwergenbreitschwert" oder "Orkenhammer" sowie Armbrüste fänd ich ne gute Idee.Sollte es eigentlich geben, Bögen zum Schmieden. Die dann eben mit Metallbolzen feuern.
Und es wäre ja nur realistisch, das wenn die schmiedemeister dünn gesäht sind, das man eben suchen muss um sone Rüstung zu bekommen.

Posts: 986
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 3:57 pm
Location: http://www.acrobatis-pyrum.de.vu

Post by Kranek » Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:56 am

Neue Items können im Moment NICHT eingebaut werden. Dazu wäre
1) eine Grafik nötig (ham wir kaum welche)
2) ein Clientupdate damit es eingebaut wird (geht zurzeit nich)

Und geschmiedete Bögen...halte ich nicht für sinnvoll...
Soweit ich weiß sind geschmiedete Bögen Fantasyprodukte (s. Morrowind: Eisenbogen etc.). Ne Armbrust wäre wieder was anderes...da weiß ich aber au nich wie das im System grad aussieht...

Developer
Posts: 7638
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 9:51 am

Post by Nitram » Sat Jan 31, 2009 1:54 pm

We can't include new items currently and if we can we have other things to do then new weapons because we really have enougth of those. Those things like racial weapons and armors are a nice thing but on the very bottom of the priority list.

And Julius: Mister Q will be able to beat the assassin as soon as the next release of the fighting system is ready.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wir können im Augenblick keine neuen Items einbauen und selbst wenn wir es könnten hätten wir andere Dinge zu tun als neue Waffen einzubauen weil wir von denen nun wirklich genug haben. Sachen wie Rassen bezogene Waffen und Rüstungen sind nette Spielzeuge aber das hat bestenfalls eine sehr geringe Priorität.

Und Julius: Herr Q wird in der Lage sein den Attentäter zu schlagen sobald die nächste Version des Kampfsystem fertig ist.

Nitram

Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:43 am
Location: Nichts ist drinnen, nichts ist draußen, was drinnen ist ist draußen, was draußen ist ist drinnen.

Post by Thanseus Valerian » Sat Jan 31, 2009 2:32 pm

Wenn sowas wie Rassenspezifische Gegenstände eingeführt wird wäre ich aber dafür die ganzen Werte zu überarbeiten.
Zurzeit kann man eh nix anderes als ein Serinjahschwert gebrauchen, obwohl ich mal gern meine Zwergenäxte wieder benutzen würde.

Posts: 986
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 3:57 pm
Location: http://www.acrobatis-pyrum.de.vu

Post by Kranek » Sat Jan 31, 2009 2:42 pm

@Thanseus:
Liest du eig au mal im Forum? In bald einem Dutzend Threads wurde bereits geschrieben dass daran gearbeitet wird!

Posts: 4790
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:18 pm
Location: Megajiggawhat?

Post by AlexRose » Sat Jan 31, 2009 5:36 pm

Julius wrote:Rocks are usually in a outside environment. If a piece of paper is placed on top of a rock, due to it's thin nature, the wind will blow it away. Try it sometime.
Mister X is very fast and very small
Mister Y does very slow attacks with a giant mace.
Mister Z is in the middle


Mister X is small and fast, so Mister Y can't hit him, so X backstabs Y in the heart and kills him. Mister Y is very strong, and although he is slow, Mister Z isn't quite fast enough to avoid him swinging his mace along the floor and dies before he can get near enough to attack Y. Mister X may be fast, but as Mister Z is in the middle he can keep up with him and defend his back, then strike to kill Mister X with ease.

X>Y>Z>X etc.

Or, think of TF2:
Pyro generally beats spy, spy generally beats engie with sentry, engie with sentry generally beats pyro.

Posts: 1961
Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 1:41 am
Location: My religion is better then the one Alex taunts you to join! Update: Alex secretly worships me.

Post by Julius » Sat Jan 31, 2009 8:13 pm

Still don't see your point. In rl, tell Christian Bale (middle) to duke it out with Usain Bolt (cheetah like quickness) and see the results. I don't like the idea of "Group A *always* gets raped by Group B". Why? Because as I've stated with other proposals, the current attribute system already achieves this. For example, my character would probably be a rag tagged middle type of build. In a duel against a heavy mace wielding warrior with the same skills in their respective builds, he'd probably lose. A high agility, speed build without maxed dodge would probably be beat if he used a Shield. However, you can't tell me that luck never played a part in duels. A 100 percent succession rate is repetitive as hell.

People seem to forget how well the current attribute system actually works. The only reason it might not work is because, as a few other players have noted to me through quotes, our own gms don't know the stat system as well as they think they might. Because of that, the player community (the newer players especially) is stuck with character builds (Knight, etc) that stink for warriors.

If you want this system to work, let the players who currently own warriors to change their attributes accordingly. Why? Because the fighting system has changed at least 4 times since 2007. Because of this, attributes that were good in those systems are now so outdated that you can hardly call them any of the three aforementioned skill sets. However, proper attributes for each skill set should be issued (and I mean proper, no 8 essence on a warrior/9 will power).

If your going to implant something like that "A beats B, B beats C, C beats A", it's ignorant to install it any time in the near future because of the immense changes that always occur with the system.

Posts: 177
Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:56 pm

Post by Hawkmoon » Sat Jan 31, 2009 8:56 pm

Julius wrote:Still don't see your point. In rl, tell Christian Bale (middle) to duke it out with Usain Bolt (cheetah like quickness) and see the results. I don't like the idea of "Group A *always* gets raped by Group B". Why? Because as I've stated with other proposals, the current attribute system already achieves this. For example, my character would probably be a rag tagged middle type of build. In a duel against a heavy mace wielding warrior with the same skills in their respective builds, he'd probably lose. A high agility, speed build without maxed dodge would probably be beat if he used a Shield. However, you can't tell me that luck never played a part in duels. A 100 percent succession rate is repetitive as hell.

People seem to forget how well the current attribute system actually works. The only reason it might not work is because, as a few other players have noted to me through quotes, our own gms don't know the stat system as well as they think they might. Because of that, the player community (the newer players especially) is stuck with character builds (Knight, etc) that stink for warriors.

If you want this system to work, let the players who currently own warriors to change their attributes accordingly. Why? Because the fighting system has changed at least 4 times since 2007. Because of this, attributes that were good in those systems are now so outdated that you can hardly call them any of the three aforementioned skill sets. However, proper attributes for each skill set should be issued (and I mean proper, no 8 essence on a warrior/9 will power).

If your going to implant something like that "A beats B, B beats C, C beats A", it's ignorant to install it any time in the near future because of the immense changes that always occur with the system.
Hey... Should people not set the attributes that suits the char and not that is best for the current system? Just wondering...

Posts: 1961
Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 1:41 am
Location: My religion is better then the one Alex taunts you to join! Update: Alex secretly worships me.

Post by Julius » Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:17 pm

I've never rped by stats. Most people do, other people don't. Quite frankly, if you did, most characters would either be scholars or unable to read at all.

Posts: 1632
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:14 am

Post by Juliana D'cheyne » Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:29 pm

Julius wrote:I've never rped by stats. Most people do, other people don't. Quite frankly, if you did, most characters would either be scholars or unable to read at all.
..or so lacking in wisdom their actions wouldn't make any sense.... wait..

sorry, couldn't resist :oops: ..yet am NOT talking of anyone in particular

On topic, the idea as a whole is good but may be hard to implement and with the new armor/weapon system coming, IMO it would be better to wait on any other ideas for armor/weapons.

Return to “General / Allgemeines (Player Forum)”

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
Designed by ST Software.