Baby graphic and Different Avatars

Drathe · Post by **Drathe** » Sat Oct 11, 2008 10:55 pm

I had a rare moment of mental clarity and instead of filling it with useful life motivating and changing stuff. I.E. ‘Where should I go with my life’ and, ‘How am I going to pay these bills.’ I thought of Illarion.

Clothed Avatars: I am well aware of the complexities and time required to make it so that characters look different and show in graphical terms what clothes they wear. SO... Each race and sex have 3 character avatars, they change depending on what clothes they wear. For example, shirts and trousers or dress and blouse on the in game doll would have the avatar we have now. Any type of armour worn would have a similar avatar but with armour on. The third avatar would be fancy clothes for a posh do. It does not show exactly what the character wears, the text description is for that, it just gives an overall idea to see graphically. I think it would help to mix up the look of players in game without overly complex scripting and hundreds of new graphics and compliment the description text. I also think it would give tailors their first genuine in game need, nice clothes?

Baby Graphic... seems to be a baby boom in town and with the days getting shorter and the farming season over I think it’s only going to get worse. Martin how about a baby graphic? A small graphic of a baby swaddled in cloth to be held in a characters hand or left abandoned in a bush to find. Maybe not even see a ‘baby’ per say (don’t want a different one for each race) just something that looks like a wrapped up baby shape with the item name ‘baby’ purely for RP. It could be stolen and taken at knife point or... whatever the heart desires. Just simple inanimate game object to be used as an RP tool. Given out or taken away by GMS or some such.
Ok... I’m done...spent.

Fianna Heneghan · Post by **Fianna Heneghan** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 1:08 am

I like the idea of a baby object existing in game. It could be a two-handed item except for characters with high dexterity. You'd have to stuff the baby in your bag or depot in order to craft or fight.

Rhianna Morgan · Post by **Rhianna Morgan** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 1:37 am

Baby graphics sounds fantastic. I think the clothing thing will be too difficult, because you will need too many graphics...

But having a baby item given out by GMs, that would be so wonderful! Perhaps one could mark the item like a bag. Just to make sure you don't switch them (f.e. with twins, stolen babies, whatever...)

Hope we can really inplement this!!!

Skaalib Drurr · Post by **Skaalib Drurr** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:21 am

It sounds pretty pointless to me.
People just rp it now and I cant see anything wrong with that.
If you insist on doing something technically unsupported (much like sitting on a chair) it should be rp'ed.
As for this 'object' that is just a block.....Why not just use a bag and label it 'baby' if you must. Or a stone block even....

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:16 am

PO Skaalib wins.

Rhianna Morgan · Post by **Rhianna Morgan** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:45 pm

No, actually he does not. One can't carry some random object around and pretend it is a baby rp-wise. If I meet someone with a stone block in her hand, I won't think it is a baby! I will think she carries a stone around, what looks a bit like a stupid action, but well, she might be a miner or whatever...

Bags are also a problem, because you can't take them in your hand, and you can't carry them in your belt as well. I think a baby item would be wonderful, being carried in your hands it makes sure everyone who *looks at you* at once notices you have a child in your arms. Something like this would certainly be noticed when you walk on the street and meet a random person.

But I don't think making the baby item a two-handed item is a good idea. Here is why: you actually CAN carry a baby around and have something in your free hand as well. You also can carry two older babies at once, putting them both each on one of your hips. A baby item would not spoil rp, but help people to get a first impression of the mother/father, by just looking at them.
Also rping a kidnapping would be easier, as you really *have* the item baby XY, and others can notice by simply *looking at* you.

Skaalib Drurr · Post by **Skaalib Drurr** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:47 pm

Well get a key and label it baby then. This kind of stuff really doesn't matter very much.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:51 pm

a key? yes... "hey look at my baby! its called mterinator cause its made of iron!"

just make a small graphic and put it ingame! i can see no problems there!

Skaalib Drurr · Post by **Skaalib Drurr** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:55 pm

There's just far more pressing things for these guys to work on.
There is no need for this to come in. There is role playing for it.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:02 pm

yes, you are right...making a small graphic would make so much trouble...i think i have to help the poor devs and make it my own...

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:35 pm

There is no need for a baby graphic... No graphic can be as good as emotes created by people's imagination. -> Roleplay it.
Of course not with a stone...

And paperdolling...well, we're all waiting for it for quite some time. But such a "temporary solution" still requires some effort which isn't reasonable.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:40 pm

you can still play it...its for indicating the baby *me looks at man. he has a baby in his arms*

Skaalib Drurr · Post by **Skaalib Drurr** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:44 pm

This is just such a pharse. (cue hysterical laughter)
I mean, in a sense its a good idea, if babies were actually supported by the engine, and if it represented somekind of advantage to have these, and if this wasn't a roleplaying game.

Wait a second! All those things are true, so pointless idea.

Paperdolling would be pretty good in a way, but really limiting in others.

Drathe · Post by **Drathe** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:39 pm

A mixed review, but if I might say Skaalib Drurr, Pharse why have clothes or tavern drinks when they are infact Rp'ed and described in many a character descriptions. This IS a graphical game at its root. I thought a little diversity in character looks and an addition 'graphical tool' to supplement a well used RP scenario would benefit and open up more possibilities for RP no? I.E Kidnap, finding a hidden child, when a player examines another it is to see they hold a child, ah well just a thought.

Just to finish I would like to say snowballs? Why would avatars or a baby graphic be any less supported by the game engine than them. They are a pointless addition to the game that have always been RP’ed before and required a new graphic and scritping. But! Are a nice addition to the game.

As a side note, on almost every suggestion on this forum why is the amount of work devs have to do for you the player to decide? Or an issue for you to worry about within reason. If the players like it and the Devs likewise is it not up to them to choose what they work on? I.E. Snow balls, a pointless but nice addition to the game that required a graphic and scripting. I thought the idea of this forum was for us to discuss what we liked and thought and THEM to tell us if its possible or time workable?

Bellringer · Post by **Bellringer** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:52 pm

Baby graphics ftw.

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:00 pm

Drathe wrote:As a side note, on almost every suggestion on this forum why is the amount of work devs have to do for you the player to decide

Because I don't play currently Illarion but help develping it so I have a slightly better insight in those things.

Drathe · Post by **Drathe** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:08 pm

Pharse, I think you should be more responisble in your replies as you are one of the faces of the Dev team. Other than the ’amount of work’ which I dont in my limited understanding as a simple player of the game know. Why is it such a bad idea IF enough people like and want it? Why would it be more work per say than snowballs?

What do you think about the avatar changes from a Devs point of view.

pharse · Post by **pharse** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:32 pm

See, the "Developers" are mostly a bunch of unorganised solitary people. This is not an enterprise or anything similar. Sometimes they work well together, sometimes not. It's an up and down of progress.
E.g. I didn't even know that there are snowballs until I read it in your reply and then searched for it in the scripts. The code is minimal and perhaps there was already the graphic, I have no idea. If this is the case the effort was close to nothing. Otherwise, the old argument: it's the devs' spare time, let them do things they like from time to time to keep motivation high.

I am no graphic designer, but from what I've heard so far, I'd say such a temporary solution is too much effort for the result. I mean, we already have the player lookat. One click (or two for looking closely) and I see if this char wears armour or not or shorts or a robe or whatever. This is already engine supported. The player lookat IS the temporary solution. But no new graphics were necessary.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:36 pm

@pharse: why didnt you just told us? if you dont have the time...maybe another dev has it? maybe just for the fun? just to keep the motivation high?

Julius · Post by **Julius** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:27 pm

The objection that if someone has a block in hand it can't be a baby is ignorant at the least. I'm sorry.

But it's true. The game isn't about the object you have in hand, it's about the #me. If are able to do a rather.. good one that states there is a baby in your hand, I don't care how many times a engine rper examines you and sees that stone, you have a baby in your hand.

I love you Drathe, but this seems pointless.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:45 pm

the baby will never replace a #me. its just to indicate the child! otherwise we could replace your shirts, trousers and everything else with stones...you could #me them! or beer for example!

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:51 pm

We have snowballs?

Here's the main problem.

Scripting a baby as you said would take absolutely no work. at all. for the dev at least.

The person who has to do the graphic has the work.

Personally I made a few suggestions which I would have worked on myself, problem was....

*drum roll*

no graphics.

Kranek · Post by **Kranek** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:53 pm

ok i'll try to make a simple one...

Rhianna Morgan · Post by **Rhianna Morgan** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 7:07 pm

Thank you, Kranek!

Faladron · Post by **Faladron** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 11:21 pm

Guess what people, there's a huge difference in roleplaying something
(such as carrying a baby around), or having something supported by the engine and graphics of a game.

The first happens at the sole discretion of the players involved, the later... well the devs of a game have to take up the responsibilities for including something like that into the game (hot-coffee-mod anyone?).

Hypothetically speaking:

You have an item labeled "Baby" to carry around. You can "drop" it, threaten it with weapons or toss it away somewhere. Will the item baby then rot? Will it die of starvation? Or should it give an auto-emote every once in a while "#me screams and sobs loudly" that grows weaker and weaker over time until the baby dies? I think not.

Do you know what happens to games that make it possible for you to commit (engine-graphically supported) violence against small children?

They get rated M for mature content (see Fallout 1 or 2 for reference, especially the part about them taking out children graphics).

Regarding Illarion, including such a "feature" would go against the recently set agenda "we want to get younger players and outlaw mature content on the server" by the staff and thus I think it's highly unlikely something like that will be implemented.

Llama · Post by **Llama** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 11:30 pm

You also have cute little bunny graphics which you can slice with blades, explode using spells or zap them to death with lightning

Post by **Nitram** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 12:36 am

And you get a baby by buying it at the price of 50copper from the stork NPC.

You know I think as well to include such a graphic is really... pointless.

To include this we would have to make a few entries in the database and a cliient update. And those client updates, are as you maybe noticed quite rare this days since nop left into inactivity again.

Also such a baby graphic, would cause that the client needs more RAM to work (pretty pointless way of wasting ram I think)

So why don't you just write.

#me has a baby.

Nitram

Drathe · Post by **Drathe** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 10:40 am

Ok some very fair points. (Faladron) Thanks for looking it over though folks.

NightHawk · Post by **NightHawk** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:09 am

Nitram wrote: You know I think as well to include such a graphic is really... pointless

and a snowball isnt? You wont make "pointless" babies yet you will make Snowballs? are they more important?oh my gosh he has a snowball hes a god! Ew he has a baby kill him.

AlexRose · Post by **AlexRose** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:56 am

Yeah, but wheras babies suck, snowballs r teh kewl.